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16 Mar 2017, 14:03 (Ref:3719051) | #5201 | ||
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I thinK that there are too many variables in the real (analog) world to avoid or conceive of every possible pitfall or problem. Problems happen, period. This is in racing and real life, and a modern racing tire has an insane amount of work asked of it. Sometimes people get it wrong. maybe it was engineering, maybe it was production, maybe it was something else that wasn't accounted for...supplier of materials, how the tires were handled by a shipper (not temp controlled) and so on. It could be down to a million things.
Last edited by WolfsburgRS; 16 Mar 2017 at 14:22. |
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16 Mar 2017, 14:05 (Ref:3719052) | #5202 | |||
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Also, something we haven't mentioned yet is Continental has promised a brand new GTD tyre for next year. If the tyres are just fine and really aren't a problem, why is Conti doing that? They've also changed the tyre for Sebring to have a tougher shoulder and sidewall. Why did they do that if the tyres were fine? In the S365 article, the first time the word safety is used is actually in a quote by Continental. It's for the good of the series that IMSA tells Conti to get the product sorted. |
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16 Mar 2017, 14:37 (Ref:3719064) | #5203 | |||
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'Ticked the rest of us off as we had been up to 5th and , if we had finished, could've (not "of") been on the podium. The owner knew he wasn't what he wanted but needed the rent-a-seat revenue. If I thought this a-hole would be back next year, I wouldn't have wanted to do it again either. That's the point of Kevin's "reason" (or whatever). That kind of "luck" justifies not wanting to do it. I wouldn't want to rent a seat knowing our "luck" depended on crap tires either. |
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16 Mar 2017, 15:05 (Ref:3719071) | #5204 | ||||
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16 Mar 2017, 15:24 (Ref:3719081) | #5205 | |||
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No one is saying the Continental tires are equal to the Michelin. But they are considerably cheaper. And Continental is not only able to supply vastly more cars than Michelin, but also spend more money on advertising the series than Michelin can, which is important. The tires are also not nearly as bad as you make them out to be. Being a little slower, and whatever the issues at Daytona were, do not equal a spec ECU spontaneously combusting. Chris |
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16 Mar 2017, 15:52 (Ref:3719094) | #5206 | |
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Werent the GTLMs almost as fast as the prototypes this year at Daytona in the rain?
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16 Mar 2017, 15:56 (Ref:3719096) | #5207 | ||
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But then again, the flip side you mentioned is there isn't an ECU provider who is putting that much money into the series. So where is the tipping point. |
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16 Mar 2017, 16:27 (Ref:3719105) | #5208 | |
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The tires aren't just a "little slower" in the rain, they're terrible. And in the dry they're not much better. We can talk and argue about why that is for days until someone from IMSA or Continental tell us. The facts are on pace, they were bad. It wasn't JUST pro drivers in the Porsche passing prototypes at PLM, Corvette was doing it too. And the Porsche beat Pro drivers in DP's as well. So that driver ratings was not a factor. Look at the WEC race at COTA when they got a torrential downpour. GTE's were running the same wet tire as IMSA, but they didn't drive past lmp2's.
Just because the TRG guy has questionable history doesn't make his claims any less valid. Especially with others saying the same thing, Conti realizing the same thing and evidence showing the same thing. There's nothing to argue imo. They either change the tire or not. It gets better or not. We'll just have to wait and see the consequences. |
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16 Mar 2017, 18:39 (Ref:3719150) | #5209 | ||
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It also doesn't help that Michelin or Dunlop are unable (probably, actually, unwilling) to spend money on classes that have no relevant ties to Le Mans. Several GTLM teams go to Le Mans annually. I haven't seen many GTD or DPI/Prototype teams make that jump. Hence, no incentive for Michelin to do anything aside from provide tires to the teams that actually would travel to LM each year.
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16 Mar 2017, 19:17 (Ref:3719162) | #5210 | |
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They're not allowed to (in imsa). They can only supply GTLM since that's the only open tire class.
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16 Mar 2017, 19:34 (Ref:3719166) | #5211 | |
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The equally relevant point about PLM is not just GTLM outrunning cars 2 classes above, but that GTD was nowhere. Torrential conditions can relatively favor GT cars because of their lower aero dependance and mechanical grip but the highest GTD was 17th overall behind all the PCs.
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16 Mar 2017, 20:26 (Ref:3719184) | #5212 | |||
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Oh, yeah, some of those guys went to Le Mans, and IMSA gave something of a damn about the ACO's prototype regs. Most of your current prototype and GTD teams don't have such aspirations. Between that and paying for the privilege, Continental gets away with being the spec tire in those classes. |
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16 Mar 2017, 21:07 (Ref:3719190) | #5213 | ||
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17 Mar 2017, 13:56 (Ref:3719365) | #5214 | ||
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This is great news
Turner Set for Full-Season GTD Effort: http://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/tu...on-gtd-effort/ |
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17 Mar 2017, 14:11 (Ref:3719369) | #5215 | |||
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I just hate that this argument is being boiled down to if you don't completely dismiss Continental as a tire provider and series partner, you are defending a shoddy product. I think I've been critical of Continental, particularly what was supposed to be a new and improved wet tire disappointing at Daytona, but I'm not willing to totally damn their performance because of what a cluster the weather was at Daytona, and IMSA's rules about intermediates. Chris |
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17 Mar 2017, 16:23 (Ref:3719414) | #5216 | |||
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17 Mar 2017, 17:46 (Ref:3719432) | #5217 | ||
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Even in the dry at Daytona the GTLM cars were almost as fast in the infield section. But that was due to the IMSA mandated low downforce configuration to the prototypes. I wonder how fast a low downforce configured DPI would go at Sebring? |
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18 Mar 2017, 06:46 (Ref:3719535) | #5218 | ||
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Great to see Turner in for the season. Hopefully Alex Job can sort something too.
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18 Mar 2017, 17:04 (Ref:3719711) | #5219 | ||
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A warning shot from the Captain: http://www.autosport.com/news/report...ance-balancing
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18 Mar 2017, 18:19 (Ref:3719753) | #5220 | |||
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18 Mar 2017, 18:48 (Ref:3719762) | #5221 | |||
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19 Mar 2017, 17:30 (Ref:3720030) | #5222 | |
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He perfers BoP though money not results.
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19 Mar 2017, 22:55 (Ref:3720074) | #5223 | ||
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Huh? A little early on a Sunday to be snockered, no???
(Or were you camped in Green Park?) Last edited by jimclark; 19 Mar 2017 at 23:00. |
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"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..." jimclark |
19 Mar 2017, 23:19 (Ref:3720078) | #5224 | ||
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20 Mar 2017, 16:54 (Ref:3720234) | #5225 | |
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