Goodwood Revival

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by John Turner

Thanks for photos, John. I've also been watching with the excellent live streaming, although I still find it weird to hear my son's voice occasionally coming through the speakers!

I'm sure you are very proud, John! And no doubt you'll pick him up if he happens to make an 'historic' error....

That Maserati fist appeared a few years ago unpainted, or is it another one? I also remember the same or a similar car getting quite badly bent at the Revival. My favourite of that bunch of pics is the Costin Lister Coupe, although have to deduct presentation points for the modern mirrors!

Great pics, Brands! Thanks for sharing them.

[merak1974]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

I'm sure you are very proud, John! And no doubt you'll pick him up if he happens to make an 'historic' error....

That Maserati fist appeared a few years ago unpainted, or is it another one? I also remember the same or a similar car getting quite badly bent at the Revival. My favourite of that bunch of pics is the Costin Lister Coupe, although have to deduct presentation points for the modern mirrors!

Great pics, Brands! Thanks for sharing them.

I think the Maserati Tipo 151 that crashed at Goodwood some years ago (2012?) was a different one; an earlier car with a somewhat stubbier body work.

[John Turner]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

I'm sure you are very proud, John! And no doubt you'll pick him up if he happens to make an 'historic' error....

That Maserati fist appeared a few years ago unpainted, or is it another one? I also remember the same or a similar car getting quite badly bent at the Revival. My favourite of that bunch of pics is the Costin Lister Coupe, although have to deduct presentation points for the modern mirrors!

Great pics, Brands! Thanks for sharing them.

Mike, unlikely, as his knowledge is far better than mine. In fact, his knowledge of racing events that took place long before he was born, is staggering.

The post birdcage Tipo 60/61 sports racing Maseratis, like the similarly rare Project Astons are enigmatic and have an interesting history which pays researching.

Many thanks to John for his usual excellent photos.

The cars and the racing were excellent and Lord March and his team did a super job again this year although since survival of the Revival remains a source of concern in the modern age, I still worry about the quicker races, and would still put a cap on the quickest lap times, thus dictating what cars were invited in.

The RAC TT Celebration, fabulous though the cars are, has become even more of a Cobra V E type arms race, and was a very unbalanced grid as a result. They certainly provide the intended spectacle and close racing but the casual spectator should be under no illusion that they represent anything that went on in the 1960s. The cars closest to original spec would be some of those toward the back of the grid. In period the quickest car there, all other things being equal would be the 250LM. I do wonder whether the Kinrara cars wouldn't better represent the original TT but I guess they then would be subject to 'development'.

However, that aside, it was a superb meeting, with some great driving and great racing in a variety of conditions.

[bauble]

The Maserati appears to be a reproduction of the 1965 Tipo 154 that was built for Lloyd Kasner for the Le Mans 24 Hour race, however, Kasner crashed it in qualifying and was killed. The car was a write-off, and the engine was later used in another model. There were several variations on the theme including a Drogo designed 'Breadvan' version.

[bauble]

The TT was won, of course, by Gordon Shedden after contact sent the Van De Garde Cobra off the road. On the live stream it looked like a racing incident, however, Shedden is a BTCC driver, and one does wonder ... just a little.
Cy Nical.

[midgetman]

Dear Cy. The problem with professional racing drivers is their absolute desire to win which puts them in positions where 'racing incidents' will occur. This is absolutely where Appendix K is not supposed to be, as it is a celebration of the cars rather than the driver.

If it had been say me at the helm, I probably don't have the resolve to be in a 'racing incident' in the first place because the pleasure of driving overwhelms the desire to win.

So I doubt whether Gordon sent Guido off "deliberately" but he probably put himself into a position where contact wad inevitable. There is a tiny difference between reckless and ruthless.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[Mike Harte]

It didn't seem deliberate to me. More of a case of two drivers racing at the absolute limit, with the cars fighting for a last piece of adhesion and often losing the battle. It appeared to me that at the time of the "kiss", both cars were struggling for grip, and it was an unfortunate incident.

