2017 World Rally Championship

[WolfsburgRS]

It's interesting that Ogier almost seems to apologize for winning at the end of the Monte. I don't doubt that he wants to win, or enjoys it, but it seems he's conscious of the fact that if he wins all the time it's not as enjoyable a series for some of the fans. (variety is good / makes it more interesting)

[chunder]

I don't think he is going to be as dominant as he was before, he was in by far the best car before, hence Jaro and Mikkelsen mostly podiuming behind him if they had no issues.

Tanak and Meeke were getting close on some events last year and it looks like Hy und Drai have made a step too, so praps it might be closer.

But, like Loeb, he is good everywhere.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by chunder

I don't think he is going to be as dominant as he was before, he was in by far the best car before, hence Jaro and Mikkelsen mostly podiuming behind him if they had no issues.

Tanak and Meeke were getting close on some events last year and it looks like Hy und Drai have made a step too, so praps it might be closer.

But, like Loeb, he is good everywhere.

I'd largely agree with this - if Neuville hadn't broken his suspension on day 2 then Ogier would have been a distant second place. If Tanak hadn't been running with half an engine he'd have been right up there with Ogier as well. We didn't really get to see the pace Meeke had so I'm not entirely sure where the Citroen is relative to the others. The Toyota looked reasonable but not earth shatteringly quick. It was quite odd in some respects - Neuville was flying, Sordo looked to be struggling (Paddon didn't do enough to give us any clues). Ogier, Tanak and Evans looked quick, Meeke looked quick while he lasted, Lefevbre quick a times but inconsistent, both Toyotas also showed turns of speed but didn't look to have enough about them to challenge.

I think it's going to be a few more rounds before we get a real idea of how the cars stack up in relative performance but it certainly looks a lot closer and that can only be good.

[S griffin]

It was certainly a good new start at Monte Carlo and while it was the same name at the top, at least he wasn't dominant from the beginning and certainly it seems like there will be several contenders for the title this season

[chunder]

I would not be quick to judge Toyota, to me JML was looking to be driving well within himself, hopefully given a mission to get to the finish and accumulate as uch data as possible.

A sensible approach, as long as Toyota have not put win this year stuff on to the team.

I would think Hyundai are very much on that deal now, as their effort is high budget and costs. Citroen looked pretty slow actually, but not really the best rally to judge

Most boring colour scheme aswell, I rather like the others.

I think Elfyn suffered on the Dmacks on snow according to other sources.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by chunder

I would not be quick to judge Toyota, to me JML was looking to be driving well within himself, hopefully given a mission to get to the finish and accumulate as uch data as possible.

A sensible approach, as long as Toyota have not put win this year stuff on to the team.

There was an interview with Makinen in which he was saying that 2017 is a learning year and 2018 is when they'll be looking for wins/titles. I think given how little testing JML and Ogier had in their respective cars they did remarkably well.

Originally Posted by chunder

I would think Hyundai are very much on that deal now, as their effort is high budget and costs.

Hyundai were hard to judge - Neuville looked very quick and in his hands the car looked to be well sorted. Sordo didn't look comfortable all weekend and Paddon binned it early so we don't know how he'll get on. But I agree - this is Hyundais best shot at the titles.

Originally Posted by chunder

Citroen looked pretty slow actually, but not really the best rally to judge

Most boring colour scheme aswell, I rather like the others.

Citroen were another that's hard to judge - Lefebvre is inconsistent and Meeke binned it (again) so no real conclusions there. Not great that Breen didn't have a new car available - seems odd that Citroen couldn't get 3 together given their resources.

Originally Posted by chunder

I think Elfyn suffered on the Dmacks on snow according to other sources.

That seemed to be the case - although the smile on his face after one of the dry stages suggested that the Dmack softs were working very well!

[cg7aa]

Some reflections on the Monte after having the chance to watch the action again; first off, some pretty good TV pictures in the various highlights packages I've seen. I even dabbled with the highlights on Redbull TV, I hadn't realised Mark Webber featured to that degree in the coverage. He seems to be a genuine rally fan but then again, the bloke is genuine all round. Not bad.

