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Old 5 Jul 2018, 17:57 (Ref:3834848)   #1966
Maelochs
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Originally Posted by MaskedRacer View Post
Its funny that the DPI vs Gibson LMP2 debate has become more intense than Daytona Prototype vs old LMP2.
I might be out of touch, but I'd say my perception is just the opposite.

The first P vs. P2 debate was sort of ALMS vs. Rolex, dinosaur versus bird, blunt object vs. scalpel ... Sports car vs. NASCAR. People really wanted the more modern, more refined P2s to have a chance against the overweight, antiquated, holdover, tacked-on add-on, tube-framed DPs.

The DP upgrade helped a little but I recall people being very upset that even when they could set a similar lap time, a P2 simply couldn't win a race.

A lot of it was the majority ALMS fans feeling that Rolex had won, and was artificially keeping alive these primitive cars which no other series would allow on simple safety issues.

DPs seemed (in my recollection and my understanding, both of which are exceedingly unreliable) to represent the antithesis of sports-car racing, while P2s were the best representative allowed in the U.S. series--where they weren't allowed to win.

It seems to me that DPis don't excite a huge amount of hatred ... they are proper P2 chassis with bigger horsepower and torque.

While the Fairness issue is the same as ever, it seems as though the fight for the soul of American sportscar racing has been resolved, ultimately in favor of the Eurocentric modernists.

On the other hand, I only get to one race a year nowadays, so maybe all the fans are really riled up about pro-Am teams continuing to lose.

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Originally Posted by MaskedRacer View Post
I miss those days actually. I loved the Corvette DP especially. Can't say I really have liked the DPI's very much.
In their final iteration, Corvette DPs were pretty good cars, and didn't look bad at all. And who doesn't like a roaring V8 sound echoing around the track?

Still, the Gen3 (or was it Gen4?) DPs were an aero nightmare ... as I recall the Corvette DP body had more drag than the ugly Gen2 body, such that any teams running Gen2s in the Gen3 era were forced to put a gigantic wicker on the rear wing supports---those "styling cues" were aero-expensive.

DPs ended up being decent-looking cars, BoP'd to be able to beat P2s ... I cannot say I "miss" those days, but the last couple DP years were enjoyable to be sure.

One final thought---can you imagine what a good DPi could do if it were allowed to grow into its strengths? Take one of the Action Express Caddys, with 5.5 liters .... modern tub and aero .... put on some real tires, and the the engineers tweak the motor, suspension, and aero trim .... That would get some fans excited, I'd bet.

(Not looking for a fight here---just one person's take on the topic, not saying anyone is right or wrong.)
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Old 5 Jul 2018, 18:09 (Ref:3834850)   #1967
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Just so people don't forget .....





(sorry, this site is fighting me about displaying images .... )
Attached Thumbnails
Petit2-16-race_3279_#5AXR-X3.jpg   Petit2-16-race-PM_4175_#60MSRLigier-X3.jpg   5834PLM10-4-14#01Ganassi30PanXXX-X3.jpg  

#60Shank_2009-PLM-10-4-14-pm-T10-X3.jpg  
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Old 5 Jul 2018, 19:29 (Ref:3834874)   #1968
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Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
I might be out of touch, but I'd say my perception is just the opposite.

The first P vs. P2 debate was sort of ALMS vs. Rolex, dinosaur versus bird, blunt object vs. scalpel ... Sports car vs. NASCAR. People really wanted the more modern, more refined P2s to have a chance against the overweight, antiquated, holdover, tacked-on add-on, tube-framed DPs.

The DP upgrade helped a little but I recall people being very upset that even when they could set a similar lap time, a P2 simply couldn't win a race.

A lot of it was the majority ALMS fans feeling that Rolex had won, and was artificially keeping alive these primitive cars which no other series would allow on simple safety issues.

DPs seemed (in my recollection and my understanding, both of which are exceedingly unreliable) to represent the antithesis of sports-car racing, while P2s were the best representative allowed in the U.S. series--where they weren't allowed to win.

It seems to me that DPis don't excite a huge amount of hatred ... they are proper P2 chassis with bigger horsepower and torque.

While the Fairness issue is the same as ever, it seems as though the fight for the soul of American sportscar racing has been resolved, ultimately in favor of the Eurocentric modernists.

On the other hand, I only get to one race a year nowadays, so maybe all the fans are really riled up about pro-Am teams continuing to lose.

In their final iteration, Corvette DPs were pretty good cars, and didn't look bad at all. And who doesn't like a roaring V8 sound echoing around the track?

