[LM24] Audi plans for 2010 revealed

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

In the broad sense

Then their not cast in stone ..... yet .

[mariantic]

Originally Posted by The Badger

As far as im aware , the 2011 engine regs have yet to cast in stone !!!

Badger, they were published by the ACO in November 2008

See press release below:-

http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/re...hybride_gb.pdf

There has been no indication that these have been or will be changed.

Mariantic

[chernaudi]

Only reason why I see that Audi may run the V6 is if they either make the 3.0 TDI V6 entirely out of aluminum(the block is steel) or due to possible packaging concerns with the KERS system if they use it, though the Pug Hybrid demo car was a 2007 908 with the standard 5.5 V12 HDI engine fitted with KERS.

Audi may run a V8 if they don't choose the KERS route-after all, it's a matter of manufacturing convience if they went the V8 route-the 5.5 V12 TDI was basically a 3.6 V8 our of the R8 with four cyinders added from a basic structure concept and to maintian the same capacity per cylinder(though bore and stroke were likely different from the R8's 85x79.2mm, and close to a square or slightly under-or oversquare similar to production VW/Audi TDI road car engines).

Also, Audi can take the V10(the V12 with the bore and/or stroke increased to get 5.5 liters instead of 4.8 liters) and lop off two cylinders and debore/stroke to get 3.7 liters. But it can also be argued that Audi can go a step further, since the LMP1 engines don't have to be stock block engines, which is being encouraged for the future LMP2 engines. But can the basic R8/R10/R15 engine block design take an other bore/stroke increase to get a V6 to 3.7 liters, or will Audi redesign the 3.0 TDI to use an aluminum block instead of the current steel block and modify it(like Chrysler's 6.0 V8) to be a stressed member?

Of course, this has no relevance to 2010, at least at the present time, but could some of the things areo wise being discussed for this car be tested on the R15, or vice versa?

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by mariantic

Badger, they were published by the ACO in November 2008

See press release below:-

http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/re...hybride_gb.pdf

There has been no indication that these have been or will be changed.

Mariantic

Ok ..... thanks . I wasnt aware the definative rules were fast and ironed out . Guess thats that then !!!

LM P1
Diesel
Diesel 3.7‐litre 8 cylinders with twin turbos
520 bhp
Petrol
3‐4 litre 8 cylinders normally aspirated
900 kgs
2‐litre 6 cylinders single turbo

Where does an Audi V6 Twin turbo fit into the above regs ? Seems to be a little inbetween the above catagories to me ?

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Ok ..... thanks . I wasnt aware the definative rules were fast and ironed out . Guess thats that then !!!

LM P1
Diesel
Diesel 3.7‐litre 8 cylinders with twin turbos
520 bhp
Petrol
3‐4 litre 8 cylinders normally aspirated
900 kgs
2‐litre 6 cylinders single turbo

Where does an Audi V6 Twin turbo fit into the above regs ? Seems to be a little inbetween the above catagories to me ?

How is it between categories? The cylinders are MAXIMUM number of cylinders allowed. If someone wanted to build a four cylinder, there are no rules against that.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Ok ..... thanks . I wasnt aware the definative rules were fast and ironed out . Guess thats that then !!!

LM P1
Diesel
Diesel 3.7‐litre 8 cylinders with twin turbos
520 bhp
Petrol
3‐4 litre 8 cylinders normally aspirated
900 kgs
2‐litre 6 cylinders single turbo

Where does an Audi V6 Twin turbo fit into the above regs ? Seems to be a little inbetween the above catagories to me ?

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

How is it between categories? The cylinders are MAXIMUM number of cylinders allowed. If someone wanted to build a four cylinder, there are no rules against that.

It is also the maximum capacity allowed for engine size (L).

Or in other words, In the broad sense!





L.P.

[The Badger]

V6 single turbo the rules say ..... Audi wants to build a V6 twin turbo , thats how inbetween the rules .

I pointed out the rules dont seem to be cast in stone ..... and they certainly appear that way to me .

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by The Badger

V6 single turbo the rules say ..... Audi wants to build a V6 twin turbo , thats how inbetween the rules .

I pointed out the rules dont seem to be cast in stone ..... and they certainly appear that way to me .