I hadn't fully appreciated how much Neuville was in control of the rally until his mishap; very impressive. Similarly, Tanak was very impressive, the lack of grip didn't seem to faze him at all, he was chucking that car around. The stage times he was putting in on 2 cylinders was was something even if the worsening conditions helped his cause.

It was also nice to see some old faces; Hirvonen (working for Breen!), Lehtinen at Toyota, Kaj Lindstrom and of course Tommi! Everytime I saw Tommi, I was expecting the next shot to be an interview with McRae saying how tough Tommi will be to be beat on so and so event. It took me right back to the days of Top Gear rally on BBC2 TV with Mark something or rather. Great days...

I'm slowing building up a list of on-board footage I hope will be released online one day; I say one day, because it looks like official WRC are determined to hide these behind a paywall because as we all know, restricting access clearly helps grow the sport. I have Meeke at Ouninpohja 2016 on the list and I think I'm gonna add Elfyn and his couple of stage wins especially the one where he was clearly still buzzing from when interviewed afterwards.

It seems to me Hanninen has been around for quite a bit now and has had several opportunities but none have really stuck. Is this his last bite of the cherry?

There was one name missing from Monte that I completely missed until it randomly popped into my head, perhaps it's telling in a way that he wasn't there and wasn't even noticed: Ostberg. I suppose he's busy being a father now. All the best to him.

[tbtstt]

Originally Posted by cg7aa

There was one name missing from Monte that I completely missed until it randomly popped into my head, perhaps it's telling in a way that he wasn't there and wasn't even noticed: Ostberg. I suppose he's busy being a father now. All the best to him.

Ostberg has teamed up with Martin Prokop, they will both be running in 2017 specification cars in Sweden (and for the rest of the Championship).

[crossfades]

Only Østberg will compete in Sweden. Prokop will join later.

[BertMk2]

Sweden is up and running - Latvala out in front at the moment so it seems the Toyota does have decent pace. 4 different cars in the top 4 - so it looks again like there isn't a stand out car at the moment.

[crossfades]

Conditions are very odd on the second round of stages because of the historic rally. Quite a lot happening right now.

Going out myself later. Very excited to say the least!

[tbtstt]

Pleasantly surprised by the pace of the Toyota: as a car that many (including myself!) thought was underdeveloped, it doesn't seem to be lacking pace in the snow.

Six stages in and it's looking close at the front: great stuff!

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by crossfades

Conditions are very odd on the second round of stages because of the historic rally. Quite a lot happening right now.

Going out myself later. Very excited to say the least!

I'm so jealous! Enjoy it - Sweden always looks like a great rally to watch 'in the flesh'.

Originally Posted by tbtstt

Pleasantly surprised by the pace of the Toyota: as a car that many (including myself!) thought was underdeveloped, it doesn't seem to be lacking pace in the snow.

Six stages in and it's looking close at the front: great stuff!

Agreed - the Toyota is going well (or at least Latvalas is!). So far so good in terms of competitiveness - nobody is running and hiding which is great news.

[cg7aa]

Originally Posted by BertMk2

...nobody is running and hiding which is great news.

Maybe, but Neuville's pace is perhaps ominous for the rest of the season? He really seems to be on top of the car.

On a different note, Ostberg's wing-less near crash was heart in the mouth stuff. Phew!

[crossfades]

The sound on the new cars is more aggresive and more exciting to say the least. Was on SS9 Knon, the stage that got cancelled for the second run because of high speeds. In the distance you could hear the cars going flatout roaring on the straights.

Visually they are quite wide and looks a bit big. They seem to have good handling though. Several drivers have mentioned the aerodynamics and how a big part it is of the cars. Breen's front got some small damage on the front of a stage, not much, and he could feel it in the handling. Östberg even had to retire when he lost the rear wing ...

Latvala had two amazing runs in Likenäs before the last stage now, winning both times and adding 17 secs to his lead to a total of 20. The Yaris seems to be a very competitive car, at least here in Sweden and in Monaco.