Still, the Gen3 (or was it Gen4?) DPs were an aero nightmare ... as I recall the Corvette DP body had more drag than the ugly Gen2 body, such that any teams running Gen2s in the Gen3 era were forced to put a gigantic wicker on the rear wing supports---those "styling cues" were aero-expensive.

DPs ended up being decent-looking cars, BoP'd to be able to beat P2s ... I cannot say I "miss" those days, but the last couple DP years were enjoyable to be sure.

One final thought---can you imagine what a good DPi could do if it were allowed to grow into its strengths? Take one of the Action Express Caddys, with 5.5 liters .... modern tub and aero .... put on some real tires, and the the engineers tweak the motor, suspension, and aero trim .... That would get some fans excited, I'd bet.

(Not looking for a fight here---just one person's take on the topic, not saying anyone is right or wrong.)

The battle for the heart and soul as you say was more than just the cars. You had MRN radio vs Radio Le Mans. The whole safety car issue too. Thankfully as you indicated these issues have been settled in a good way. IMSA is not has yellow flag happy as they used to be. Granted I still think virtual safety cars should be implemented for debris and stalled cars. For sure the DPI cars could go faster than they are now. Imagine the BoP taken off them and also put Michelin tires on them. Sub 1 min 30 at Watkins Glen perhaps?
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Old 6 Jul 2018, 18:36 (Ref:3835032)   #1969
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It looks like the #75 Mercedes SunEnergy1 car is a no show for CTMP for reasons I do not know at the moment of this post.

#38 Oreca 07 in big trouble to make the grid after a practice 1 crash.
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Old 6 Jul 2018, 18:49 (Ref:3835034)   #1970
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It looks like the #75 Mercedes SunEnergy1 car is a no show for CTMP for reasons I do not know at the moment of this post.

#38 Oreca 07 in big trouble to make the grid after a practice 1 crash.
Looks like the partnership between Kenny Habul and Riley Motorsports has dissolved.

https://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/s...ent-from-ctmp/
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Old 10 Jul 2018, 05:02 (Ref:3835796)   #1971
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What's the word on alessandro balzan? He was due to miss Detroit but has been absent for both Watkins and CTMP as well.
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Old 10 Jul 2018, 06:04 (Ref:3835803)   #1972
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chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!
He's currently out due to injury. I'm not sure if he'll be back until late in the season from what I've read.
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Old 11 Jul 2018, 18:55 (Ref:3836113)   #1973
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Lime Rock entry posted. Disappointing so far. Note who is not on it when you view the GTD category.

https://sportscarchampionship.imsa.c..._entrylist.pdf
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Old 11 Jul 2018, 20:54 (Ref:3836138)   #1974
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chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!chernaudi has a real shot at the podium!
Hopefully that'll change soon, given that they're only three points out of the championship lead. Isn't MSR's co-owner also the owner of Sirius XM, who have been sponsoring the car the past couple of races?

It does seem that only the endurance races were a given for the #86 Acura, and the rest depended on results and sponsorship money.
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Old 11 Jul 2018, 20:55 (Ref:3836139)   #1975
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Lime Rock entry posted. Disappointing so far. Note who is not on it when you view the GTD category.

https://sportscarchampionship.imsa.c..._entrylist.pdf
That's got to be provisional. No Legges?
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Old 12 Jul 2018, 19:57 (Ref:3836355)   #1976
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Some good news for Katherine Legge and Meyer Shank Racing!

https://racer.com/2018/07/12/meyer-s...inder-of-2018/

https://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/m...est-of-season/
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Old 12 Jul 2018, 20:12 (Ref:3836357)   #1977
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Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!
I think I'm gonna go to Petit this year.
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Old 12 Jul 2018, 20:31 (Ref:3836358)   #1978
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skycafe has a real shot at the podium!skycafe has a real shot at the podium!skycafe has a real shot at the podium!skycafe has a real shot at the podium!skycafe has a real shot at the podium!
Good to see Legge get to continue
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Old 13 Jul 2018, 16:52 (Ref:3836497)   #1979
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I'd have hoped that would happen since one, Sirius XM has been on the car recently, and Sirius XM's owner is now co-owner of MSR and that would've hopefully lead to an infusion of cash into the team.
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Old 13 Jul 2018, 19:49 (Ref:3836533)   #1980
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So who do you think takes the championships then? I think in GTLM the #67 Ford is looking pretty good. I don't see them having too many more bad runs. Too consistent too good.

GTD is for sure between the #48 Lambo and #86 Acura. I think the #33 Mercedes is too far back at this point to get up there. I'll go with the Shank Acura. I feel that Madison Snow (who is much better this year) has a mistake or two in him still somewhere along the way.
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