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15 Jul 2011, 01:56 (Ref:2926884)
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#1
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Radelaide, South Australia |
Posts: 5,387
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Closed cockpits- Closer to reality then we might think?
Just unearthed this recent video of the FIA conducting crash tests on two different strength canopies.
Not quite sure what to think! All the drivers know that when they step into the car there is a chance they might not be stepping out alive, is this just a belated knee-jerk reaction to the accidents of Henry Surtees and Felipe Massa? I'd be interested in seeing what sort of damage a suspension spring could do to one of those canopies...
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"A lot of people go through life doing things badly. Racing’s important to men who do it well. When you’re racing, it... it’s life. Anything that happens before or after... is just waiting." - Steve McQueen
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15 Jul 2011, 03:31 (Ref:2926894)
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#2
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,018
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"All the drivers know that when they step into the car there is a chance they might not be stepping out alive,"
I find the above statement offensive. Just because a driver accepts a risk in order to do something he loves, does not mean that everyone should not continue trying to mitigate known risks.
The canopies would be a good idea!
We may still have Alan Stacey, Mike Spence, Helmut Koeinnig, Tom Pryce, Ayrton Senna, Henry Surtees and probably would have prevented Massa's injury.
Heading into an accident with your head exposed, when a car rides up over yours or an object comes toward you on a race track does not seem very bright. (Besides adds more road car relevance  )
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15 Jul 2011, 09:47 (Ref:2926962)
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#3
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Rookie
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 66
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There is one of those canopies fitted to "my" aircraft and very strong it is too. Mind you we have to lift it off with a crane so there may be a weight issue there  . Having said that mine is the two seat version so the guy in the back could play with all the dials and knobs while the bloke up front could concentrate on hitting his braking points and apexes -sorted!
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15 Jul 2011, 09:51 (Ref:2926964)
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#4
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,067
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I really don't know what to make of this.
I understand why they'd want them, but does this mean all single seaters would have these fitted as standard?
Selby
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Run-offs, chicanes, hairpins...
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15 Jul 2011, 10:15 (Ref:2926979)
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#5
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 5,100
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I guess they would percolate down. My only concern with these would be speed of getting out of the car, which I feel sure the fly boys have already got sorted out.
Things that can hit the driver on the head are something that need to be avoided, that is probably the most dangerous thing in a modern single seater (well, toss-up between that and wheel over wheel crashes).
Off topic comment alert I have to type this or my brain will explode! As a sidepoint, not only single seaters have this problem, I remember in a BTCC support race (I think it was SEATs or Clios) where one of the tyres they stick on the corners bouncing in to a touring car windscreen, with the tyre winding up making a massive tyre-sized hole. Now if that happened in a single seater race, it could be curtains. Perhaps in some cases race track furniture could actually be a bit more thought out e.g. not having heavy stuff on the inside of corners, just stick polystyrene advert hoardings there or something equally breaky-uppy in case it gets hit.
Thanks for reading, you've been a wonderful audience. Don't forget to try the veal and tip your waitress. We now return you to the topic
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15 Jul 2011, 10:41 (Ref:2926986)
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#6
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 6,986
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wnut
"All the drivers know that when they step into the car there is a chance they might not be stepping out alive,"
I find the above statement offensive. Just because a driver accepts a risk in order to do something he loves, does not mean that everyone should not continue trying to mitigate known risks.
The canopies would be a good idea!
We may still have Alan Stacey, Mike Spence, Helmut Koeinnig, Tom Pryce, Ayrton Senna, Henry Surtees and probably would have prevented Massa's injury.
Heading into an accident with your head exposed, when a car rides up over yours or an object comes toward you on a race track does not seem very bright. (Besides adds more road car relevance  )
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Agree totally.
The purists may feel that it no longer looks like a single seater rather more like a sports prototype. But surely that's a very small price to pay. Let's get real here. None of us watch motor racing to see people decapitated and if this saves even one driver's life, it's a very good idea indeed.
