Brand Rivalry Over??

[FAS33]

to me the ford vs holden rivalry thing will sizzle off a bit with these new car brands entering, not much can be found from these cars from their road cars, except the badges (and a few door handles) with the COTF concept. I still think Chrysler are joining next year as well. so I guess its all about the drivers now, even though therell still be a lil ford vs holden thing, hell they even get it in NASCAR still lol, its still not going to be what it used to be, oh well. was some pretty good times.

this was a classic - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYZWMBY180A

[Oldtony]

Maybe the thread should be Brand Rivalry Spread.

[Umai Naa]

Not sure why people get so worked up over a $3 badge.

[FAS33]

not sure either why people get worked up over a sponsorship livery that was blurred off our tv screens either

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by FAS33

to me the ford vs holden rivalry thing will sizzle off a bit with these new car brands entering, not much can be found from these cars from their road cars, except the badges (and a few door handles) with the COTF concept. I still think Chrysler are joining next year as well. so I guess its all about the drivers now, even though therell still be a lil ford vs holden thing, hell they even get it in NASCAR still lol, its still not going to be what it used to be, oh well. was some pretty good times.

this was a classic - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYZWMBY180A

Reading this, I am not convinced that you get it.

COTF is designed to have a similar platform under the skin for all cars, to allow those cars to be the same in chassis, transmission & suspension.

Engines are sourced from the carmaker providing the bodyskin

The bodyskin is one of the popular models being sold locally or internationally.

What you seem to suggest is that the Mercedes V8Supercar doesnt look anything like the E class road going equivalent. Nor the Altima and its road going donor.

Which patently isnt correct!

While there can be plenty of noise around about production cars should do this or that, or that the better solution is the NZ Super Tourer technical regulations, V8Supercar is actually here to stay.. and while some people seem to come on here and are willing it to die (for what logical purpose escapes me), it isnt dead yet, and I suspect wont be for a very long time.

The sport frustrates me too, when they do things that are counter intuitive to me, but bringing in more brands will EXPAND the fanbase, not kill it.

If a Holden is good enough to win it will win. If a Volvo is good enough to win it will win. If a Mercedes is good enough to win it will win. If a Nissan is good enough to win, it will win. If a Ford is good enough to win it will win.

The very tight regulation of everything in these COFT provides the very best building block to let the car makers establish a connection to their car racing around the track, with their engine under the bonnet, while knowing that they cannot be out spent in designing chassis made from unobtanium... this is not a feature of the NZ Super Tourer class.

How nice would it be to see one of each of the carmakers in the top 5 at Bathurst with 10 laps to go, each with an equal chance of winning, the driving talent a large part of who ends up in what position, with their engines powering their S60, E Class, Altima, Falcon or Commodore towards the chequered flag

It could be here... it should be here... Bathurst 2014!

[bluesport]

Sounds nice, but most likely it will be T8 again, again and again.

[one five five]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

The very tight regulation of everything in these COFT provides the very best building block to let the car makers establish a connection to their car racing around the track, with their engine under the bonnet, while knowing that they cannot be out spent in designing chassis made from unobtanium... this is not a feature of the NZ Super Tourer class.

And what about a manufacturer that at some point decides to use the 'generic' V8Supercar engine? Will this still be in keeping with Mark Skaife's "manufacturer integrity" claim when the CotF format was first announced?

How did we let what was, even in the early days of the V8 formula, a production-aimed formula turn into what is effectively now a second Sports Sedan series? Why do we still have the Kerrick Sports Sedan Series now? The basis of the objective of the ruleset for both is now largely the same...

[JHamilton]

Ford sucks.











There is a little bit of hypocrisy if you reference my avatar.

[hdt05]

Well said gtr. If the good old days (early nineties) were so good, where was the support from corporate Australia? I sure don't miss seeing one make of vehicle being able to lap the majority of the field.

I don't miss seeing less than 10 competitive cars on the grid.

[FAS33]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Reading this, I am not convinced that you get it.

COTF is designed to have a similar platform under the skin for all cars, to allow those cars to be the same in chassis, transmission & suspension.

Engines are sourced from the carmaker providing the bodyskin

The bodyskin is one of the popular models being sold locally or internationally.

What you seem to suggest is that the Mercedes V8Supercar doesnt look anything like the E class road going equivalent. Nor the Altima and its road going donor.

Which patently isnt correct!

While there can be plenty of noise around about production cars should do this or that, or that the better solution is the NZ Super Tourer technical regulations, V8Supercar is actually here to stay.. and while some people seem to come on here and are willing it to die (for what logical purpose escapes me), it isnt dead yet, and I suspect wont be for a very long time.

The sport frustrates me too, when they do things that are counter intuitive to me, but bringing in more brands will EXPAND the fanbase, not kill it.

If a Holden is good enough to win it will win. If a Volvo is good enough to win it will win. If a Mercedes is good enough to win it will win. If a Nissan is good enough to win, it will win. If a Ford is good enough to win it will win.

The very tight regulation of everything in these COFT provides the very best building block to let the car makers establish a connection to their car racing around the track, with their engine under the bonnet, while knowing that they cannot be out spent in designing chassis made from unobtanium... this is not a feature of the NZ Super Tourer class.

How nice would it be to see one of each of the carmakers in the top 5 at Bathurst with 10 laps to go, each with an equal chance of winning, the driving talent a large part of who ends up in what position, with their engines powering their S60, E Class, Altima, Falcon or Commodore towards the chequered flag

It could be here... it should be here... Bathurst 2014!

woah where do I start, first of all Im not having a dig at the COTF's, but its true, only some pieces of their road cars can be found on the race cars, and I left it at that. And I agree with you about the Manufacturers, the more the better, but the rivalry between ford and holden will wear off imo. and thats what this threads about, I think the drivers will be more focused on rather than the car brands they're driving with 6 predicted for next year, pretty much thats the way in all the racing series. we just had more focus on the cars racing in past years more than anyone else, now it will be all about driver skill.

