IMSA DPi Discussion

[Maelochs]

Daytona Prototype international ....

Say, I'd like to recommend this article. (http://www.automobilemag.com/news/po...-wec-backfoot/) I enjoyed it and would like to share it. I am not sure we are allowed to be hopeful about sportscar racing around here ... but don't worry, even though the article paints a bright future for DPi it foretells possible disaster for WEC.

[Coach Ep]

With Oreca being all over the WEC P2 grid I could see them being really cautious entering the DPi arena. A tie-up with Honda/HPD and Penske would be the obvious opportunity to bring plans forward/make the jump in the first place.

[Scorchess]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Daytona Prototype international ....

Say, I'd like to recommend this article. (http://www.automobilemag.com/news/po...-wec-backfoot/) I enjoyed it and would like to share it. I am not sure we are allowed to be hopeful about sportscar racing around here ... but don't worry, even though the article paints a bright future for DPi it foretells possible disaster for WEC.

The article keeps making the same mistake that every American seems to make: the rest of the world doesn't give a **** about American racing. They do about Le Mans. What people seem to constantly forget is that DPi works for IMSA because it is a regional championship. Why do people want to insist on a comparison with a world championship, where the level of competition is that much higher?

And while Americans may be dumb enough to believe the car that won Daytona is a Cadillac, nobody else with even a little bit of interest on the other side of the pond falls for that.

More mistakes:
- Nissan is not a DPi manufacturer, they just sold ESM an engine and told them to make a lame attempt at 'styling'.
- WEC does not require three manufacturers in LMP1. It started with two.
- WEC does not care what IMSA does. WEC is 'on the back foot' because Audi pulled out due to reasons unrelated to the sport. There is a reason not a single European manufacturer is interested in DPi in any way whatsoever. They don't care about superficial 'styling', they want to be able to develop new technologies.
- Claiming IMSA (or anyone for that matter) is going to be able to apply BoP to a prototype class with manufacturer teams is delusional.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Daytona Prototype international ....

Say, I'd like to recommend this article. (http://www.automobilemag.com/news/po...-wec-backfoot/) I enjoyed it and would like to share it. I am not sure we are allowed to be hopeful about sportscar racing around here ... but don't worry, even though the article paints a bright future for DPi it foretells possible disaster for WEC.

WEC is dying.

I disagree with the author on the whole "remove the stickers and logos and it'd be hard to tell them apart" thing. All three cars are very distinct from each other.

Nissan still needs different headlights.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Scorchess

The article keeps making the same mistake that every American seems to make: the rest of the world doesn't give a **** about American racing. They do about Le Mans. What people seem to constantly forget is that DPi works for IMSA because it is a regional championship. Why do people want to insist on a comparison with a world championship, where the level of competition is that much higher?

And while Americans may be dumb enough to believe the car that won Daytona is a Cadillac, nobody else with even a little bit of interest on the other side of the pond falls for that.

More mistakes:
- Nissan is not a DPi manufacturer, they just sold ESM an engine and told them to make a lame attempt at 'styling'.
- WEC does not require three manufacturers in LMP1. It started with two.
- WEC does not care what IMSA does. WEC is 'on the back foot' because Audi pulled out due to reasons unrelated to the sport. There is a reason not a single European manufacturer is interested in DPi in any way whatsoever. They don't care about superficial 'styling', they want to be able to develop new technologies.
- Claiming IMSA (or anyone for that matter) is going to be able to apply BoP to a prototype class with manufacturer teams is delusional.

Lol.

Also, IMSA strength of field is higher than WEC.

[Coach Ep]

Whahaha.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by Scorchess

The article keeps making the same mistake that every American seems to make: the rest of the world doesn't give a **** about American racing.

Yeah, right. American Racing (be it CART, ALMS or NASCAR) has always had a rather sizable following in Europe - certainly enough to justify live broadcasts.

[Scorchess]

Originally Posted by Matt

Lol.

Also, IMSA strength of field is higher than WEC.

Tell that to ESM. They got their asses kicked and went back to IMSA with the tail between their legs.

The level of teams and drivers in IMSA is at the level it should be: a domestic series.

Also quite funny to claim that of a series that has PC and GT3 cars to make up the numbers...

[Scorchess]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Yeah, right. American Racing (be it CART, ALMS or NASCAR) has always had a rather sizable following in Europe - certainly enough to justify live broadcasts.

Yeah right, back in the 90s maybe. Not anymore.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Scorchess

Tell that to ESM. They got their asses kicked and went back to IMSA with the tail between their legs.

The level of teams and drivers in IMSA is at the level it should be: a domestic series.

ESM has never really actually been good though?

IMSA teams cleaned up at Le Mans last year in the GT classes.

[Scorchess]

Originally Posted by Matt

ESM has never really actually been good though?

IMSA teams cleaned up at Le Mans last year in the GT classes.

You tell me, they seemed to do pretty well in the supposedly competitive IMSA championship last year.

GTE-Pro is a factory supported class.

