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Originally Posted by Akrapovic
Remember: If DC started ahead of Hill, that isn't a lucky draw. That's he out qualified him, something he did quite a bit. And for sure you can accumulate points over your teammate by accident - for example, if your teammate has 3 car failures whilst leading, he loses 30 points (but only finished 20 behind his teammate...who gained points from his teammates failures, etc).
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Yes, I mentioned "mitigating" factors, but generally bad luck evens itself out, both teammates will get some bad luck over a season. Hill took himself out of three races and still finished ahead on points.
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Originally Posted by Akrapovic
Remember: If DC started ahead of Hill, that isn't a lucky draw. That's he out qualified him, something he did quite a bit.
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Well, in Spa 95 they were in 7th and 8th I think, which is basically a similar performance. It's not a big deal, it doesn't change what I said anyway, which is that Hill could charge when behind, he still went from 8th to 2nd, and even if Coulthard had got 2nd, he still would have went from 8th to 3rd. But that is only one race anyway, there was plenty of times when Hill charged, showing he could use the speed he had. My only point was that he clearly did have a good turn of speed, and his 21 pole positions and 22 odd race wins obviously can't all have been accidental. So even if you say "the statistics don't say it all" it doesn't then follow logically that the statistics always mean nothing. They mean a lot, when properly studied. Hill got plenty of wins and poles and he had a fast car obviously but they don't come by accident, you have to be capable to get them.
I think Hill proved he was a good driver, the statistics agree overall. It goes like this;
"If you get good points generally, you are good."
Note now two errors highlighted in red;
"if you don't get points you are a bad driver." (denial of antecedent fallacy)
"if you are good, you get good points." (affirmation of consequent fallacy)
But it does follow that if you consistently get good points, you must be good. And that was all I concluded, that Hill was a good driver who had moments of brilliance.
I never claimed that he was way better than Coulthard, or special. It seems to me you are bringing up Coulthard's performances a lot here, now, I am not sure why since I am not attacking Coulthard, I was evaluating Hill as a driver. I like David Coulthard.
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Originally Posted by Akrapovic
championship standings don't tell the whole story. But, they are the only thing that matters.
The 1995 championship tells you DH got absolutely humped by MS. It doesn't tell you that DC matched him quite a bit, but DH was capable of some amazing comeback drives
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Just for the readers knowledge;
I have never claimed that only the statistics for a championship, tell the whole story. That is a strawman fallacy, of putting words in my mouth. (and if you claim to not put that argument in my mouth then why even say, "championship standings don't tell the whole story."? Why say it or mention it, if I am not saying that to begin with? I am not claiming it's all about statistics, I am merely looking at the statistics and seeing when they are germane.
My claim is actually that statistics when they are significant, do mean something, they do count as evidence in support of a claim. THAT is my claim, my claim IS NOT that the position a driver finishes in tells you everything about their ability, and what happened in that season. But rather over two seasons Hill finished runner up in the championship, and beat both his teammates, which is a significant statistic which means SOMETHING. It doesn't mean "everything" but it also doesn't mean, "nothing".
Yes the statistics tell us Schumacher convincingly beat Hill, they also show Hill beat Coulthard.
I don't really see what Coulthard has got to do with my evaluation of Damon Hill as a driver, really I only made the point that Hill finished ahead of his teammates in those pivotal years of 95 and 96, which even if you ignore as a statistic, does count for something, because it at least shows he can't have been as slow as people say because he finished runner up in the championship.