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View Poll Results: What score does the 2018 Singapore Grand Prix get from you? | |||
10 | 0 | 0% | |
9 | 0 | 0% | |
8 | 0 | 0% | |
7 | 5 | 10.64% | |
6 | 5 | 10.64% | |
5 | 3 | 6.38% | |
4 | 8 | 17.02% | |
3 | 11 | 23.40% | |
2 | 2 | 4.26% | |
1 | 13 | 27.66% | |
Voters: 47. You may not vote on this poll |
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21 Sep 2018, 19:01 (Ref:3851852) | #51 | |||||
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Lastly, and I'm referring to a post you made in another part of this thread about me perhaps not being aware of the driver's perspective....you're right from the point of view that, no, I've never raced a car. Nor have I raced a kart (except for in some small places for fun). Yet I'm well aware of how much it takes any driver to complete a full race weekend in any stage of the grid, let alone in first position. However, I'm also aware that these drivers do it for a living. They are "the cream of the crop". Hamilton, Vettel, Raikkonen, Alonso et al have been racing for over 10 years in this Formula and they do it like we do our day jobs. I remember hearing drivers who have toured around untroubled to an easy win have even expressed how bored they were out there with no competition. I'll try source examples if needs be. But, even those that put in a fantastic strategy and a perfect weekend together, yes they deserve credit for that. And I don't detract from their excellence in putting together the best package (that is a clear admiration no doubt, unless it is at the expense of another driver who had serious bad luck which happens too of course). But it's still boring and not enough to whet my appetite for what I follow the sport for. And that is RACING. RACING. RACING. I respect you may not see if the same way and that's cool but I hope that I've at least outlined to you that I'm not interested in gimmicks or a spec-series in order to vamp up the on-track excitement. |
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21 Sep 2018, 20:19 (Ref:3851860) | #52 | |
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
21 Sep 2018, 20:28 (Ref:3851863) | #53 | ||
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Such as?
How simple? Must have four wheels, but otherwise go for it? Or is it sporting regs? Get to the end of the finish line quickest don’t care how? I’m with the it might be too complicated, rules are all there for a reason. Saying they should be simpler, is, unfortunately, too simple a suggestion. |
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Seriously not taking motorsport too seriously. |
22 Sep 2018, 02:28 (Ref:3851905) | #54 | ||||
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I love every aspect of auto racing. And there's nothing like a good battle (anywhere in the field) as long as it's not "contrived" by watering down the requirements to succeed just to put on a show. That's what movies are for. Or IndyCar, NASCAR, and BoPed racing (poor Le Mans and sportscar racing in general, no longer even a shadow of itself), not the so called (deservedly so) pinnacle of auto racing. Thus....advantage?........Me. Quote:
Fer instance: http://www.grandprixhistory.org/chap_2J.htm ......and a good site for the uninitiated: http://www.johnkrill.net/canam/index.html |
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"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..." jimclark |
22 Sep 2018, 03:43 (Ref:3851908) | #55 | |||
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From the same (to relate to F1...Jackie on the 2J: The car missed the first two races of the 1970 season. Jackie Stewart went to America to drive the 2J at Watkins Glen, a one-race deal; he qualified third. "The car's traction, its ability to brake and go deeply into the corners, is something I've never experienced before in a car this size or bulk," he wrote in his book Faster!. "Its adhesion is such that it seems to be able to take unorthodox lines through turns, and this, of course, is intriguing." Last edited by jimclark; 22 Sep 2018 at 04:01. |
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"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..." jimclark |
22 Sep 2018, 10:47 (Ref:3851938) | #56 | |||
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23 days... |
22 Sep 2018, 10:48 (Ref:3851940) | #57 | |||
Racer
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22 Sep 2018, 11:06 (Ref:3851944) | #58 | |||
The Honourable Mallett
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I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead. |
22 Sep 2018, 11:51 (Ref:3851956) | #59 | ||
Racer
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But, you see, that's what I love about racing. That kind of calibre of race is what fills me full of adrenaline for days on end. I accept that it can't always be that way but, when it's not, I'm merely saying that it's boring. To me at least. And I don't feel like I'm betraying the sport in saying so :-P
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22 Sep 2018, 12:30 (Ref:3851960) | #60 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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Yes we are in violent agreement.
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I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead. |
22 Sep 2018, 13:37 (Ref:3851970) | #61 | |
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Some will always be more exciting than others
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
22 Sep 2018, 14:15 (Ref:3851971) | #62 | |
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Racing in F1 is a rare occurance. But it does make it all the sweeter when it happens.
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22 Sep 2018, 21:55 (Ref:3852038) | #63 | ||
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I don't know what you're definition of a race is. I've always thought, and still do, that it is where competitors start, travel a certain distance or time, and whoever completes that distance first, or the most distance first in that time, is the winner; no matter how close or distant the next position is or how it was accomplished.