[tbtstt]

Well I absolutely eat my words when it comes to the Yaris! I wasn't expecting the Toyota to even approach the podium in the first half of the season, let alone take a win!

The Fiesta continues to look the most delicate of the new cars and Neuville is surely going to be the one to beat: if he can keep it on the road!

[TF110]

Congratulations to Toyota for the win. I didn't expect them to be the front or near it, but Latvala put in a stellar last day taking all stage wins and the special. Should be a good season if they are legitimate contenders with the Ford and Hyundai.

[tyronnezx]

WOW i am plesently shocked by the results from the little Yaris. Superb job by Tommi, Jarri, Anttila and Toyoda and the team from Germany Finland and Japan

[BertMk2]

Great rally really pleased for Tommi Makinen that Toyota got the win - he'd taken quite a bit of flak pre-season so it's good for him to get the result (and Jari of course!).

I thought it was interesting again with the relative performance of the teams and drivers - Neuville looks to be the quickest but the other Hyundais are off the pace a bit. Latvala is looking like being miles ahead of Haninen (who seems to be attracted to trees) . The Fords look quite evenly matched but we have seen unreliability. Citroen look to have the slowest car (which I must say is a surprise) and both Meeke and Breen were saying there was "a lot of work to do". Ostberg looked to have reasonable pace considering he hadn't really had any running in the car before the rally - and I really liked how pleased he was with his jumps on Colins Crest, he was certainly enjoying himself!

[crossfades]

This rally was much about keeping it in the lines and having a more understeer driving style. If you went outside the lines there was no grip. Almost every driver said the same and they had a hard time keeping the rear in.

Where we stood Ogier went of the lines and immediately started drifting outwards for a bit. Hänninen was cought out too and hit the tree.

Neuville was so smooth and pretty much perfect throughout the rally. Tänak as well, although he had a more aggresive style.

I wonder though if the issues with the C3 were exaggerated by the conditions. They weren't that far off and Meeke could maybe have made the podium had he not went off. Keeping the rear in was something all the drivers had to deal with.

[GasperG]

How come Neuville was so behind in the last day stages? Was the car not completely sorted after accident on SS15 on Saturday? He lost more than 2 minutes on Sunday against Latvala.

[crossfades]

Originally Posted by GasperG

How come Neuville was so behind in the last day stages? Was the car not completely sorted after accident on SS15 on Saturday? He lost more than 2 minutes on Sunday against Latvala.

He saved his tires for the power stage.

[GasperG]

... and with saved tires still didn't beat Latvala on power stage, interesting.

[TzeiTzei]

Originally Posted by GasperG

... and with saved tires still didn't beat Latvala on power stage, interesting.

He drove the power stage much earlier.

[tyronnezx]

Originally Posted by BertMk2

Great rally really pleased for Tommi Makinen that Toyota got the win - he'd taken quite a bit of flak pre-season so it's good for him to get the result (and Jari of course!).

I thought it was interesting again with the relative performance of the teams and drivers - Neuville looks to be the quickest but the other Hyundais are off the pace a bit. Latvala is looking like being miles ahead of Haninen (who seems to be attracted to trees) . The Fords look quite evenly matched but we have seen unreliability. Citroen look to have the slowest car (which I must say is a surprise) and both Meeke and Breen were saying there was "a lot of work to do". Ostberg looked to have reasonable pace considering he hadn't really had any running in the car before the rally - and I really liked how pleased he was with his jumps on Colins Crest, he was certainly enjoying himself!

Yeah this is well interesting because after looking at pre season, the Citroen looked like the benchmark, especially on tarmac. The way that thing handled at corsica test was mind-blowing. The Toyota seemed slow through same sections in Corsica but they managed to find speed now. Then again this is a different surface compared to what we seen and you never know, the Citroen may bounce back. Im Impressed with Toyota regardless. If they keep this up, i would surely expect a goal change from a development year and the first podium goals in Argentina to perhaps contending for the championship in their first season!