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Old 25 Mar 2013, 18:09 (Ref:3224569)   #101
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Originally Posted by Pingguest View Post
However, I do not see any reason not to get rid of pit stops and thereby mandating tyres to last the entire race.
If there is no necessity to change from one compound of tyre to another, then you wouldn't get the variations in car speed that we see during the races. With harder tyres you are much more likely to give the advantage back to those teams that have the greater amount of downforce. Harder tyres are less likely to wear significantly due to high amounts of downforce.

If you think that higher amounts of downforce is the holy grail of F1, fine. Give the teams harder tyres.

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Tyre management would still be an important skill, although in an ecologically more responsible way.
You are making an assumption about how long the tyres will 'actually' last for.

If the tyres were hard enough to last for two races, how would tyre management be a required skill if you get a new set of tyres for the next race? Pirelli are easily capable of making a tyre hard enough to last two race distances. They have stated this many times. We should remember that Pirelli don't need to make a quick tyre that lasts a race distance, as was the case in 2005. They only need concentrate on durability because they aren't in competition with another tyre manufacturer, and therefore they don't need to make a 'quick' tyre.

How could Pirelli make a race tyre that lasts long enough for one race distance without it favouring one or two teams over the other teams? The only real way it could do that is to make a tyre that lasts for significantly more than one race distance. Consequently, the skill required to look after the tyres would not be necessary.
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 19:49 (Ref:3224616)   #102
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its all well and good to say tire preservation is a desirable skill set but that argument goes out the window when the rules let drivers who fail to make Q3 start on whatever compound they want to.

in fairness more of the blame lies with the rules makers rather then on Pirelli, but to be honest, how many people really place a priority on tire management when only a small handful of us think the Q3 tire rules are completely ridiculous?

for me having to see top qualifiers pit after only a handful of laps early in the race is further evidence that Pirelli have gotten the balance wrong this year. not so much questioning their philosophy of the tire construction but rather am still questioning its application.

change the Q3 rules, make every compound available at each event, and no rule about using a set of each on race day.
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 21:23 (Ref:3224658)   #103
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The tyres and all the talk that goes with them is becoming a complete bore..Yawn
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 22:29 (Ref:3224716)   #104
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Mind you, nothing's gonna change...
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 23:56 (Ref:3224755)   #105
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Originally Posted by chillibowl View Post

for me having to see top qualifiers pit after only a handful of laps early in the race is further evidence that Pirelli have gotten the balance wrong this year.
Perhaps not qualifying on that particular tyre would be a benefit?

Pirelli did offer to make a tyre specifically for qualifying. The teams declined the offer.

http://www.espn.co.uk/f1/motorsport/story/56469.html

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change the Q3 rules, make every compound available at each event, and no rule about using a set of each on race day.
Agree....sort of.
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 02:38 (Ref:3224802)   #106
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Mind you, nothing's gonna change...
I meant by the way the chit chat from the teams and Pirelli rather than our posters who are welcome to talk it into oblivion...
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 11:41 (Ref:3224933)   #107
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I meant by the way the chit chat from the teams and Pirelli rather than our posters who are welcome to talk it into oblivion...
Certainly they are !
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 12:49 (Ref:3224988)   #108
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In short: If you want Red Bull to unleash all of their performance, then Pirelli should give them what they want: A tyre that allows their car to annihilate the field. The only thing that is stopping Red Bull from doing that are the Pirelli tyres. Even when they complain about them, and they were the only team that did, they still finish a very convincing, if controversial, one-two.
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 14:04 (Ref:3225041)   #109
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In short: If you want Red Bull to unleash all of their performance, then Pirelli should give them what they want: A tyre that allows their car to annihilate the field. The only thing that is stopping Red Bull from doing that are the Pirelli tyres. Even when they complain about them, and they were the only team that did, they still finish a very convincing, if controversial, one-two.
So, basically it's a RBR season again !
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 14:20 (Ref:3225045)   #110
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So, basically it's a RBR season again !
That depends on them getting the best out of the Pirelli tyres, which is why they are whinging about them blunting the performance of their car.
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Old 29 Mar 2013, 17:53 (Ref:3226494)   #111
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They should build the car to the rules they have.
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Old 29 Mar 2013, 18:17 (Ref:3226511)   #112
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They should build the car to the rules they have.
I'm so glad that the regulations, and specifically the tyre ones, are not completely favouring the team that probably has the most downforce. If they did, then we would be in for a lot of races where we see a finger being pointed at the sky.