Newspeak I presume? To that, I don't subscribe. In addition, we're discussing auto racing here. Particularly, Formula One. Which, lest you have forgotten, is comprised of two championships. One for the drivers. and, very importantly, one for the constructors. Thus, I enjoy both for the very reasons they exist. And, once again, I don't wish the latter to be diminished to provide a show for those that don't care about it. Also, again, the series I mentioned (and more) are already in existence for those that prefer a show. No mas. |
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"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..." jimclark |
22 Sep 2018, 23:35 (Ref:3852060) | #64 | ||
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With all due respect, but there is a huge difference between racing (procession/follow the leader/ultra boring/Singapore GP) and racing (show/artifical yellows/bunch-up-the-field/NASCAR).
I'm quite sure none of the posters is calling for F1 to be one of those extremes. By coincidence (because I was not actively looking for it) I happened to watch today's race of the Michelin Le Mans Cup at Spa (minus the first 10 seconds) Was that a show? I don't think so. Was that artificial close racing? No, there were a few (just 2?) full course yellows (no safety car) to remove stranded/crashed cars. They were brief, and didn't disrupt the racing. Were the cars technoligically advanced? No they were not. But, I did like that race. It was entertaining, there was action, cars were able to follow eachother closely, there were lots of multi-car battles, and the winner wasn't decided until the last 15 minutes of the 2 hour race. Because it was a nice race, I kept following until the end and for me it was much more interesting than a lot of the F1 races I've seen this year. |
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23 Sep 2018, 02:50 (Ref:3852112) | #65 | |||
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I may have also,...'don't know. I know not of the series, so I have no clue as to the rules. BoPing? |
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"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..." jimclark |
23 Sep 2018, 13:55 (Ref:3852188) | #66 | |
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Michelin Le Mans Cup kinda has BoP but not really.
LMP3 class doesn't have BoP, but it does only have 2 realistic chassis manufacturers and a single engine supplier. BoP isn't really needed when you have that few variables. LMP3 regulations allow the ACO to implement a BoP, but they haven't done so yet. The Norma is faster than the Ligier right now, but does seem a little harder to drive. The other LMP3 chassis aren't represented for a variety of reasons. GT3 class does have BoP but it doesn't adjust and hasn't for years. It's not like Blancpain and other GT3 series which adjusts weekly. But...you could say that's because the class only has 5-6 cars and I think currently there's only 2 manufacturers, but the entry list changes every race so who knows. |
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23 Sep 2018, 14:33 (Ref:3852196) | #67 | |||
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I'm still a tad confused tho'. Either there is BoPing or there is not in LMP3. If the rules do not specify changing per performance, there's no BoPing. Thus if a team develops better performance for their car they deserve it, not have their advantage taken away.. If no teams do, and the racing is close, that's even better yet. If it's not dictated; that's real racing! "Racing" is not synonymous with "close competition". That's great and I hope fans enjoy as gert did/does. edit: Disregard my confusion. I thought the non-used BoP was in GT. I have corrected myself upon re-read. Oooopppsss.... Last edited by jimclark; 23 Sep 2018 at 14:40. |
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"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..." jimclark |
23 Sep 2018, 14:45 (Ref:3852198) | #68 | |
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For LMP3, the rules allow the ACO to implement a BoP and adjust the speed of the cars, but as of yet, they have not done so. So as of the time of this post, there is no BoP...but that can change any time. I guess if someone came in with a car 2 seconds a lap faster then that rule would be implemented. I agree with your stance of better cars deserve the advantage they get, but you never really know with the ACO lol.
Chances of 'needing' a BoP in LMP3 is quite slim. The cars must be customer cars and sold at a price cap. So the producers can't just sink money into it to be better. There's also a limit to who can build them - manufacturers apply, and the ACO grants licenses to build them. This is the first generation of LMP3 cars, and the ACO granted licenses to Adess, Ginetta, Ligier, Norma and Riley. The Riley is terrible, the Ginetta is even more terrible (and impossible to use because they had a falling out with suppliers), and the Adess hasn't caught on. So the choice is Ligier or Norma. The Ligier customer support is excellent - they'll even run the cars for you if you pay them. The Norma is a faster car, although tends to be more twitchy. In a series that is all about amateur drivers, that can be a bigger disadvantage than it sounds. So the way things have played out, BoP hasn't been needed as everyone uses the Norma and Ligier and it's pretty close. Although some will say we're off topic, the idea of forced customer sales as cost caps is something F1 could look at. Edit: Just caught your edit: |
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23 Sep 2018, 14:49 (Ref:3852199) | #69 | |||
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Last edited by Aysedasi; 23 Sep 2018 at 14:55. |
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23 days... |
23 Sep 2018, 15:01 (Ref:3852201) | #70 | ||
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If actual racing disturbs you, maybe just keep it to saturdays then. |
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23 Sep 2018, 15:20 (Ref:3852202) | #71 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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Are we still on topic?
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23 Sep 2018, 15:30 (Ref:3852203) | #72 | ||
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"If you're not winning you're not trying." Colin Chapman. |
23 Sep 2018, 15:36 (Ref:3852204) | #73 | ||
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23 days... |
23 Sep 2018, 15:45 (Ref:3852206) | #74 | |
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Whilst staying on topic is important, this was a topic that had already served its purpose, so it's not like it is ruining any potential future discussion.
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23 Sep 2018, 16:25 (Ref:3852208) | #75 | ||
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"If you're not winning you're not trying." Colin Chapman. |
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