Klien may be replaced by Liuzzi?

Snrub · 22 Mar 2005, 18:20 (Ref:1259046)

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=32363
There is still talk of having Liuzzi replace Klien. What are your thoughts on this? To me Klien has been driving quiet well so I don't see the point. Not that it's fair to make harsh judgements, but Liuzzi has gone off in practice both races.

Side note: Apparently after making one of his qualifying runs DC radioed in and said "tell Christian to run more front wing." That is the kind of mentor a newer driver needs. Kudos to DC for being there for the team, I've gained a lot of respect for him this year.

Redlake27 · 22 Mar 2005, 18:27 (Ref:1259052)

Red Bull will gather enough data over the coming races to see whether Klien or Liuzzi is the better bet.

DC and CK have both driven very well, but if CK is to have a future in F1 he needs to blitz DC. DC has done a superb job this year, but he is an established benchmark. We all know that Mika and Kimi were quicker than DC, and every team is looking for the best.

If Liuzzi is the real deal, and his test times prove he is better than Klien, he will have a golden opportunity to benchmark himself against the known quantity of Coulthard. If Red Bull find they have a driver under contract who is consistently faster than DC, they may have found the next Kimi to either keep to themselves or sell on to Ferrari (in return for engines.....?)

Super Tourer · 22 Mar 2005, 18:27 (Ref:1259054)

I can't see the logic of it myself, Klein is doing a good job most improved driver of 2005 so far. Luizzi is fast, but as RBR seem to be going well as it I would have thought the old 'if it 'aint broke' motto would be pertinent.

Much of this comes from Marko I believe, who has the 'ear 'of team owner DM.

SetikX · 22 Mar 2005, 18:37 (Ref:1259063)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snrub

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=32363
Side note: Apparently after making one of his qualifying runs DC radioed in and said "tell Christian to run more front wing." That is the kind of mentor a newer driver needs. Kudos to DC for being there for the team, I've gained a lot of respect for him this year.

Do you have a source for that, if its true, kudos to DC. I always have respected him, but he has been born again in this RBR outfit. I dont very much if DC doesnt stay with RBR for another 3 years.

marcel82 · 22 Mar 2005, 18:45 (Ref:1259069)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snrub

Side note: Apparently after making one of his qualifying runs DC radioed in and said "tell Christian to run more front wing." That is the kind of mentor a newer driver needs. Kudos to DC for being there for the team, I've gained a lot of respect for him this year.

he did the same in Australia, he radioed in that T1 was a bit slippery as a warning for Klien

x_dt · 22 Mar 2005, 18:52 (Ref:1259079)

IMO both Klien and Liuzzi deserve to have full-time drives in F1. Horner remarks that "we do not want to lose Liuzzi" - is he suggesting that RBR will lose Liuzzi unless VL gets a chance to race very soon? Perhaps to Sauber?

**Adam43** · 22 Mar 2005, 19:16 (Ref:1259095)

I can understand how they want to get Liuzzi in the car, but it would be rather harsh on Klien to be replaced after a couple of good races.

Kicking-back · 22 Mar 2005, 19:20 (Ref:1259101)

Apparently the plan was to rotate them in three race stints

ralf fan · 22 Mar 2005, 19:21 (Ref:1259102)

Certainly Klein deserves a chance to go on after two good race....But I do suspect though that Liuzzi is faster than CK over a single lap...just a hunch though.

Knowlesy · 22 Mar 2005, 20:46 (Ref:1259171)

Klien was good last year IMO and he's confirmed my confidence in him this season so far. He's a good driver and is getting results. He also works well with DC.

Liuzzi coming in would be a shame for Klien. As much as I like Liuzzi (he was amazing in f3000 last season) I don't want to see Klien ousted. If he was underperforming, fine. But he isn't, so why drop him?

Off topic, but Mr Marko is getting on my nerves a great deal. This is the guy who threw a flip at Sauber because they chose to run Raikkonen instead of Bernoldi. Does he think he's God or something?

BootsOntheSide · 22 Mar 2005, 20:48 (Ref:1259172)

Klien has been faster than DC in qualifying so far, although this is perhaps down to DC's problems with one-lap qualifying runs. In terms of race pace he hasn't matched DC but has been quite impressive, although I know they were always planning to rotate the two drivers, so there isn't really a story here. The only issue is, who will eb the thrid driver in the races Liuzzi does?

Kicking-back · 22 Mar 2005, 21:02 (Ref:1259183)

DC's qualifying has been solid - he was ahead on the grid in Australia - and only a fraction behind in Malaysia - and as we've heard David is giving Christian help.

Scott Speed would likely be the third driver when Liuzzi races - although this may compromise his GP2 campaign.

ensign14 · 22 Mar 2005, 21:19 (Ref:1259201)

Quote:

Originally Posted by knowlesy

Off topic, but Mr Marko is getting on my nerves a great deal. This is the guy who threw a flip at Sauber because they chose to run Raikkonen instead of Bernoldi. Does he think he's God or something?

No, but he has an eye for a good driver.

(Ooh, I am SOOO heading for Hell tonight.)

Kicking-back · 22 Mar 2005, 21:25 (Ref:1259211)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ensign14

No, but he has an eye for a good driver.

