Home Mobile Forum News Cookbook FaceBook Us T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising Live Chat  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides MotorsportAds MotorsTV (Sky 447)  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Yesterday, 11:27 (Ref:3721126)   #271
knighty
Veteran
 
knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
England
Essex
Posts: 1,221
knighty should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridknighty should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
A very good report on Hondas situation by Joe Saward......lightweight components = low stiffness = vey low natural frequency = severe vibrations within the working rpm range of the motor.......I'm betting Honda built a super lightweight crankshaft, probably formed by laser-sintering, so could be wafer thin wall section, but subsequently very flexible = vibrations

https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2017/03/17/lets-be-sensible-about-honda/

.
knighty is offline  
Quote
Old Yesterday, 12:06 (Ref:3721135)   #272
F1Guy
Racer
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Antarctica
Posts: 111
F1Guy should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Honda F1 chief Yusuke Hasegawa has apparently just announced that Honda are now working on yet another new engine!
F1Guy is offline  
Quote
Old Yesterday, 12:08 (Ref:3721137)   #273
VIVA GT
Subscriber
Veteran
 
VIVA GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
England
Leicestershire
Posts: 2,742
VIVA GT has a real shot at the podium!VIVA GT has a real shot at the podium!VIVA GT has a real shot at the podium!VIVA GT has a real shot at the podium!VIVA GT has a real shot at the podium!
Quote:
Originally Posted by F1Guy View Post
Honda F1 chief Yusuke Hasegawa has apparently just announced that Honda are now working on yet another new engine!
Oh blimey!
VIVA GT is offline  
__________________
Incognito: An Italian phrase meaning Nice Gearchange!
Quote
Old Yesterday, 13:09 (Ref:3721156)   #274
knighty
Veteran
 
knighty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
England
Essex
Posts: 1,221
knighty should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridknighty should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by VIVA GT View Post
Oh blimey!
lets be honest, what else could they have been working on!......also McLaren have more to lose than gain by driopping honda, we are talking hundreds of millions of lost revenue if they ditch Honda, which could easily bankrupt McLaren as a company, hence its worth fixing
knighty is offline  
Quote
Old Yesterday, 14:19 (Ref:3721184)   #275
Richard Casto
Subscriber
Veteran
 
Richard Casto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
United States
Durham, NC, USA
Posts: 1,993
Richard Casto is going for a new world record!Richard Casto is going for a new world record!Richard Casto is going for a new world record!Richard Casto is going for a new world record!Richard Casto is going for a new world record!Richard Casto is going for a new world record!Richard Casto is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by F1Guy View Post
Honda F1 chief Yusuke Hasegawa has apparently just announced that Honda are now working on yet another new engine!
Well, the way you say that it sounds as if they just dumped what they have now in the trash and are starting with a blank sheet all over again!

Assuming we are looking at the same articles, they are going to be releasing a revised version of this engine somewhere around Monaco. And, IMHO that is pretty much to be expected. You have a series of fly away races in which McLaren is generally stuck with the current spec (+/-). I would actually be shocked if a revision wasn't arriving around that time (or earlier if Honda is able to make it happen that fast). This is actually good news. So no need to invent additional drama.

Quote:
Originally Posted by knighty View Post
A very good report on Hondas situation by Joe Saward......lightweight components = low stiffness = vey low natural frequency = severe vibrations within the working rpm range of the motor.......I'm betting Honda built a super lightweight crankshaft, probably formed by laser-sintering, so could be wafer thin wall section, but subsequently very flexible = vibrations

https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2017...e-about-honda/

.
The regulations fix some dimensions of the crank such as main and rod journal diameters (actually sets minimum sizes). So I believe that attempts to prevent small cranks, but doesn't require them to be solid. I have read elsewhere about the potential for a hollow crank to reduce weight.

I have also read speculation about a different firing order and/or aggressive cylinder deactivation (run as V4 at times) causing problems. I wonder if part of this revision is to a different firing order (new crank and cam much like Porsche had to do with their LMP1 v4 after vibration issues when the engine was in the car for the first time) and I have heard that maybe the cylinder deactivation can be mostly solved (or reduced) by mapping changes.