[Cliff Ryan]

Whilst there's an element of truth in Max's words, I agree with Mike that this was a racing incident, as I seem to recall that both cars were slightly off line having lapped another car at that point and they were so close that they 'kissed' and Gordon Sheddon came off better. Having said that, I'm not sure if Max or I would have been in that position though?

I went to Goodwood yesterday for the first time in a few years, as nowadays I feel somewhat despondant afterwards. It is a wonderful spectacle, which like it or not is seen the pinnacle of Historic Racing in the UK, if not worldwide. However, as a mere mortal, the chances of me ever competing and being competitive at Goodwood get smaller and smaller, whilst the costs of the arms race multiply.

The joy from watching Chris Ward power-slide the E type around Woodcote on his way to pulling out a 10 second lead in his opening stint was immense. The paying public who were watching near me loved it also, most of whom go for the spectacle, which Goodwood delivers in bucketloads.

My old A35 was racing in the St Mary's Trophy and has been rebuilt into an A35 Academy car at not inconsiderable expense and completely changing it in the process, to the extent that we were unsure it's the same car.

[Cliff Ryan]

BTW I forgot to compliment Kevin Turner's commentary, not only was he knowledgeable, but he had chemistry with the others & was a good fit

[midgetman]

Cliff I am sure neither you nor I would be I that position and I mean because of the pro drivers' will to win rather than finances. Like many Weekend Warriors I am actually turned off by the antics of such drivers both at Goodwood and in their 'day jobs'. But that's the gulf that separates us. ..winners want to win, I want to enjoy myself. A winner will drive without compromise and the rest of us will back out.

That's not a criticism BTW but an observation of what it takes to be a successful racing driver, possibly in life. It looks like Historic Racing has chosen the pro driver course to thrive, and indeed it does. So who are we to complain as long as there are people prepared to finance it?

The big problem is the marker it lays down to the next generation. You only have to look at karting to see this, and I have actually heard the words "well that's what X did on telly last week" from a youngster who got a question wrong on his ARKS test!

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

[Cliff Ryan]

Max, your first paragraph says exactly what I was clumsily trying to convey.

[gary396]

Out of interest, did anyone notice any obvious changes safety-wise following the incidents at the Members Meeting earlier this year? E.g. any additional spectator access restricted areas or was the tunnel uncovered section (which I think featured in one of the MM crashes) subject to any additional measures?

Just wondered....

[zefarelly]

All of the incidents happened at St Marys and Lavant, plenty of space and no spectators to hurt.

Not sure how they did it but it worked.

Originally Posted by gary396

Out of interest, did anyone notice any obvious changes safety-wise following the incidents at the Members Meeting earlier this year? E.g. any additional spectator access restricted areas or was the tunnel uncovered section (which I think featured in one of the MM crashes) subject to any additional measures?

Just wondered....

[brands]

I did notice the CotC handed out time penalties and points to a couple of drivers. Resulting in a loss of a win in one case (Madgwick trophy). Mind you that move at the chicane was never going to end well.

[rbm]

Originally Posted by gary396

Out of interest, did anyone notice any obvious changes safety-wise following the incidents at the Members Meeting earlier this year? E.g. any additional spectator access restricted areas or was the tunnel uncovered section (which I think featured in one of the MM crashes) subject to any additional measures?

Just wondered....

there was an extended mesh roof on the tunnel

[bauble]

Racing incident or nudge? My suspicions were raised by Gordon's somewhat smug smile when being interviewed at the finish. No contrition either. I remain unconvinced it was purely accidental.

[Lancsbreaker]

Just seen this posted on Facebook.

Seems like corporal punishment needs reviving, too:

Goodwood Revival Crime Update:
15 drivers tents and 10 public tents slashed and victims robbed while they slept (wallets, iPhones and Rolexes targeted) plus 5 Winnebagos broken into and similar losses reported.
PLUS Porsche's Miami Blue 911 press car stolen.

[terence]

I wonder who the low lives could have been.

[nicanary]

Originally Posted by terence

I wonder who the low lives could have been.

