Palmer - Page 2

**GTRMagic** · 23 Jun 2016, 00:39 (Ref:3654567)

Quote:

Originally Posted by chillibowl

dont know how accurate or what context these quotes were made or how seriously Renault would even take the offer, but apparently Horner/RB are offering up Buemi for a race seat.

Renault may find itself with a few solid options to choose from next year.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns34179.html

Sounds like they are trying to get rid of him?

BSchneiderFan · 23 Jun 2016, 12:01 (Ref:3654644)

It's a bit left-field, certainly. Even though he's only 27, I had rather assumed Buemi's Formula 1 days were behind him.

Not to be too cynical, but might Red Bull be trying to destabilise the Regie? Or are they honestly trying to help their engine partner? (Honesty! In F1!)

**chunterer** · 23 Jun 2016, 12:20 (Ref:3654655)

Quote:

Originally Posted by chillibowl

dont know how accurate or what context these quotes were made or how seriously Renault would even take the offer, but apparently Horner/RB are offering up Buemi for a race seat.

Renault may find itself with a few solid options to choose from next year.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns34179.html

The arrogance of Horner 'offering' Buemi to Renault!!!

I saw that the other day and was so off put I didn't bother mentioning it.

He doesn't need getting rid of because he has a prototype career now anyway.

BSchneiderFan · 23 Jun 2016, 12:32 (Ref:3654662)

To switch to anti-cynicism, if Red Bull really rate Buemi as a development driver, you can see an advantage for them in having him steer a Renault to drive the engine forward.

**bella** · 23 Jun 2016, 12:56 (Ref:3654670)

buemi, of course, drives for the brilliantly named edams in formula e who are running renault... thingies.

cds_uk · 25 Jun 2016, 14:21 (Ref:3655043)

I just can't see that happening, if they ditch Jolyon for anyone then it would be Ocon surely.

p-matt · 25 Jun 2016, 20:05 (Ref:3655099)

Remember Ocon is Mercedes'. They have first dibs on him.

I really think a perennial midfield driver like Perez, Hulk, Bottas, Grosjean, or even Sainz could do worse than to sign a long term deal with Renault. The Enstone/Renault combination went from midfielders to champions in five years last time. Those drivers' current teams will never be champions five years from now

**chunterer** · 26 Jun 2016, 16:19 (Ref:3655213)

Quote:

Originally Posted by p-matt

Remember Ocon is Mercedes'. They have first dibs on him.

I really think a perennial midfield driver like Perez, Hulk, Bottas, Grosjean, or even Sainz could do worse than to sign a long term deal with Renault. The Enstone/Renault combination went from midfielders to champions in five years last time. Those drivers' current teams will never be champions five years from now

So that little list of drivers are 'perennial midfielders'?!?

Seriously?

p-matt · 27 Jun 2016, 10:51 (Ref:3655367)

Quote:

Originally Posted by chunterer

So that little list of drivers are 'perennial midfielders'?!?

Seriously?

They shouldn't be - I meant perennial in terms of never having had a chance rather than lacking ability in a front running car

**chunterer** · 27 Jun 2016, 12:29 (Ref:3655383)

Quote:

Originally Posted by p-matt

They shouldn't be - I meant perennial in terms of never having had a chance rather than lacking ability in a front running car

Ahh! I thought that's what you meant

cds_uk · 5 Jul 2016, 18:23 (Ref:3657121)

What was the general opinion on Jolyon at the weekend then? To be honest i didn't get to watch the race as i was at Donington on Sunday, but again he matched Magnussen in Qualy and from what i have read regarding the race he seems to have been there or thereabouts aswell. Big weekend coming up for him though.

**chunterer** · 5 Jul 2016, 18:48 (Ref:3657127)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cds_uk

What was the general opinion on Jolyon at the weekend then? To be honest i didn't get to watch the race as i was at Donington on Sunday, but again he matched Magnussen in Qualy and from what i have read regarding the race he seems to have been there or thereabouts aswell. Big weekend coming up for him though.

Much much better effort and tbh looked like he had Kev rattled judging by the Dane's erratic antics!

vyselegend · 5 Jul 2016, 19:10 (Ref:3657133)

I think those of you bashing Palmer or Magnussen are clearly over-rating the current Renault RS16.

IMO both drivers are doing well, especially Magnussen who really matured since his Mac Laren days.

Don't forget Lotus were the ones developping the FRIC system initially, and when it was forbidden last year (intending to slow the Mercs), they were the ones paying the heavy price. Then, the team financial situation and it's future looking so blury meant the RS16 wasn't developped properly. It's a conservative design, which obviously doesn't perform well, in terms of pace and driveability. PU is far better than what is said (and never was a bad as advertised), even in pre-Monaco spec.

