ALMS LMP Grids for Mosport a joke

[SALEEN S7R]

Was just thinking people are always bagging the FIA SCC for having poor grids, well at the moment the FIA SCC grids are stronger than the LMP grids in the ALMS. Heres the test times for the ALMS at Mosport this weekend. http://www.crash.net/uk/en/news_view...id=9&nid=73933 Only 6 LMP 900 machines and 5 LMP 675 machines.

Something needs to be done with the ALMS to help it improve. Almost everyone I know in the USA when I mention the ALMS havent even heard of the series, it shoudnt be like this really, should it? The series needs to expand across the USA rather than just NA. So, do u think this is just a temporay problem and teams are waiting for the new regulations to come in so they can introduce new cars? Or is it bigger than that, particulary now the LMES is beginning?

Personally I think that the ALMS will improve, but only marginally as I think that the LMES is a more attractive option for the European car manufacturers and privateers. And lets face it, most of the car manufacturers building LMP cars, and privateers are Europeans. Not all of them I know, but the majority are. Your thoughts please.

[Chevyguy]

In order for ALMS to get bigger in the US, it will have to be force fed to race fans. The network coverage, while not anywhere near as good as Speed's, is probably the best way to pick up new fans. The problem here, is that the NASCAR fans think that's the only kind of racing. Sam Hornish has won two IRL championships. I was taking to some guys last night, and none of them ever heard of him. No one in the entire bar did. But, they all have their favorite NASCAR guy. When mentioning that there something besides NASCAR, they're all like, "nah, I don't like that Le Mans stuff." Have they ever seen it? No.

[Jay]

I'm fairly new to the series, but it seems to be growing. Exposure is the key...and it seems to be getting more of it here in Canada at least. It's never going to be like Cart or IRL...and let's not even think of Nascar. One of the largest differences is that people usually don't say 'so and so' won the race..they say 'Championship Audi' or 'AJR' won... so it's very difficult for drivers to get exposure. In fact, I don't think there's anything you can take from Nascar to this series.

I think the biggest strength of this series is the action that's created by having 4 different classes on the track at once. This makes the (albeit seemingly rare) battles within classes 10 times more exciting as they would be if the class was a alone. Obviously the classes need to get bigger...say at least 8-10 cars in each class. That'll happen over time. The grids can't be too large though if they're going to race at places like Trois-Rivieres and Miami...there just isn't room.

While not a lot of people have heard of the series, it's the kind of thing that when I describe to non-racing fans, their reaction is always 'Wow - that sounds cool!'...which I wouldn't get with Cart or F1... Good concept, huge markets, just need to get the word out. And in Canada at least, it appears to be happening...albeit slowly.

[vwpilot]

I think the LMP category of the ALMS is really in a holding pattern right now waiting for the new regulations to take affect.

I mean, why would someone spend a fortune purchasing a LMP car right now when it will be outdated in a couple of years.

The LMES will probably hurt as well. I was hoping that at some point we would see some of the European teams like Lammers' and the Pescarola team here in the states, but now with the LMES coming into play, that is very unlikely.

But we have to wait and see. I dont think it will go away, it is growing all the time and as I walk around Mosport this weekend it was completely packed today (Saturday) and I cant imagine what it might be like raceday. One of the more crowded races I have been to apart from Sebring and Petit.

I think that looks good for the series. I think the series is in better shape that some make it out to be right now.

[Garrett]

Well, one reason the grid is not a favorite at Mosport is because it is one of the smaller races on the calander for the ALMS. Compare the grid of Mosport to the one at Sebring, big difference. Also, the grid for the Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta will be larger because it is one of the longer, larger, more know race for the ALMS, But the grid sizes also has to do with the rule changes for 04 too. The teams are just testing this year, preparng for 04, which ever the teams are? So, don't get too bummed out, the grds will improve for next ALMS season!

[GP Racer]

Am I wrong, maybe I missed something, but hasn't the ALMS only run 2 races so far this season? And its the middle of August! I mean, come on, how can you build a fan base this way? Nobody knows when the races are on, and there are just not enough of them. This is no way to run and build a series. How long can you talk and debate about a series, as we do in this forum endlessly with the ALMS, without them actually ever racing? Boring!