Lastly, while Joe Saward gets on my nerves at times, that article is a healthy dose of reality. Especially around the implications of McLaren dumping Honda during 2017 season (highly unlikely). That is exactly the reasons I predicted in the time capsule thread that they would remain partners for 2017.

I tend to believe Honda will get this right, but the question is how deep into the season will it take. Even now, we are seeing McLaren run FP1 and FP2 without the types of failures they had in pre-season testing. Granted, they are likely restricted by specific boundaries (lower revs, etc.) that will limit performance. I expect the immediate goal (using the engines they have at the moment) is to get laps and ensure the cars finish races. The first race or two may be nothing more than extended test sessions for McLaren to make up for lost time.

Richard
Richard Casto is offline  
__________________
Money can't buy happiness, but somehow it's more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than a Kia.
Quote
Old Today, 00:21 (Ref:3721296)   #276
wnut
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 5,983
wnut should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridwnut should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridwnut should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridwnut should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by knighty View Post
lets be honest, what else could they have been working on!......also McLaren have more to lose than gain by driopping honda, we are talking hundreds of millions of lost revenue if they ditch Honda, which could easily bankrupt McLaren as a company, hence its worth fixing
There is nowhere for McLaren to go, this says it all really, no works engine, no chance:

Since the new 1.6-litre V6 Formula 1 engine rules began we have seen Mercedes win 51 of the 59 Grands Prix. Its customers have won 0 victories. Even when the Mercedes team has messed up, others have beaten the customer Mercedes teams.


Also I feel pushes the point that the engines should all be homologated, and the works should not be allowed to run anything in a different spec from their customers.

Last edited by wnut; Today at 00:31.
wnut is offline  
Quote
Old Today, 05:26 (Ref:3721337)   #277
Adam43
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
Adam43's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
European Union
The Road to Rouen
Posts: 30,245
Adam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameAdam43 will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
With the exception of the special year old Ferrari deal they can't.

Mercedes have been better than most in engine parity with customers even before the current regs.
Adam43 is offline  
__________________
The engine is shiny.
Quote
Old Today, 07:54 (Ref:3721359)   #278
GTRMagic
Race Official
1% Club
 
GTRMagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Australia
Sell me this pen....
Posts: 41,067
GTRMagic is going for a new world record!GTRMagic is going for a new world record!GTRMagic is going for a new world record!GTRMagic is going for a new world record!GTRMagic is going for a new world record!GTRMagic is going for a new world record!GTRMagic is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by F1Guy View Post
Honda F1 chief Yusuke Hasegawa has apparently just announced that Honda are now working on yet another new engine!
I bet the one in my Accord could last a whole grand prix.
I also bet the one in the back of the McLarens this weekend may not.

Wonder how much the team might buy my car for?
GTRMagic is offline  
__________________
Hey, Santa! Wanna party?
You can kill the dreamer, but you can't kill the dream
In memory of now
Quote
Old Today, 10:23 (Ref:3721382)   #279
F1Guy
Racer
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Antarctica
Posts: 111
F1Guy should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTRMagic View Post
I bet the one in my Accord could last a whole grand prix.
I also bet the one in the back of the McLarens this weekend may not.

Wonder how much the team might buy my car for?
Is it a V6 Accord? Maybe a quick engine swap overnight and hope the FIA don't notice.

Oh, and careful with the jokes GTR. The glum and depressed will point out that that it just isn't funny.
F1Guy is offline  
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
McLaren & Honda back together Alfaholic Formula One 162 8 Jul 2014 21:46
HONDA CIVIC 2013 vs HONDA ACCORD 2000 iceman-1987 WTCC & European Touring Car Series 8 27 Mar 2013 10:29
[Rumours] McLaren and Honda Back Again? Paradise City Formula One 101 4 Feb 2012 01:18
Hayden to Honda GP, B Bostrom to US Honda - Confirmed racer69 Bike Racing 6 16 Sep 2002 05:24


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 19:35.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2016 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.