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21 Dec 2011, 10:28 (Ref:3002600) | #501 | |||
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Griffin... really German, well, it has a G in it... Don't hate us, race us... if you're man enough. |
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21 Dec 2011, 20:37 (Ref:3002890) | #502 | ||
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Err, I was being facetious about Griffins nationality. Just have difficulty like you in saying I was wro.., I was wro...I was partially mistaken.
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22 Dec 2011, 09:51 (Ref:3003078) | #503 | ||
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GRM's #1 Supporter 2014 Bloody Volvo Drivers... |
23 Dec 2011, 13:34 (Ref:3003551) | #504 | |||
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I just hope the international teams that visited this year's Supercheap 1000 aren't expecting the same sized crowd - or any crowd at all - to turn up at the 12-hour. If the organisers had half a clue they'd follow the example of the Sebring 12-hour and run the race on Saturday. Then it could start at a civilised hour (eg. 10am), finish in darkness, and still give everyone a chance to return home for work on Monday. PS. Why is this thread in 'Australasian Touring Cars'? It's a GT race! |
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23 Dec 2011, 20:13 (Ref:3003689) | #505 | |||
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Perhaps one day when the GT guys realise all this infighting never helps anyone and the best way to attract the punter is to ensure good sized grids with the best cars in the country, not sitting in garages, it might become popular enough to warrant its own forum. To run a 12 hour race for GT cars at Bathurst with the many of the best local cars sitting at home is a shame. |
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"Your biggest auto race may one day become a Camaro playground", Chris Economaki, Bathurst 1979 |
23 Dec 2011, 21:24 (Ref:3003706) | #506 | ||||
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Quinn should kiss and make up with the B12 crowd and maybe even have his circus on the support for the 12 hour. After all, most of the punters who are in Adelaide the following week at the V8SC event will be taking the opportunity to do other things (merchandising, eating, drinking, perving ) when the Aus GT guys are out on track. |
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Go the mighty Flying Lizards "A good way to gauge the strength of your argument is to weight the quality of the rebuttals. Strong arguments have low quality rebuttals." David Heinemeier Hansson |
24 Dec 2011, 00:20 (Ref:3003758) | #507 | ||
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Obviously the closeness of both dates is not ideal for 2012 but I don't see why 12 hour is a competitor of the GT series.
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
24 Dec 2011, 01:44 (Ref:3003767) | #508 | ||
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In the future all effort should be made to achieve a date that gives at least a few weeks post or prior the clipsal event for teams to attend both events. |
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24 Dec 2011, 01:58 (Ref:3003771) | #509 | ||
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The Date was put back to fit bringing cometitors in after the 24hr Dubai.
Alter it to suit one and it affects the other. Choice is overseas or local entries with the shift forward of Clipsal because they are not going to the Gulf. Really the choice is developing GT in its own right or being a support event for V8SC. |
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24 Dec 2011, 03:38 (Ref:3003779) | #510 | |||
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24 Dec 2011, 03:56 (Ref:3003781) | #511 | ||
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Surely you'd have realised by now that the "Australasian Touring Cars" forum is a misnomer? Anything to do with motorsport in Australia gets discussed here, not just touring cars.
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24 Dec 2011, 04:06 (Ref:3003782) | #512 | |||
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The AGTC and the Bathurst 12-hour promoters are commercial competitors, so what incentive is there for them to "kiss and make up"? Sure it would be great to have a proper endurance round in the AGTC, but presumably it isn't commercially viable. The AGTC teams are free to enter the 12-hour, so the modest entry list suggests that many of them are voting with their feet for their own reasons. |
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24 Dec 2011, 04:08 (Ref:3003783) | #513 | ||
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How silly of me to take the forum categories on face value. Is it OK for me to start an openwheeler thread here too?
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24 Dec 2011, 04:58 (Ref:3003785) | #514 | ||||
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They are free to enter and I believe numbers are up in the GT classes for the 2012 event over 2011. |
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film |
24 Dec 2011, 05:34 (Ref:3003795) | #515 | |||
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The fact that both operate under a different ethos and serve different interests definitely complicates matters. The 12 Hour organisers have an obligation to provide a commercially successful, independent event (albeit with local governmental support). AustralianGT isn't (seemingly) operated with commercial success as its first and foremost priority (viability isn't to be confused with success). In addition, it's the established local platform for such machinery, and its existence is subsidised by far deeper hip-pockets. As it concerns the 12 Hour, the long and short of this is, AustralianGT (as a business entity) can afford to assume greater risk. Someone has likely weighed up the potential loss of local entries as a result of enacting a schedule conflict between the 12 Hour/Clipsal, and decided the net loss of competitors is reasonable. It's an unfortunate reality. As it turns out, certain people enjoy ****ing on another's parade. |
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24 Dec 2011, 06:54 (Ref:3003812) | #516 | ||
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B12 also contains Production cars and Invitational Touring Cars. Should they be discussed in the Sportscar forum with the GT competitors? Or maybe some commonsense should prevail....?
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24 Dec 2011, 07:32 (Ref:3003816) | #517 | |
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Has anybody considered that Tony Quinn and Aust GT are too closely linked to supercars as a support category, and that supercars may feel slightly threatened by the growth of the B12hr, hence be leaning on Quinn not to support that race. I certainly would prefer a form of GT racing with all it's various marques to become Australia's premier category.
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24 Dec 2011, 08:06 (Ref:3003823) | #518 | |||
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24 Dec 2011, 08:36 (Ref:3003829) | #519 | |
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OK, it was just a thought.........I know that he sponsors supercars and it seems strange that Aust GT is going to miss the biggest GT event of the year here in Oz (at Bathurst no less) because of a few laps at Clipsal where they are a minor billing.........that IS hilarious, they must be mental!!!
Last edited by bluesport; 24 Dec 2011 at 08:49. |
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24 Dec 2011, 10:01 (Ref:3003854) | #520 | ||
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I think that it's more to do with commitments probably made to a grid size for Clipsal & the difficulty in turning cars around very quickly after a 12 hour race for semi-pro teams, the high cost of doing a 12 hour race on top of a season's racing and lastly some dissatisfaction with the way the driver seeding rules were run at The 12 hour last year.
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24 Dec 2011, 10:06 (Ref:3003855) | #521 | ||
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24 Dec 2011, 11:29 (Ref:3003869) | #522 | ||
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24 Dec 2011, 12:16 (Ref:3003882) | #523 | |||
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A 12hr race for GT cars at Bathurst is a big deal, and any lack of support for the 12hr from local GT teams does reflect poorly on GT racing in Australia as a whole, irrespective of whether AGT management is involved or not. I don't see how the 12hr can survive for any lengthy period of time without the support of local competitors. Been done before, plenty of times |
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24 Dec 2011, 20:24 (Ref:3004008) | #524 | |||
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But it could also be said that there is no hope of GT developing beyond a niche support category without the Bathurst 12hr. The Series Prod group didn't get on board when given the opportunity and look where that has got them! |
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24 Dec 2011, 22:22 (Ref:3004032) | #525 | ||
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