A question, just what the hell do these teams and drivers do with all the "downtime" between the races!? Test?! How can they make money? People in this forum seem so pumped up over this series, and I just don't get it, because they only race once a month, if that!

People have been down on the Grand Am series and they don't talk much about the Trans Am series, but at least they race, and its pretty damn good racing to! If I try to talk to a NASCAR guy about sports car racing, it will be about these two series, not ALMS.

[SALEEN S7R]

Originally posted by GP Racer
Am I wrong, maybe I missed something, but hasn't the ALMS only run 2 races so far this season?

Yep u are wrong, the ALMS is now on round 5.

[RM40]

Originally posted by GP Racer
Am I wrong, maybe I missed something, but hasn't the ALMS only run 2 races so far this season? And its the middle of August! I mean, come on, how can you build a fan base this way? Nobody knows when the races are on, and there are just not enough of them. This is no way to run and build a series. How long can you talk and debate about a series, as we do in this forum endlessly with the ALMS, without them actually ever racing? Boring!

A question, just what the hell do these teams and drivers do with all the "downtime" between the races!? Test?! How can they make money? People in this forum seem so pumped up over this series, and I just don't get it, because they only race once a month, if that!

People have been down on the Grand Am series and they don't talk much about the Trans Am series, but at least they race, and its pretty damn good racing to! If I try to talk to a NASCAR guy about sports car racing, it will be about these two series, not ALMS.

Their are 3 races scheduled for this month alone. And their will be 4 races in 5 weeks after the Road America round. Infact, look how bunched the schedule actually is. The only "gap" in the schedule is between Sebring and the second round, partly due to Le Mans and partly due to Mexico and D.C. being cancelled, although D.C. was replaced with a race at Atlanta. I don't think the teams have much time to test at all, unless they skip around. Don't take this as an insult, I am just informing you of the schedule because you did not know yourself.

[FIRE]

Saleen S7R: You are right. The difference is that in ALMS there are (semi) factory cars. And there are also GT cars on the grid so the grid looks not "empty".
ALMS gets also much more media attention. In Europe each ALMS race gets an 1 hour coverage at Eurosport channel. The FIA SCC races get only a coverage of 15 min (!).

The ELMS will damage ALMS.

[GP Racer]

I guess I mis-spoke about the schedule,(dohh!) but I only remember one race in June, and one in July. I found the up-coming schedule, and your right, 3 races this month, one on national TV today. The gap was huge though, and I think thats where I lost touch with the series, also I had plans to attend the D.C. race and it got cancelled, hence my disappointment with the series.

No insult taken RM40, thanks for the info.

[vwpilot]

If you watched todays Mosport race I think you would undersatand why those that are fans of it are fans.

The LMP race came down to about 15 mins to go with the two Audis only feet apart until the Champion car caught a bad break while lapping a Porsche. And the GTS battle came down to the last lap and the Prodrive Ferrari was hounding the winning Vette.

A Porsche won GT again, but there was drama in that class all race long and a Ferrari 360 ended up on the podium again, its only time before they stand on the top step.

I can understand when people look at the results and see that an Audi a Vette and a Porsche all won again and they think boring, however, the road to those results were thrilling today, as often they are.

[Aysedasi]

Easy to knock on numbers alone, as I've said before.

I'd rather watch 11 LMPs than 111 911s......

[Dani Filth]

even 911 GT1's ...

[Aysedasi]

No, 911 GT1s would suit me far better......

[gttouring]

a bonus to grand am is that Trans am cars are eligible as GTS cars there, and since they only have SRP2 (some mangled version of LMP's) only Dp's are the 'big' class, but the racing is good. perhaps ALMS should offer more packages for potnential buyers and builders of LMP's by being a broker pf sorts...Lister chassis ok- AUDI motor ok, no? Elan motor ok...or use any compbination with the alms helping the deal, it seems as if the car makers are not too involved in finding buyers. evryone wants to build and run their own show

[SL]

Is this going to be on US TV ???