That is for a Turbo Petrol engine!!!



L.P.

[The Badger]

Ok

[cmk]

An interesting little insight into how Audi relates with its 'retired' drivers from Emmanuele Pirro's comments on his endurance seat with Drayson Racing in 2010: 'I would also like to thank Audi for giving me the permission to drive for Drayson Racing.'

I understand why Audi wants to put some youth into its prototype lineup but it's also really nice to see them both providing a chance for those older drivers to drive in Audi cars (the R8 GT3) and letting them go enjoy a chance to drive prototypes with privateer teams alongside that job.

[mariantic]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

How is it between categories? The cylinders are MAXIMUM number of cylinders allowed. If someone wanted to build a four cylinder, there are no rules against that.

Yes cylinders are maxima, the quote below sums it up nicley:-

"The technical definitions for the 2011 Le Mans 24 Hours concern 4 precise points:

- LM P1 and LM P2 engines: reduction of power, and cubic capacity reduction in LM P1 (diesel, 3.7-litre twin turbo 8 cylinders maximum instead of 5.5 litres, petrol, normally aspirated 3.4-litre 8 cylinders maximum instead of 6 litres, petrol, 2.0-litre turbo 6 cylinders instead of 4.0 litres), in LM P2 (diesel, 4.0-litre turbo 8 cylinders, petrol, 4.0 litres prepared on the basis of 2010 GT2, petrol, 4.5-litre series production). The minimum weight in LM P1 remains at 900 kgs and is increased from 825 to 900 kgs in LM P2.

- Hybrid systems aimed at reducing fuel consumption (free development in compliance with precise rules).

- Fuel tank capacities (75 litres instead of 90 litres for petrol engines, and 68 litres instead of 81 litres for diesels).

- Wheel dimensions unchanged in relation to the 2009 regulations)."

From Automobilsport 24.11.2008 - I think the story that these regs have "not been announced" has been confused with the changed aerodynamics regs and perhaps the need for some clarification on hybrids.

Mariantic

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by cmk

An interesting little insight into how Audi relates with its 'retired' drivers from Emmanuele Pirro's comments on his endurance seat with Drayson Racing in 2010: 'I would also like to thank Audi for giving me the permission to drive for Drayson Racing.'

I think we knew that Pirro was still under contract with Audi though, either for the GT3 programme or as a "brand ambassador".

[prototype]

Originally Posted by mariantic

Yes cylinders are maxima, the quote below sums it up nicley:-

"The technical definitions for the 2011 Le Mans 24 Hours concern 4 precise points:

- LM P1 and LM P2 engines: reduction of power, and cubic capacity reduction in LM P1 (diesel, 3.7-litre twin turbo 8 cylinders maximum instead of 5.5 litres, petrol, normally aspirated 3.4-litre 8 cylinders maximum instead of 6 litres, petrol, 2.0-litre turbo 6 cylinders instead of 4.0 litres), in LM P2 (diesel, 4.0-litre turbo 8 cylinders, petrol, 4.0 litres prepared on the basis of 2010 GT2, petrol, 4.5-litre series production). The minimum weight in LM P1 remains at 900 kgs and is increased from 825 to 900 kgs in LM P2.

Mariantic

To me this looks like P2s and P1s will be running really close together, especially on the tracks outside of Le Mans.

[mariantic]

Originally Posted by prototype

To me this looks like P2s and P1s will be running really close together, especially on the tracks outside of Le Mans.

Well, the ACP Press Release I linked to says the target HP for LPM1 is 520 and for LMP2 420.

So 100HP separation in same weight identical chassis (thinner tyres in P2)....

Getting OT I know, but anyone care to say what the power separation is at the moment between a median LMP1 & a median LMP2?

Mariantic

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by mariantic

Well, the ACP Press Release I linked to says the target HP for LPM1 is 520 and for LMP2 420.

So 100HP separation in same weight identical chassis (thinner tyres in P2)....

Getting OT I know, but anyone care to say what the power separation is at the moment between a median LMP1 & a median LMP2?

Mariantic

Well, I think just the release shows they will have seperation. Same weight, 100HP difference and better tires on the P-1.