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15 Jul 2011, 11:08 (Ref:2927002)
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#7
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,067
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I'm not totally against it by any stretch of the imagination. It's just a huge change, isn't it?
I guess it's the next in the cycle of no helmets, to small helmets, to full sized helmets, now to this.
It perhaps offers a chance for other series (Superleague etc) to not follow suit (for better or for worse...).
Selby
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__________________
Run-offs, chicanes, hairpins...
Think you can do better? Let's see it!
Check out the "My Tracks" forum here on Ten-Tenths.
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15 Jul 2011, 13:16 (Ref:2927042)
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#8
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,936
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Why not just stop motorsport altogether? Then there'll be no risk at all.
I don't think it is necessary. Firstly, in my opinion it would look ridiculous and secondly, there will presumably be an issue with vacating the car within X seconds. Thirdly...just no. What next, wrapping the cars in cotton wool?
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15 Jul 2011, 13:28 (Ref:2927052)
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#9
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Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,094
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Quote:
Originally Posted by safc_fan89
Why not just stop motorsport altogether? Then there'll be no risk at all.
I don't think it is necessary. Firstly, in my opinion it would look ridiculous and secondly, there will presumably be an issue with vacating the car within X seconds. Thirdly...just no. What next, wrapping the cars in cotton wool?
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I can't believe they put canopies on jet planes either - bunch of pansies. Open face helmet should be more than adequate.
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Locost #54 Boldly Leaping where no car has gone before. And then being T-boned. Damn.
Survivor of the 2008 2CV 24h!! 2 engines, one accident, 76mph and rain.
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15 Jul 2011, 13:48 (Ref:2927060)
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#10
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,067
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I think the point here is that drivers understand the situation when they sign up. They know and love motor racing the way it is, or they wouldn't have joined it in the first place.
That's not to say technology and safety should come to a stand still, but it's a very tricky line to walk, isn't it?
Selby
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__________________
Run-offs, chicanes, hairpins...
Think you can do better? Let's see it!
Check out the "My Tracks" forum here on Ten-Tenths.
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15 Jul 2011, 14:38 (Ref:2927078)
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#11
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 3,151
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Should Formula 1 abandon its character as open-cockpit series, it should then also abandon its open-wheel character. Such would improve safety and fits Formula 1's pursuit for reduced fuel consumption and a green(er) image.
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'Aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines.' - Enzo Ferrari
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15 Jul 2011, 15:16 (Ref:2927099)
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#12
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 6,071
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke_toaster
My only concern with these would be speed of getting out of the car, which I feel sure the fly boys have already got sorted out.
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ejector seats! F1 needs ejector seats immediately!
seriously though it is a fine line. obviously you must try to increase safety and the powers that be will move it ever closer to that line where it ceases to be a sport and turns into something that no longer reflects why we watch it and why drivers choose to compete in it.
sadly where that line is i wont know until they cross it and i stop watching and caring but i have to wonder does this road just move us closer towards an era where 20 odd 'drivers' sit in the safety of their simulators and remotely control the cars on track?
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Shall we buy a new guitar? Shall we drive a more powerful car?
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15 Jul 2011, 15:31 (Ref:2927107)
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#13
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 6,986
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davyboy
None of us watch motor racing to see people decapitated
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Wow... it seems I was wrong here. I'm quite shocked.
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15 Jul 2011, 17:50 (Ref:2927139)
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#14
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location:
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46 Egernon Road |
Posts: 1,011
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Do Moto GP forums have these types of discussions or do they just get on with it?
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__________________
"F1, it's all about the tyres." - Mark Webber
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15 Jul 2011, 18:05 (Ref:2927143)
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#15
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,276
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spritle
Do Moto GP forums have these types of discussions or do they just get on with it?
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I think bikers are more discriminating, they probably don't let the jobsworths and H&S types in
Last edited by MGDavid; 15 Jul 2011 at 18:12.
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