Please let me know channels and Florida times

Thanks

Simon

[noise boy 2]

Already was on, Sunday 2pm on NBC. Robert

[SL]

Aw, Sh1t.

Anything on TV this weekend coming ?

The way they were leading I thought it was 23/24 at Mosport

Simon

[Chevyguy]

15 minutes to go, huh? You could easily get a six pack and some beef jerky at the corner store in that time. I've just had an epiphony (sp?). Ive seen IRL and NASCAR races end by hundreths of a second. That's why Americans don't get sportscar racing, and why drag racing is so loved. To me, a thirty second margin of victory at Sebring is CLOSE, but I guess it's just not as exciting as trading paint across the finish line, which to me is immature.

[Liz]

NA$CAR people like to see large armorplated indistinguishable things repeatedly smash into each other until one of them crashes -- that is why they like NA$CAR and American Football. They also like the drivers to attack each other physically after the races. This seems to me rather childish.

Sports car racing requires a little bit of attention and reading up, and because there are driver changes it also requires learning the helmet colours so you can tell who is in the car. In other words, it requires you to think. This is what I like about it! When I interview the drivers I try to get at the man behind the Nomex and give the fans a reason to attend the autograph session and pick him out of the crowd. But the fact of the matter is that in the ALMS, the driver is not the most important part of the racing; the car is.

Someone pointed out to me this weekend that another thing that makes it hard for the casual fan is that there's no emphasis on "the championship" -- nobody knows how the points are scored, nobody really knows who is ahead at any point in the season. Americans don't care about the finer points of car racing; they only want to know who's winning. (Second place, they say, is just First Loser). If something could be done to make the championship standings more accessible, that could help promote the series, I think.

Nevertheless, on a weekend when there was every reason not to come out to the race we got more than 35,000 (a very European size crowd and excellent for Mosport) and they all seemed to be having fun -- across from the Media Centre on the front straight, people stayed in their seats from 8:00 a.m. Sunday morning til the end of the race, even when nothign was going on.

[Kurt Maxwell]

Poor stupid Americans. What a bunch of losers we are.

Imagine liking American football and close auto racing?

I'll bet you are glad that you moved to Canada,eh Liz.

[Tim Northcutt]

To Saleen:

I said exactly what you said to start this thread in my "Prototypes on Milk Cartons?" thread....

Entries have been a "pick and choose" by teams on both sides of the Atlantic this year....and there are lots of cars sitting in garages when they should be racing....

The ALMS fields have been thin on protos at Sonoma, Trois Rivieres and Mosport, and Road America has one more 675 than these events...that's it....the numbers have been anemic....

[Liz]

Originally posted by Kurt Maxwell
Poor stupid Americans. What a bunch of losers we are.

Imagine liking American football and close auto racing?

I'll bet you are glad that you moved to Canada,eh Liz.

Kurt darling, I said that NA$CAR people , not Americans, like to see things smash into each other until something breaks.

Believe it or not, there are vast millions of Americans who neither watch BAWL nor NA$CAR, and if both sank into the ocean tonight, they could still sleep peacefully tomorrow.

[the Farouk]

I agree with those who mention the rule changes. I talked with JJ Lehto (Champ Audi driver) and thats what he said, among other things. This is the transiiton period for ALMS just like it was prior to the AUDI r8r.

One thing I notice that is hard for most people to grasp is the concept of three classes racing at the same time. And mention Lemans to most people and they stare back at you with drool coming from the corner of their mouth.

[Liz]

I thought that when we got 5,000 channels of television and digital everything, this idea of producing everything for the Masses was supposed to go away. Why is it that any form of racing is considered "unsuccessful" unless the baseline "Masses" swarm to it? That isn't the way it works with anything else; you never see a "blockbuster" movie getting any of the top awards from Movie people, for example. And the literature that wins awards is never going to be "Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire" even if every person on earth ends up buying at least one copy of it.

Sports car racing at this level is never going to be a Mass Media Operation. And personally I think there are about enough people at Le Mans every year (something like 225,000 isn't it?) without adding people in John Deere caps looking for "Junior".