Red Bull knew that this seasons tyres would probably be softer than last seasons tyres, and certainly before the end of last season. But now they complain that their car has so much downforce that it's wrecking the tyres. Well, if your definition of the best car is one that has the most downforce, then yes, you may have a valid claim, but F1 is not about having a car with the most downforce.
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Old 29 Mar 2013, 18:43 (Ref:3226530)   #113
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change the Q3 rules, make every compound available at each event, and no rule about using a set of each on race day.
I agree, or I was also thinking of letting each team choose what two compounds they want to use, and still require them to use a set of each.
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Old 29 Mar 2013, 22:10 (Ref:3226634)   #114
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Now this is Marbot's private thread.
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Old 29 Mar 2013, 23:37 (Ref:3226664)   #115
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Old 30 Mar 2013, 01:51 (Ref:3226692)   #116
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Today I listened to The podcast from Motorsport, if you are interested in hearing an educated opinion on the subject of tyres, and other things..

Then listen here.. http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/f1...-lee-mckenzie/
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Old 4 Apr 2013, 12:52 (Ref:3229074)   #117
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Looks like Pirelli are going to be reviewing their current tyre compounds after Bahrain

http://www.formulaspy.com/topnews/27...tyre-compounds
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Old 4 Apr 2013, 14:05 (Ref:3229119)   #118
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As usual, Pirelli running the show.
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Old 4 Apr 2013, 14:17 (Ref:3229128)   #119
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As usual, Red Bull running the show.
Fixed
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Old 4 Apr 2013, 14:22 (Ref:3229133)   #120
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Fixed
Totally agree, Are Red Bull becoming the new Ferrari?
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Old 4 Apr 2013, 15:18 (Ref:3229151)   #121
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I guess they are now for 3 years at least...
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Old 5 Apr 2013, 15:46 (Ref:3229564)   #122
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If there is no necessity to change from one compound of tyre to another, then you wouldn't get the variations in car speed that we see during the races. With harder tyres you are much more likely to give the advantage back to those teams that have the greater amount of downforce. Harder tyres are less likely to wear significantly due to high amounts of downforce.

If you think that higher amounts of downforce is the holy grail of F1, fine. Give the teams harder tyres.



You are making an assumption about how long the tyres will 'actually' last for.

If the tyres were hard enough to last for two races, how would tyre management be a required skill if you get a new set of tyres for the next race? Pirelli are easily capable of making a tyre hard enough to last two race distances. They have stated this many times. We should remember that Pirelli don't need to make a quick tyre that lasts a race distance, as was the case in 2005. They only need concentrate on durability because they aren't in competition with another tyre manufacturer, and therefore they don't need to make a 'quick' tyre.

How could Pirelli make a race tyre that lasts long enough for one race distance without it favouring one or two teams over the other teams? The only real way it could do that is to make a tyre that lasts for significantly more than one race distance. Consequently, the skill required to look after the tyres would not be necessary.
I never proposed or supported the standardization of tyres, did I? With non-spec tyres having to last the entire race distance we will definately varations in race strategy and thus pace, although not artificially created.
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Old 5 Apr 2013, 16:05 (Ref:3229572)   #123
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As usual, Pirelli running the show.
I don't think that the Pirelli tyres are favouring any team.


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Fixed
It will be if Pirelli are forced to change their tyre compounds because Red Bull and a couple of other teams cars have 'too much downforce'.

Oh, the irony.

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Totally agree, Are Red Bull becoming the new Ferrari?
I don't think that's ever going to be possible.
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Old 5 Apr 2013, 16:20 (Ref:3229577)   #124
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The 2013 tyres are a step to far in the wrong direction..

Please listen to Mark Webber on this subject, the man is right !
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Old 5 Apr 2013, 16:33 (Ref:3229584)   #125
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With non-spec tyres having to last the entire race distance we will definately varations in race strategy and thus pace, although not artificially created.
Where is the 'race strategy' if you don't stop for fuel or tyres?

If you're advocating for another tyre war, the 05 Indy debacle has thwarted that idea, unless you are thinking in terms of making the tyres last for multiple race distances with a penalty for changing the tyres prematurely.

If you're the sole tyre supplier, then there is no such thing as a 'race distance tyre'.

If Pirelli give Red Bull what they want, don't start complaining about how much Red Bull dominate the season. That car is punishing the current tyres because it has 'too much downforce'. I think we should all be grateful for that.
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