[Rules] Driver Selection via a Draft

[chillibowl]

read this article/interview from Anthony Hamilton about the escalating costs of lower level motorsports and the lack of a clear category path leading to F1.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/m...-a7323951.html

ignoring the source (the writer but maybe also AH), many of the issues raised are ones that have been brought up before but near the end of the article he brings up the idea of introducing some sort of Drivers Draft concept...which is a concept i am familiar with but dont think i have heard it applied to the F1 ladder system before.

drafting the next generation of players is essentially the backbone of N.American pro sports leagues and with new owners on board and given the speculation that they may try to do things in a more 'american' way, this topic is not only relevant but an intriguing notion as well imo.

but there are no real details about how it would work and i dont really follow the junior categories so i dont know how viable of an idea it would be, however, being from N.America and seeing it in action, i think this is an idea which speaks to several of the issues raised about the ladder system and price tag to compete.

so the question for all is, would you be in favour of said idea? if so, how would you implement it? or if not in favour of it, then why not?



my thoughts, i envisage he is talking about a system similar to that of the NBA with athletes recruited out of high school to play in the the US college system and then then after playing as set number of years in college they are eligible to be drafted by an NBA teams (sort of in a reverse order to how they finished during the regular season).

there are also then provisions based on age for those that grew up outside of N.America and those who didnt blossom (or get their act together) during their college careers.

it works in bball because there are tens of thousands of kids going through the grinder all vying for 400 or so nba roster spots each season.

yes it leads to a constant and ever improving stream of new young talent but not sure it could work in a league that is only looking for 20odd drivers a season with only enough room for a small number of rookies each year?

[S griffin]

http://www.autosport.com/premium/fea...st-red-herring

Another opinion on the idea there

Personally it's not something I would propose, but it's an interesting idea nonetheless, the article in the post above mentions possible three year contracts to a team, which would end team and driver domination and also would mean more variety which is important. I wouldn't be against some form if they decided t give it a go

[BSchneiderFan]

It's more artificiality. Teams should be allowed to choose whom they want, for as long as they want.

[djinvicta]

In this day and age, for the lower teams, to keep them running, whatever a "driver can bring" moneywise talks..

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by djinvicta

In this day and age, for the lower teams, to keep them running, whatever a "driver can bring" moneywise talks..

That's a good point, although at least we haven't had any Lavaggi, Inoue or Ide types in recent years

[bella]

in fairness to aforementioned slowcoaches, if they'd had access to the self-improvement toys and sims drivers have nowadays they too could be as fast as carmen jorda.

in response to the original idea, i think it's a non-starter for f1, but it'd work in a one make series like formula e (i know it isn't really any more but). they could operate the same system for engineers too...

[Beryl]

It's a bit harsh to group Ide in with the likes of Inoue, Jorda and Lavaggi. I doubt any of those pay drivers would have been able to beat Andre Lotterer and Richard Lyons over a single seater season, nor would they be able to outclass Benoit Treluyer in the same team.

Ide was an awful F1 driver for whatever reason, but he wasn't an awful driver full stop.

[S griffin]

I just want to say that the problem with Ide was mainly due to a lack of the English language actually, according to the boss Aguri Suzuki

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by Beryl

It's a bit harsh to group Ide in with the likes of Inoue, Jorda and Lavaggi. I doubt any of those pay drivers would have been able to beat Andre Lotterer and Richard Lyons over a single seater season, nor would they be able to outclass Benoit Treluyer in the same team.

Ide was an awful F1 driver for whatever reason, but he wasn't an awful driver full stop.