(Ooh, I am SOOO heading for Hell tonight.)

I suspect your reference (black humour though it is) will be over the heads of many

Sodemo · 22 Mar 2005, 21:32 (Ref:1259216)

I think maybe RBR thought that Klien may mess up in the first few races, so then could be "excused" for replacing him with Rat Boy.
In reality, the opposite has happened, Klein has done very well, this makes it hard for the team to give him the elbow.

StickShift · 22 Mar 2005, 21:38 (Ref:1259225)

Indeed. I've felt that since Red Bull said they would share the ride, that they were just looking for a reason to drop Klien.

They haven't found that reason yet.

Testure · 22 Mar 2005, 21:41 (Ref:1259229)

Helmut Marko has wanted Klien out since Red Bull took over the team but was supposedly afraid of the reaction of the Austrian press. Now that Klien is performing so well (far improved since last year), surely he'd have the sense to let him show us how good he can really become? However good Tonio is (very, perhaps) and however much he wants to race (lots), spending his time right now testing and learning the tracks is a much better idea. Alas, common sense and Halmut Marko rarely meet. As knowlesy mentions, this is the genius that was so annoyed at Sauber signing Kimi over Bernoldi (!) that he had Red Bull sell their stake in the team.

I really, really hate seeing drivers jerked around like this. Very few are lightning-fast from their first race. We've seen too many that become stronger and stronger again after a couple of seasons to make this goldfish-like attention span of Red Bull acceptable...

ensign14 - ooooh, that's low

mac · 22 Mar 2005, 21:59 (Ref:1259243)

The answer is simple:

Let Liuzzi test all year and become au fais with all things F1. And guarantee him a race drive for '06.

Then either thank DC for his help and send him packing, or farm out Klien or Liuzzi to another team, maintaining an option on their futures.

The future for RBR is to have Klien and Liuzzi as team mates.

StickShift · 22 Mar 2005, 22:12 (Ref:1259251)

I'd suggest, that the future of RBR does not include both Klien and Liuzzi. Red Bull is going to put an American (Speed, probably) in a race seat as soon as he shows he is ready for it.

BootsOntheSide · 22 Mar 2005, 22:55 (Ref:1259277)

In the long term, Scott Speed will probably get a chance, although I expect he'll initially be third driver, either for the half-season Liuzzi is supposed to be doing, or for 2006. The idea of keeping Liuzzi in reserve and then farming one or the other of them out for 2006 seems to make the most sense - they still need DC's experience and skill.

joe rossi · 22 Mar 2005, 23:23 (Ref:1259300)

If it happens it will be very tough on Klien. He certainly deserves to keep the seat on his current form, and he won't be able to drive as third driver on Fridays either, so it's a double blow. I get the impression that the first tiny mistake he makes will have him shown the door, which stinks frankly. I think Luizzi should keep the test role for now to learn the tracks, but he obviously has a contract that guarantees him a race seat this year, or this wouldn't be an issue. Also there is no guarantees that he will be any better over a race distance, and who says he will get a better offer from another team this season? Sauber is only an assumption based on it being the only semi-competitive drive possibly available. Bearing in mind their rumoured car problems they would be better off with an experienced developer like Wurz or Davidson if he's available, not a rookie like Luizzi.

Dixie Flatline · 22 Mar 2005, 23:38 (Ref:1259315)

Yep, it seems that three into two (or four into two, if you include Scott Speed) does not go, and Klien will be left without a chair when the music stops.

For mine, it would be a poor man management decision though. If you don't perform in three races, you're out the door to let the next guy have a shot at three races. Klien has done very well, IMHO, in the first two races - certainly done enough to suggest he is learning the F1 caper quite well.

I'm reading bits and pieces of Martin Brundle's new book, and one comment he made in it struck me last night - no matter how well-attuned to a Formula 3 car the driver might be, there is always an extra element of surprise when driving a Formula 1 car. That was true back in the 80s - it's probably true now. So, IMHO, let Klien have the season in the RBR, allow Liuzzi to come up to speed by testing the RBR, and make a considered decision at the end of the season.

But then again, I haven't made a billion bucks, so what do I know?

joe rossi · 22 Mar 2005, 23:58 (Ref:1259338)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dixie Flatline

But then again, I haven't made a billion bucks, so what do I know?

Don't be so negative! I'm sure it's just a matter of time!

BSchneiderFan · 23 Mar 2005, 00:05 (Ref:1259344)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ensign14

No, but he has an eye for a good driver.

(Ooh, I am SOOO heading for Hell tonight.)

Sorry, took me a while to twig. I need to branch out.

(Think I may be seeing you in Hell...)

On the Klien/Liuzzi debate, was it not Mateschitz, presumably in part on the advice of Marko, who foisted Klien on Jaguar last year, when Purnell and Pitchforth wanted him to be third driver? Ironic, then, that Klien's drive is now under threat.

Kicking-back · 23 Mar 2005, 06:27 (Ref:1259480)

Everyone's seeing this as "Klien's drive under threat".

If both Klien and Liuzzi were told before the season started they'd be alternating the drive in three-race stints, it's not a problem.

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