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20 May 2008, 10:28 (Ref:2207178) | #1 | |
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Has Vettel been humbled by Bourdais?
Bourdais has also made a few errors that have seen him in the odd gravel trap, but he seems to be doing a solid job and has the measure ever so slightly of the supposed "next big thing" Vettel.
Is this just a blip for Sebastian or do you think Sebastien will show him the way for the rest of the year? I'm aware we should try to avoid, for want of a term, 'over-analysing' or excessive scrutiny of drivers (of course we will analyse them, but I mean not trying to read too much into individual elements of a driver's performance). |
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20 May 2008, 10:53 (Ref:2207198) | #2 | ||
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I don't think that Vettel has been overshadowed but Bourdais has certainly shown that he is deserving to be in F1.
If anything, I think the powers that be at STR should be credited for signing two completely different yet complimentary drivers. The young lion and veteran racing driver are punching above their weight IMO. |
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20 May 2008, 10:59 (Ref:2207206) | #3 | |
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Toro Rosso have slipped back a lot compared to Red Bull though. Last year they sometimes beat them. This year, that's not anywhere near happening. I wonder if Red Bull no longer give them much assistance, whatever form that assistance may have taken.
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20 May 2008, 11:12 (Ref:2207216) | #4 | ||
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Toro Rosso has driven all the 2008 Grandprix so far with the 2007 car. When they get the new Red Bull chassis they will make some progress. It will be interesting to see which team will perform better as both teams have solid drivers. The only thing that is different is the engine. We'll see!
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20 May 2008, 13:23 (Ref:2207345) | #5 | |||
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I think Vettel is being humbled, but i dont think he himself would particularly car or even be aware. Bourdais will know that you get results by being there at the end of the day which could be his advantage right now. Vettel will still be learning alot, the races already completed and some of the ones coming up, he wouldve only done a handful of laps around. Bourdais is the same of course, indeed he's in a worse position perhaps only having driven at Barcelona previously. He's perhaps taking a more mature approach though. |
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20 May 2008, 11:17 (Ref:2207222) | #6 | ||
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I have been surprised at how Bourdais has out-raced and qualified Vettel a few times already, got to admit i expected a bit of a transition-period. They seem evenly matched, which is testament to both drivers' abilities. Now the new car is introduced it'll be interesting to see who comes out on top...
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20 May 2008, 12:35 (Ref:2207295) | #7 | ||
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OK, perhaps this is a silly question - but can someone tell me why Vettel is considered to be 'the next big thing'?
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20 May 2008, 12:41 (Ref:2207302) | #8 | ||
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Bourdais has been excellent it must be said. |
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20 May 2008, 13:20 (Ref:2207341) | #9 | ||
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I remember talking to a certain, very well known PR person who was working for BMW at the time, who is very close to Vettel commenting just a year ago at the Silverstone F1 test that SV had to win RWS last season otherwise his career really would be in trouble.
Fast forward a year and he's hugely hyped...interesting... |
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20 May 2008, 17:21 (Ref:2207576) | #10 | ||
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As for being humbled by Bourdais, it might be that people underestimated Bourdais. The typical "oh, he comes from one of those no-skill-required american open wheel series, so doesn't really have to be THAT good in F1" thinking could be proven wrong as far as his person is concerned. I wouldn't mind seeing him in a BMW for example. His personality and work ethos would fit right in and I think he could make the car really work. Should Heidfeld quit, Bourdais would fit right in for two years more. And the STR3 is going to be the RBR4 in Melbourne spec, so the chassis won't be as competitive as the current RBR one. |
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20 May 2008, 17:41 (Ref:2207596) | #11 | ||
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20 May 2008, 21:53 (Ref:2207826) | #12 | ||
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20 May 2008, 23:08 (Ref:2207860) | #13 | ||
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As I said, I wouldn't have been surprised had Bourdais been quicker. But there are certainly good reasons why it's not surprising that he wasn't, either. |
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20 May 2008, 13:26 (Ref:2207348) | #14 | ||
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Vettel has been really rather unlucky this season being hit when other people have made mistakes early on rather than it being his own fault.
I think it's best to wait until at least half way through the season before any judgments are made. |
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20 May 2008, 16:40 (Ref:2207526) | #15 | ||
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No he hasn't. He's 3-2 up on qualifying (reaching a later stage on each occasion), and the race results are skewed by Vettel having a first-lap engine failure and two first-lap crashes he wasn't to blame for. Bourdais has had a spin and two crashes (although he probably wasn't to blame for Spain). We won't really know which driver is better until the team has its new car, and we reach more circuits both drivers have previously raced at. It will be an injustice if Bourdais finishes ahead in the championship due to a reliable run in Australia.
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21 May 2008, 00:06 (Ref:2207887) | #16 | ||
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Bourdais drove brilliantly in Melbourne, and was pulling away from the Kovalainen/Alonso battle before his engine detinated. How you could begrudge him points earned from that drive is mystifying to me... Motor racing is full of instances like this - Webber owned Coulthard last season, but Coulthard ended up with more points. Coulthard is lauded for scoring Red Bull's first podium at Monaco - but many neglect the fact that his team mate Klien was in front of Coulthard when he was forced to retire. I like to think that most sensible people can look past the numbers on a piece of paper to find the real story. Anyway, these two have been pretty even so far this season. I don't think it is necessary to start proclaiming winners or humblings just for the sake of it - when they have clearly been quite level to date. |
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21 May 2008, 01:33 (Ref:2207919) | #17 | ||
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Yes, it is a bit early to say for sure who's doing the best, but speculation is our forte here on internet forums, where we convene to do just that This was one of the pre-season team-mate battle predictions I found harder to choose my answer for. I did say Bourdais. But perhaps by next year, Vettel will be the better of the two. |
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21 May 2008, 13:07 (Ref:2208279) | #18 | |
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I think we should let Vettel get past lap one before making a judgement on this.
Bourdais has performed as I expected, pretty well. |
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21 May 2008, 13:48 (Ref:2208307) | #19 | ||
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how can anyone tell how good Vettel is?
Has he made it to the second corner in a race yet? |
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22 May 2008, 08:15 (Ref:2208843) | #20 | ||
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All the same, isn't there a grand oul stretch in the evenings... |
22 May 2008, 13:16 (Ref:2209049) | #21 | |||
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22 May 2008, 20:39 (Ref:2209330) | #22 | ||
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All the same, isn't there a grand oul stretch in the evenings... |
21 May 2008, 18:04 (Ref:2208493) | #23 | ||
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A lot of people thought Vettel would walk Bourdais... so if anyone is humbled it should be those people?
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22 May 2008, 11:08 (Ref:2208954) | #24 | |||
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A lot of people seem to have got a bit overexcited about Vettel last season - I'm sure he's quick, but let's not forget that he's very young and has a lot of developing still to do. I think we'll see him improve over the course of the season, and in the end there might not be much to choose between the two of them. |
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22 May 2008, 20:58 (Ref:2209345) | #25 | ||
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On a side note: It also seemed odd that they would choose Monaco to introduce the new car but apparently the logic being, that in the transition more parts are now available for the new car, than for the old. |
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