Non-championship Indy race?

[IL LEONE]

Just heard news that the teams have provisionally offered to return to Indy this year, after the final race for a non championship re run. Will this be for free then?

[Gt_R]

I assume if it happens, then it'd be free for those who paid the ticket earlier. And it'd be fully held at the expense of the teams on their own.

Of course, some portion of the teams are not too supportive of the idea (ie Haug and BMW), but the team owners such as Frank believes its just right.

And it'd keep sponsors happy too. Just hope that it'd be shown on TV.

If they are really honest about wanting to make it up, then Michelin should also pay for the Bridgestone teams travelling expenses and invite them so as to make it a full grid. Not a parade to advertise Michelin tyres.

[gringottsdirect]

A post-season non-championship " event " at Indy on October 23 (?) is best abandoned pronto.
The best thing to do is refund ticket holders and offer them free tickets for a normal F1 USA Grand Prix for 2006 and leave it at that - which in itself is pretty outstanding.
A large proportion of spectators at Indianapolis travel from overseas to see a full F1 week-end - I can't see many making the effort for a meaningless PR event. I can't imagine it would appeal to most American F1 fans either.
Even if a full F1 grid could be assembled, including Bridgestone teams - it still wouldn't be the same as witnessing a GP. The costs involved would be high for the Michelin teams, whilst Bridgestone/Ferrari/Jordan/Minardi have nothing to gain from attending even at other's expense.
If it goes ahead - I foresee a cold dark rainy day, barely attended, with little or no benefit to anybody - least of all the fans or the Speedway.

Concentrate on ensuring a great F1 week-end next June/July instead !

[Gt_R]

Exactly what Indy boss thought. In his words, cut the gimmick, sort this year's problem, and ensure next year would be a good race.

Sounds like they're irritated with F1's talk. Show them the results.

[Rennen]

A non-championship F1 race at Indy is a GREAT idea!...surprised it didn't make it as a separate thread!

On a possitive note...Consider this...The Americans do 'BIG' events...their car races have points by the hundred and far more competitors EG. 40+ NASCAR's and 33 IRL cars for the Indy 500...So as this would be the last ever F1 race for those glorious whaling V10's how about the old 3 litre formula going out with a bang and swelling the grid to 30 cars made up with all those wannabe 3rd drivers in the spare cars...and make it a real 'end of an era show' that the Americans would apreciate and at the same time reward the unsung hard working test teams efforts.

Red Bull could run Scott Speed to add local interest...what do we think?

[Kicking-back]

Tony George has said it's not going to happen, so it's end of story, really.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Rennen

A non-championship F1 race at Indy is a GREAT idea!...surprised it didn't make it as a separate thread!

There you go...

[Menelaos]

If I were to decide I'd turn down the offer too. It's stupid in my opinion. People want to see a real race with people actually fighting over the title, not cars going round.

[Adam43]

IMO a real race is one where they are not worrying about a pesky championship. Why would cars "just go around"? There is less to lose - no worrying about points. They will just be thinking about racing.

[Hip Priest]

Originally Posted by Menelaos

If I were to decide I'd turn down the offer too. It's stupid in my opinion. People want to see a real race with people actually fighting over the title, not cars going round.

I heartily disagree.

Concerns about Championship postitions often hinder real racing. Non-Championship events used be to held fairly regularly up until the early-to-mid eighties, and the freedom from worrying about points allowed drivers to go hell-for-leather in pursuit of victory.

It also allowed teams to try out youngsters alongside their regular pilots.

I think it would be a smashing idea, but as mentioned earlier, it is unlikely to happen.

[Don K]

Originally Posted by Menelaos

If I were to decide I'd turn down the offer too.

I agree.
I'm also not surprised they turned the offer.
What exactly was the offer?

If the teams only offered to race for free: Who would pay for all the other costs and arrangements? Would the teams be paying the venue? Or would the venue be expected to do this for free? And what about all other people involved?
Would the teams be making all arrangements? Or would the track owner have to do that?
etc.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by gringottsdirect

A post-season non-championship " event " at Indy on October 23 (?) is best abandoned pronto.!

I recall when we were in those lucky days, Formula One cars raced at non championship races. Mostly in the UK. How anybody can say "stuff it I want my money back" is beyond me. You don't need the full grid you just need cars and drivers.

I agree that compensation is due to the Indy spectators but that is different to what is being offered here.

[Logrence]

It won't happen. But it's nice PR, though.

[RT]

It sounds a bit like giving the fans a nice cold bottle of dehydrated water if the weather got too hot.........