[Akrapovic]

IMSA GTLM is miles ahead of GTE. The only team that tends to be close is AF Corse, who had a shocking year in 2016.

Prototype is another story. ESM and MSR were race winners last year. ESM had some pretty great outtings. Nowhere at Le Mans. Maybe WTR and AXR would be better, but we won't know that until they come to Le Mans with a P2 car.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Scorchess

You tell me, they seemed to do pretty well in the supposedly competitive IMSA championship last year.

GTE-Pro is a factory supported class.

GTE-Am, is not.

[JHamilton]

Originally Posted by Scorchess

The article keeps making the same mistake that every American seems to make: the rest of the world doesn't give a **** about American racing.

Then I will politely ask you not to post in a thread about an American racing series. Let everyone else have a discussion about a series they are interested without the obvious trolling, please.

[Scorchess]

Originally Posted by JHamilton

Then I will politely ask you not to post in a thread about an American racing series. Let everyone else have a discussion about a series they are interested without the obvious trolling, please.

Disagreeing with the general consensus is not trolling. And I will not talk about IMSA when its cheerleaders stop posting articles mouthing off about other series.

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by Scorchess

Disagreeing with the general consensus is not trolling. And I will not talk about IMSA when its cheerleaders stop posting articles mouthing off about other series.

So you're admitting you're just being childish? Very well, then.

[Akrapovic]

I care about American racing. A lot. Especially when it's good. I watched CART and NASCAR. ALMS and Grand Am. I dropped nascar because it's hilarious and dropped Indycar because the cars are awful. I kept IMSA and I'm glad I did, it's awesome. Its not better (or worse) than ELMS or WEC for me. Its just different. And awesome.

[Scorchess]

The article linked is childish. I critique it. Want to continue with the childish personal attacks or actually address the points made?

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

I care about American racing. A lot. Especially when it's good. I watched CART and NASCAR. ALMS and Grand Am. I dropped nascar because it's hilarious and dropped Indycar because the cars are awful. I kept IMSA and I'm glad I did, it's awesome. Its not better (or worse) than ELMS or WEC for me. Its just different. And awesome.

This is it for me! Even though, I got sucked back into IndyCar. The racing is great and the drivers are too.

Originally Posted by Scorchess

The article linked is childish. I critique it. Want to continue with the childish personal attacks or actually address the points made?

Originally Posted by Scorchess

And while Americans may be dumb enough to believe the car that won Daytona is a Cadillac, nobody else with even a little bit of interest on the other side of the pond falls for that.

Sure. Let us do that.

[Matt]

Someone sounds triggered.

The article isn't childish, it's actually pretty damn factual. WEC is circling the drain.

Someone check the IP and see if it matches up with the old Chiana acct.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by Matt

Someone sounds triggered.

The article isn't childish, it's actually pretty damn factual. WEC is circling the drain.

Someone check the IP and see if it matches up with the old Chiana acct.

Naw, Chiana actually liked US-racing... at least the pre-merger version. And I don't remember him being a WEC fanboy at all.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by Matt

Someone sounds triggered.

The article isn't childish, it's actually pretty damn factual. WEC is circling the drain.

Someone check the IP and see if it matches up with the old Chiana acct.

Circling the drain? Come on, now. I mean, I guess you missed the recent announcements on the new lmp1 projects and BMW joining GTE in 2018 and Ford extending their program to 4 years? You know it is possible to like both series without being a 'fanboy' of one or the other. I like the dpi's. They look cool and have unique styling and different engines. But they still are bop'd to an inch (literally) and run on a spec tire. GTLM is awesome, but it's the same thing as GTE except some different BOP applications. While GTLM has Corvette and (a GT3 converted) BMW, GTE has Aston Martin. There's no lmp1 in IMSA, a couple teams are from the WEC and only running the NAEC- 4 races. There's strengths in each series. I never understood why people get up in arms over this trivial stuff and try to diminish another championship.

[Matt]

Those new P1 projects won't materialize. History has shown that.

[SALEEN S7R]

Having read the last few pages of this thread and from what i have seen recently i have come to the conclusion that nothing has really fundamentally changed. The WEC is dying? Not really, it has just gone past its peak for the time being, it is rare to have 3 factory LMP1 teams competing against each other, perhaps in a year or 2 we might have that situation again, perhaps not. Either way, 2 factory teams in the premier class is pretty good IMO.

As for Grand Am, i watched the Daytona 24 hours and have no problem with the DPs anymore, some of them even look good. The only thing i dont like is that the LMP2 cars still cannot run full in full ACO spec, why is beyond me, give the DPs larger restrictors to keep them competitve and everything would be great, might even attract some more top LMP2 teams to Daytona. As for comparing DPs to LMP1 machinery in terms of performance though isnt accurate, like comparing IRL to Formula 1, its good, like LMP2 but nowhere near the performance of a LMP1 car. Lastly, its great to see the GTLM class in Grand Am so strong, this perhaps is the 1 class that has more strength in depth than in the WEC. IMO.

[Matt]

ACO P2 cars run in full ACO spec...