I'd like to see Ide do that again in a different team

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by S griffin

...the article in the post above mentions possible three year contracts to a team, which would end team and driver domination and also would mean more variety which is important. I wouldn't be against some form if they decided t give it a go

yeah i didnt really get that part to be honest so didnt even address it. i guess it means every three years a driver would be traded to another team and if no trade is available they are out of F1?

for sure it would encourage variety (and would probably help us better compare drivers as we would see them in more teams competing against more team mates etc) but, as BSchneiderFan points out, a team should be allowed to hang on to a driver as long as they want. i believe that as well.

while he may dislike this analogy, but Kimi, for example, has value to Ferrari perhaps greater than his driving abilities or age. he is generally loved by that team and its fans so to see them hold on to his contract, perhaps longer that competitive ability would deem prudent, still has a tremendous amount of 'sporting value' to me.



getting back to the ladder system...a bit of a question here, is their a prize fund for GP2 winners? im sure there is a monetary prize but should their be a bigger prize (perhaps subsidized by FOM) that would be directly paid on their behalf for the F1 team that signs them in the following year? effectively allowing championship winners to play on a level playing field as well to do financed youngsters.

i suppose the licence points system addresses that issue but perhaps doesn't go far enough.

Originally Posted by bella

...they could operate the same system for engineers too...

a bit curious about what you mean by that bella.

if i am understanding correctly (or missing the point completely) i could see the value of engineers and mechanics moving around, sharing their set up knowledge etc....helps to equalize that playing field kind of thing?

could F1 benefit from that? a better selection process for engineers (would put upward pressure on wages if teams started trading personnel), would speed up the spread of ideas and cut down on development times/cycles, an end to gardening leave.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by djinvicta

In this day and age, for the lower teams, to keep them running, whatever a "driver can bring" moneywise talks..

it helps to keep them afloat for sure but no pay driver can bring in enough money to make one of the lower end teams competitive....unless they can come up with upwards of 150-200 mil a year....which will never happen and if it does would turn F1 into a laughing stock of the sporting world.

dont get me wrong i have a lot of love for the small teams and think the big teams spend too much money but allowing pay drivers to keep the smallest teams alive doesnt serve any real purpose other than allowing FOM to meet its minimum number of cars obligation.

while i agree with all here that a draft is not the way to go, there needs to be an alternative to allowing people to directly pay for drives imo.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

if i am understanding correctly (or missing the point completely) i could see the value of engineers and mechanics moving around, sharing their set up knowledge etc....helps to equalize that playing field kind of thing?

could F1 benefit from that? a better selection process for engineers (would put upward pressure on wages if teams started trading personnel), would speed up the spread of ideas and cut down on development times/cycles, an end to gardening leave.

I cannot see that ever flying.

Can you imagine, let's say, Mercedes allowing their engineers to work on their latest developments when they know that at the end of the year they will be working on their competitors' cars? What incentive would there be for any of the teams to participate, knowing that their best ideas would be on another team's car, who will have got the "inside knowledge" without having to pay the development cost?

[chillibowl]

nor can i see it flying either...cant imagine what shuffling around 1000's of employees and their families, often across cities or countries, would do to morale and F1's ability to find any staff willing to take a job with them.

but that aside they already operate under the parameters if ideas spreading to other teams. of course they try to delay another team from developing/copying their ideas via gardening leave and things like that but they cant stop the flow of ideas. no one can.

at best they hope to seek an advantage that lasts only a short time.

in fairness Merc were far better served at maintaining their design advantage via a rule freeze or (other teams) via having their competitors' new idea banned under the auspices of cost savings (RRA) then they ever were by preventing the free flow of ideas or labour.

they cant force a driver to sit out a season once their contract runs out...well Button aside but im not sure anyone is looking to steal Mclaren Honda's secrets at the moment.

[bella]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I cannot see that ever flying.

Can you imagine, let's say, Mercedes allowing their engineers to work on their latest developments when they know that at the end of the year they will be working on their competitors' cars? What incentive would there be for any of the teams to participate, knowing that their best ideas would be on another team's car, who will have got the "inside knowledge" without having to pay the development cost?

that's why i said it'd be fun in something like formula e, where the number of staff is strictly limited and the engineering teams are much smaller. never suggested it'd work in f1.

[steve_r]

I don't really get it.

When was top level Motorsport available to all these poor street urchins? - For ages it has been either drivers who have been supported by big sponsors, or nurtured / supported by an existing F1 team.

Nothing has changed and nothing is different to how it has been for donkeys years. Yet the article is written as if just a short time ago, someone with talent alone could rise to the top of F1 without huge financial assistance.

The era of the amateur gentleman driver passed by a long time ago.