[Snrub]

As Kicking-Back mentioned Tony George has said he's not interested. I get the impression from his wording that he'd rather F1 took other steps to improve the post-USGP situation. The FIA refuses to take any responsibility for the whole situation, so I can see why he doesn't want to appear to willing to compromise. I think if proper steps were taken and TG could be satisfied and he was then offered a non-championship race he'd accept it. How would the costs be covered? F1 should pay for the costs although it sounds like the teams would be willing to pay for themselves. If that were the case IMO F1 should pay for Jordan and Minardi. Worst case scenerio a small ticket fee (say ~$20) to pay the speedway's operating costs would be acceptable.

IMO Tony George should put F1 through the ringer. He has the power in this situation. I think he should be making public statements condeming the FIA's unreasonable actions and thanking Michellin for stepping up to the plate and trying to make up for what occured.

[richard_sykes]

I think it would be a good way of saying sorry.

[BootsOntheSide]

Maybe they only put the idea forward as a PR stunt, knowing that Tony George was likely to say no. Ideally for the Michelin teams and the FIA, a US journalist will pick up this and spin it into a "Tony George doesn't care about the fans" type story. I can't imagine that the teams would have competed as aggressively or convictedly as for a normal World Championship race - tmes have cahnged too much from the days of regular non-championship events.

[curveball]

If this is a planned non-sanctioned race, then why worry about having it at Indy? I realize thats where all hell broke loose, but who wants to go see a race in Indy at the end of October? Brrrrrr!

It would likely just be the Michelin teams, so why not go somewhere else in the US, maybe run the Daytona track? Or some of the other sites that have been mentioned in other threads about a 2nd US GP. There's gotta be something in a warm area (Florida, California, etc) that would be a good draw IMO. And there need not be the FIA worries of proper runoff areas or pit complexes right, since its not a FIA sanctioned race? Just an idea....

[GP Racer]

Originally Posted by Snrub

IMO Tony George should put F1 through the ringer. He has the power in this situation. I think he should be making public statements condeming the FIA's unreasonable actions and thanking Michellin for stepping up to the plate and trying to make up for what occured.

I agree that TG should put F1 through the ringer, and I think he will, but TG is not a man that makes public pronouncements very often. He goes about his business in a very private, professional manner. I believe that Bernie is getting an earful from him right now!

One thing is certain, TG will never give away full control of the IMS to F1 again. If a USGP happens there next year, which IMO is still very iffy, it will be under completly different circumstances....

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Menelaos

People want to see a real race with people actually fighting over the title, not cars going round.

cars going round and round and round is exactly what people in the states want to see, but other than that i would have to agree that this seems like a pretty silly idea.
for no points the risk to the drivers and not to mention the amount of money needed to fly back out there for what would have to be a free race(free for fans and race promoters/IMS) is crazy. and then what happens if someone gets hurt or if mich. have a tire blowout on anyone of the 14 plus cars they bring? its like shooting yourself in the foot twice.
good intention bad idea!

[BootsOntheSide]

Having the race a weekend after the Brazillian GP would save on travel costs (actually, on a seperate note I'm a little bit surprised that they aren't planning to put the Mexican race alongside Brazil in the schedules, thus making for 2 double-headers), but there are still a lot of problems with the idea, although using it as a test of how F1 cars could handle Watkins Glen or Road America would be an idea.

[Snrub]

Originally Posted by GP Racer

I agree that TG should put F1 through the ringer, and I think he will, but TG is not a man that makes public pronouncements very often. He goes about his business in a very private, professional manner. I believe that Bernie is getting an earful from him right now!

One thing is certain, TG will never give away full control of the IMS to F1 again. If a USGP happens there next year, which IMO is still very iffy, it will be under completly different circumstances....

While I agree in principle to what you're saying, I think one of the problems with the FIA/F1 is their incredible stupidity and arrogance, hense why I didn't find the USGP situation at all surprising. (in fact in comparison it makes the past ~15 years of US OW situation look downright intelligent!) They'll continue to go on their marry way unless there is a serious threat to them. It's a public perception battle, so private condemnation will not force the Max and Bernie to act.

I hope you're right on the second point. If TG could write a contract for F1 to race at his venue, under his rules (doing everything as normal, but giving him ultimate say) it would be a move in the right direction. TG could have been an idiot like the FIA and said that the chicane idea was invalid, but instead he was reasonable and said "why not." I doubt he'd ever get such powers, so I suppose your prediction of no more USGP may be correct. I don't normally have much respect for TG, but I'm rooting for him in this case.