If you look at the car in the Barcelona race (which is arguably the benchmark track to rate a chassis), you'll understand why the drivers aren't reaching points on usual race week-ends. It locks up fronts everywhere, has correct traction but blistering the rears, but most of all it is sliding in every corner, litteraly destroying the tyres and generating moments of snap oversteer mid corner (from my amateur eyes it looks as if the chassis is too stiff). It looks a handfull to drive, at least as bad as the Sauber, worse than the Manor. Oh, and it is a bit slow on the straits (again, I'm not buying the engine being more than 20% of the problem here), whilst it is bad in slow speed corners...

You cannot properly rate a driver if the race car isn't at a decent level. Sadly the team doesn't plan to develop that car, which is understandable, so both drivers have to keep their head down and wait for next season.

Hawkwood · 6 Jul 2016, 17:31 (Ref:3657302)

Quote:

Originally Posted by vyselegend

I think those of you bashing Palmer or Magnussen are clearly over-rating the current Renault RS16.

You cannot properly rate a driver if the race car isn't at a decent level.

While I get what you're saying, I disagree with it.
In this situation (as in any other really), you can compare a driver to his teammate.

cds_uk · 10 Jul 2016, 14:28 (Ref:3658002)

Well, not sure he did an awful lot wrong this weekend either, ok the pen for track limits in qualy was a shame but come the race he was running comfortably enough in front of Magnussen until the pit stops, obviously we all saw what happened there and that was the end of that really, i am assuming it was a team mistake rather than a mistake by Jolyon, either way it was a bit of a mess.

peebee2 · 10 Jul 2016, 19:21 (Ref:3658125)

Telling people it is "unnacceptable" probably not helping him.

cds_uk · 10 Jul 2016, 19:56 (Ref:3658135)

Probably not the most advisable thing, mind you, it was a spectacular fumble by the pit crew.

vyselegend · 11 Jul 2016, 09:16 (Ref:3658254)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawkwood

While I get what you're saying, I disagree with it.
In this situation (as in any other really), you can compare a driver to his teammate.

Yes obviously, to some degree. But even then, you'll only determine which one is the best at coping with a bad car, which won't necessarly be the same who could achieve the best result with a championship contender in hand.

Plus, it might depend also of the nature of the car's weakness. For instance you could have a very fast driver looking awfull with an unstable car, because some fast drivers needs lots of confidence in the car to unlock their pace.

Remember those years when Honda was so horrible, Button didn't look much better than Barichello, but then with the Brawn GP he outclassed him consistently.

Paradise City · 11 Jul 2016, 11:12 (Ref:3658264)

An F1 rookie in a bad car is a test of nothing really.

ASCII Man · 11 Jul 2016, 14:51 (Ref:3658317)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paradise City

An F1 rookie in a bad car is a test of nothing really.

Didn't seem to stop Alonso in his Minardi way back.

Paradise City · 11 Jul 2016, 15:13 (Ref:3658323)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASCII Man

Didn't seem to stop Alonso in his Minardi way back.

Minardi was a no-pressure backmarker team, which built aerodynamically safe cars, where Alonso could ease himself into the role away from the spotlight.

That's not the conditions that prevail in the Renault works team 2016, that's for sure. Those guys wanna and expect to be winners tomorrow. Now that's real pressure.

**chunterer** · 11 Jul 2016, 15:29 (Ref:3658330)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paradise City

Minardi was a no-pressure backmarker team, which built aerodynamically safe cars, where Alonso could ease himself into the role away from the spotlight.

That's not the conditions that prevail in the Renault works team 2016, that's for sure. Those guys wanna and expect to be winners tomorrow. Now that's real pressure.

They aren't daft though - they know this years' package is a pile of....

They do not expect miracles from the current line up.

Next year will be a different matter though...

chillibowl · 11 Jul 2016, 15:53 (Ref:3658338)

im not sure what they expect from their drivers...maybe for them to be scapegoats?

BSchneiderFan · 11 Jul 2016, 17:47 (Ref:3658359)

We know from Red Bull's performance that the 2016 Renault lump is OK; not stellar, but it does the job. That leaves chassis and drivers. Given both Palmer's and Magnussen's junior careers, I'm going to point my finger at the hardware for now. Give Renault another year, then we'll see, and there should be nowhere to hide.

**chunterer** · 11 Jul 2016, 22:42 (Ref:3658427)

Sound post there.

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