L.P.

[CTD]

http://www.vagcars.dk/phpbb/viewtopi...=29163&start=0
Tom K, might show the first pictures of the R15+ next week!?

[Bentley03]

Endurance-Info.com have posted the first picture of the R15 Plus, a sort of official 'spy shot' released by Audi Motorsport. Doesn't give much away, does it!

[chernaudi]

It seems to back up info that Mulsanne Mike heard from some guys at Audi about the channel concept being modified, especially considering that the pontoon fenders have more of an R8/R10 like shape to them and that the side fence has been integrated to the main side pod. However, we probably won't know for at least a week plus a couple of days any more details, namely how the rest of the channel concept was dealt with.

[gwyllion]

The side pots have changed massively! They went for a more classical shape.

[chernaudi]

It would seem that Audi has either blocked the channels or have found a different way to use them. If the channel concept has been done away with, it will be interesting to see how Audi had blocked them off and if they haven't completely done away with it, to see how they are used now. But it does seem that the whole sidepod has been rebodied, especially outboard of the "old" sidepod area.

[HJJ]

I found this. It seems they are testing at Homestead (or that's what being reported).

In the latest saga of intrigue, gamesmanship and sending of messages through odd actions, we will indeed see Audi and Peugeot go head-to-head at Sebring next week in LMP1, albeit not during any of the official track sessions.

Audi’s new R15s, in its new ‘Plus’ configuration, will wrap up a test a Homestead-Miami this Saturday, then head to Sebring to prepare for a two-day test at Sebring on Monday and Tuesday.

The Mon-Tues test, organized by the Sebring track, rather than ALMS/IMSA, will see the R15s run in anger in full 2010 specification for the first time against many of their 24 Hours of Le Mans rivals, and particularly, the two Peugeot 908 HDi FAPs.

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...ple-stint-311/

[Acid09]

This is so incredibly childish I can't even find words to decsribe it.

If they have the cars there ready to be tested they can race them too! That's what Audi thinks of the fans, showing them their new car in practice and then leaving afterwards

Pathetic, a total dick move.

[MihokS5]

Originally Posted by Acid09

This is so incredibly childish I can't even find words to decsribe it.

If they have the cars there ready to be tested they can race them too! That's what Audi thinks of the fans, showing them their new car in practice and then leaving afterwards

Pathetic, a total dick move.

Just because the car is completed to ACO spec doesn't mean they have to rush to Sebring and race. This car has minimul testing at the moment, and would YOU go race your brand new car for 12 hours without knowing much about it? Come on now...

[merlot brougham]

Originally Posted by MihokS5

Just because the car is completed to ACO spec doesn't mean they have to rush to Sebring and race. This car has minimul testing at the moment, and would YOU go race your brand new car for 12 hours without knowing much about it? Come on now...

Come on now what? I couldn't agree with him more. Audi specifically stated that they could not have an R15+ ready for Sebring and Peugeot are dicks for not allowing them to compete with a non-compliant car. Now, we see that the R15+ is more than ready for Sebring but they won't compete b/c I assume they want to test more or don't want to show their hand.

I thought auto racing was for the fans? If there are no fans, no supporters, there is no auto racing. So this is how Audi treat their fans? Yikes, they could get real world data out of Sebring but they choose not to. I call all that a dick move fo sho....

[MihokS5]

Originally Posted by merlot brougham

Come on now what? I couldn't agree with him more. Audi specifically stated that they could not have an R15+ ready for Sebring and Peugeot are dicks for not allowing them to compete with a non-compliant car. Now, we see that the R15+ is more than ready for Sebring but they won't compete b/c I assume they want to test more or don't want to show their hand.

I thought auto racing was for the fans? If there are no fans, no supporters, there is no auto racing. So this is how Audi treat their fans? Yikes, they could get real world data out of Sebring but they choose not to. I call all that a dick move fo sho....

Its easy to point the finger from the stands, but if you were calling the shots for your raceteam-you would not be so quick to race your brand new car one of the toughest tracks for 12 hours without fully understanding it. This is why they struggled in Le mans last year-lack of knowledge of the car. The R15 plus just rolled out in Germany last Wednesday keep in mind