I was walking round the track near the start/finish line one day, and passed two young men and thought at the time " they don't look right" , although it's not correct to be judgemental.

Both dressed in black t-shirts and jeans, tattooed arms and lots of heavy gold jewellery. Speaking in Eastern European language. It just seemed to me that they weren't the type to be there for the racing. Whoops - being judgemental.

It does make you wonder whether they had tickets or had found alternative access, or whether the takings for the day outweighed the cost of entry. Or perhaps they really did love to watch A35s racing.

[Moosehead]

I looked into the pricing for camping in my (old) Winnebago at Goodwood at few years back............I thought I was being robbed

On another note, A35 Racing - I'm not keen on any form of one make racing but personally I'm unsure of the wisdom of creating a series for supposed novices using cars that fall over very easily (not just GW, I've seen them do it elsewhere) and engines that apparently don't last very long (I've not really heard this before but the GW commentry implied this).

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by Moosehead

On another note, A35 Racing - I'm not keen on any form of one make racing but personally I'm unsure of the wisdom of creating a series for supposed novices using cars that fall over very easily

That's why they have round roofs.

[TimD]

Regarding new safety measures, there was indeed 10ft of sturdy mesh roofing over the entrance of the spectator tunnel. Nicely blended in, landscaped and painted the same off-white as the rest of the pit straight, if you didn't know, you would never have spotted it.

There was also a little reprofiling of that end of the start-finish grandstand enclosure. The disabled viewing area has been pulled slightly closer to the startline and has more fencing on its leading edge. As a result, the access to the right hand side of the grandstand behind the police display has gone, and you can only get to it by walking the length of the grandstand and up the steps opposite the March enclosure.

A minor inconvenience, but hopefully effective should there be another "hundred year" incident. ( I still think it was the fault of the straw bale on the grass run-off, but anyway... )


On Shedden v van der Garde, this happened right in front of us, and while it was a bit of a late lunge, there was a gap for the E-Type when the Cobra went wide after passing the Corvette. Where it all went wrong was when Shedden's inner front clipped the grass and unsettled the car. Now, whether that gap was over-optimistic in a Historic Racing context is arguable, but I really don't think that contact was the intended outcome.

Incidents and weather notwithstanding, I thought 2016 was one of the most consistently enjoyable Revival meetings of recent times. And being handed an early Christmas present of MM75 tickets on the Sunday morning just keeps the addiction topped up.

[Peter Mallett]

Hopefully we get an invite for the 75th MM and we'll see you there.

[DAYTONASME]

As someone, who's bedroom posters included the 1979 Lloyds and Scottish Historic Championship, and having been to all bar two Goodwood Revivals; my own view is the racing was amongst some of the best I've witnessed from "behind the fence", for many years.

Tom Kristensen's mastery of a Ferrari 250 SWB, Rob Huff's pace in the Lotus 19 Oldsmobile and Tiff Needell "slithering" a Lotus 30, were my highlights.

There were more US visitors on track - Chris McAllister, Erickson Shirley,James King, Joe Colasacco...

..less damaged "metal", and overall..a better standard of driving, and I too am unconvinced about Shedden v van der Garde.

The Maserati discussed previously was built by Hall & Hall for Barrie Baxter, and wasn't the same car (owned by Laurence Auriana) which Derek Hill "crunched" at a previous Revival.

Overall, totally agree with a previous "post" about some great racing...

[Duddha]

A great Goodwood Revival, 10 years after my first one and great to be assisting the mother racing a Lotus 23B like in 2006. She did well, came home safe, car in one piece and without a spin in the pouring rain! Happy days.

On the driving standards, having assisted to the "opening briefing" and the officials having made it clear it was a non contact sport, it was well enforced up to a certain point.

In my own opinion, whatever the policy is, if applied, it has to be fair, square and equal to all people involved. To me, the Shedden move on Van Der Garde wasn't treated fair. There might have been a gap but to my own opinion, it should have been penalised as for some other moves.

Hope I'll be racing in the 23B next time, I've been waiting too long