I can help you on why people come on here to talk V8SC to death, Tony Cochrane..enough said. but no matter what they say I think inside they'd miss V8 supercars if it were to go, increased crowds and tv ratings show the COTF concept is far from dying, quite the opposite really.

[chavez]

Originally Posted by hdt05

Well said gtr. If the good old days (early nineties) were so good, where was the support from corporate Australia? I sure don't miss seeing one make of vehicle being able to lap the majority of the field.

I don't miss seeing less than 10 competitive cars on the grid.

Are you seriously suggesting there are more than 10 competitive cars on the grid?

Sure qualifying times are close but the number of winners is no greater than the early nineties. Last year proved that and this year is starting to look the same.

Corporate support?

Leaving aside the cigarette companies who had their own agenda we had serious commitment from four oil companies (Shell, Mobil, Caltex & Castrol), four car manufacturers (Holden, Nissan, BMW and Toyota), Telstra, Tooheys, GIO Insurance and four tyre manufacturers Dunlop, Bridgestone, Yokohama and Toyo.

Having said that I've enjoyed this year, especially the new cars and look forward to Volvo joining next year.

I know it is popular to bash Group A but at there were some very good races and not so good races - just as there is today.

[hdt05]

Are you serious? We have had on my count 8 different winners this year already.

[hdt05]

Are you also saying that if they got rid of the control tyre, tyre manufacturers wouldn't be lining up to play?

[hdt05]

Getting backbon topic - I do think we will see the Holden vs ford rivalry fade.

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by hdt05

Getting backbon topic - I do think we will see the Holden vs ford rivalry fade.

It's virtually dead already, isn't it?

[chavez]

Originally Posted by hdt05

Are you serious? We have had on my count 8 different winners this year already.

I did say starting to look the same.

The start of the year brought a refreshing change with some new winners but now 888 is getting in its stride the rest of the season will be a different story.

[chavez]

Originally Posted by hdt05

Getting backbon topic - I do think we will see the Holden vs ford rivalry fade.

Sure, but Holden v Ford (prior to V8 Supercars) only really had the playground to themselves in '68 & '69 and them from '74 to '79.

The fiercest rivalry I saw was that between Moffat (Mazda) against everyone else or Nissan GTR v everyone else.

Both times it made Holden v Ford look tame.

[FAS33]

Originally Posted by chavez

Sure, but Holden v Ford (prior to V8 Supercars) only really had the playground to themselves in '68 & '69 and them from '74 to '79.

The fiercest rivalry I saw was that between Moffat (Mazda) against everyone else or Nissan GTR v everyone else.

Both times it made Holden v Ford look tame.

Nissan GTR's be like.......what rivalry??

to me thats just complete domination, nobody got close to them to get decent battles going, Ford and Holden make that look lame, actually makes all other aussie series look lame imo.

Ambrose and Murphy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coRdE9juqOc

[one five five]

Originally Posted by hdt05

Are you also saying that if they got rid of the control tyre, tyre manufacturers wouldn't be lining up to play?

chavez doesn't seem to be suggesting that at all, rather pointing out a fact that there was 4 tyre manufacturers pushing their product in the Group A era.

There were 4 tyre manufacturers pushing their product in the V8Supercar era as well.

There are some very 'defensive' comments going on here, are people trying to protect someones barrow?

Just because you say something positive about Group A does not automatically mean you are anti-V8Supercar

Originally Posted by FAS33

Nissan GTR's be like.......what rivalry??

to me thats just complete domination, nobody got close to them to get decent battles going, Ford and Holden make that look lame, actually makes all other aussie series look lame imo.

Ambrose and Murphy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coRdE9juqOc

There most certainly was rivalry between Nissan and the rest, most of it being off the track.

The same has always gone for Ford vs Holden as well.

You have made it quite clear your dislike for Group A (despite the fact that at the same time you admit you were not around for it), i'm not sure what your trying to prove with this post

[eduardo1]

Originally Posted by bluesport

Sounds nice, but most likely it will be T8 again, again and again.

Maybe we should get T8 to run one of each manufacturer. Then they could spread the wins around to keep everybody happy.

[fomoco]

As a Fordie for years, 1968 - I have in the past few years switched to Driver following. Still like my Fords, but like the drivers just as much. As for Brand loyalty, that went out years ago, as GMH and Ford lost control to their American Parent Companies. Even though we do know Aussie Auto Engineering is amongst the best in the world, we dont have control of our destiny, If we look back at , the GTHO, Manaro, Charger, era of Sports sedans, Group A, we built and took on some of the best, who remembers the the team that took a Commodore to Europe and came close to winning. Yet, over the years it has been more of this is what the yanks want and this is what you are going to do, Why kill the Manaro?

So I like a ford, but still follow drivers in Commys and Mercs and now Volvos.

A motorsport enthuisist

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by eduardo1

Maybe we should get T8 to run one of each manufacturer. Then they could spread the wins around to keep everybody happy.

Now you're thinking!.......you're an ideas man eduardo, an ideas man.

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by bluesport

Now you're thinking!.......you're an ideas man eduardo, an ideas man.

We had that last year. and especially in 2010

Would it not mean though that we are even more of a control chassis

[Axeman444]

they may have been built by 888, but they were definitely not run by 888

[rik]

Originally Posted by FAS33

to me the ford vs holden rivalry thing will sizzle off a bit with these new car brands entering,

Won't be much ford v holden rivalry next year if Ford don't renew their contracts with FPR!

I hope they do, but I suspect FPR will transform to another brand of car!