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4 Mar 2020, 18:37 (Ref:3961578) | #26 | ||
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if it was to be protested, would Merc have to make available the technical details about their system to the other teams? rather wouldn't those details come out in the course of the investigation?
presumably the FIA has this info already and have already deemed it legal for this year (as they have said a few times now) so what would be the point of protesting unless teams are using this process to also glean details about what the other teams are up to/what loopholes the other team has found out? i ask only to point out the inherent secrecy that exists between the teams and the FIA in all matters and these concerns about transparency need not be about someone cheating. they could also be about one team trying to increase their knowledge base. imo a private settlement isn't proof in and of itself that Ferrari cheated vs just exploited a loophole. all good though as someone will just poach the other's employee and will get the data they need. |
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4 Mar 2020, 20:20 (Ref:3961614) | #27 | |||
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It was no loophole, they tampered with the fuel flow meter to increase fuel flow to the engine that was already illegal and also the reason there are 2 fuel flow meters on the cars this season(to avoid tampering) |
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4 Mar 2020, 20:48 (Ref:3961620) | #28 | ||
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And you of course have evidence for that.
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4 Mar 2020, 21:34 (Ref:3961625) | #29 | ||
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1. Found a way to flow more fuel without detection by the homologated meter. 2. How they are doing it is clever enough that it's not obvious and the involved components may have other valid uses. Hypothetically the FIA position may be "You are flowing more fuel and your clever solution uses X, Y and Z components". The Ferrari position may be "As you can see, the data shows we are not flowing extra fuel and X, Y and Z actually do A, B and C and are unrelated to your speculation that it is trying to increase flow." I suspect that the FIA knows that adding an extra flow sensor may disrupt the X, Y, Z strategy. As always, pure speculation on my end. I am not saying Ferrari cheated, but I am trying to weave a story that might fit that scenario. As always, all Ferrari has to do is provide details on the settlement to clear the air! Richard |
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5 Mar 2020, 00:21 (Ref:3961649) | #30 | |
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Umm, no. There is ZERO chance it was straight illegal. Even the FIA couldn't risk that coming out and it would. There is no chance it was directly contravening any rules or the punishment would have been strong. If no part was illegal but the combination made a possibly illegal action then the FIA would have to prove it actually did. Without that proof they couldn't afford challenging teams with deep legal pockets. And releasing why they settled with Ferrari would likely release what they were doing. And the FIA wants no part of the info getting out to deal with new systems doing the same thing
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5 Mar 2020, 01:18 (Ref:3961656) | #31 | |||
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https://au.motorsport.com/f1/news/be...lease/1652202/ |
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5 Mar 2020, 01:38 (Ref:3961658) | #32 | ||
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I don’t think the Benetton had TC in 1994 because Verstappen would have been better if that was the case.
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5 Mar 2020, 03:48 (Ref:3961678) | #33 | |
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Ferrari & the FIA can thank their lucky stars that the Corona virus has distracted a lot of attention away from the teams complaints. Assertions of who did what to what what bits of the PU are nothing but hot air as no one outside of the two organisations knows. That something happened is beyond question but no specific assertions can be made, the popular one being the fuel flow rate. A few months before it was the twin batteries but that died swiftly.
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5 Mar 2020, 07:16 (Ref:3961688) | #34 | ||
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Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk |
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5 Mar 2020, 07:17 (Ref:3961689) | #35 | |||
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and it was Senna that also had said that Schumachers Benetton sounded different from the second car(Jos or JJ) and was convinced Schumachers car had TC https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2011...as-he-sees-it/ Last edited by steve nielsen; 5 Mar 2020 at 07:32. |
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5 Mar 2020, 07:22 (Ref:3961690) | #36 | ||
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The fact that Ferrari suddenly dropped back in performance after the FIA technical directive says enough.
And the question from Red Bull that lead to that technical directive was about fuel flow https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/14...rrari-intrigue Like I said: that's why there are 2 fuel flow meters now |
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5 Mar 2020, 08:15 (Ref:3961694) | #37 | |||
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5 Mar 2020, 15:06 (Ref:3961755) | #38 | ||
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The latest FIA press releases on matter:
https://www.fia.com/news/fia-stateme...ormula-1-teams The FIA has conducted detailed technical analysis on the Scuderia Ferrari Power Unit as it is entitled to do for any competitor in the FIA Formula One World Championship. The extensive and thorough investigations undertaken during the 2019 season raised suspicions that the Scuderia Ferrari PU could be considered as not operating within the limits of the FIA regulations at all times. The Scuderia Ferrari firmly opposed the suspicions and reiterated that its PU always operated in compliance with the regulations.The FIA was not fully satisfied but decided that further action would not necessarily result in a conclusive case due to the complexity of the matter and the material impossibility to provide the unequivocal evidence of a breach. To avoid the negative consequences that a long litigation would entail especially in light of the uncertainty of the outcome of such litigations and in the best interest of the Championship and of its stakeholders, the FIA, in compliance with Article 4 (ii) of its Judicial and Disciplinary Rules (JDR), decided to enter into an effective and dissuasive settlement agreement with Ferrari to terminate the proceedings. This type of agreement is a legal tool recognised as an essential component of any disciplinary system and is used by many public authorities and other sport federations in the handling of disputes. The confidentiality of the terms of the settlement agreement is provided for by Article 4 (vi) of the JDR. The FIA will take all necessary action to protect the sport and its role and reputation as regulator of the FIA Formula One World Championship. i suppose either side of this debate can now use this release to justify their position on the issue. |
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5 Mar 2020, 16:51 (Ref:3961763) | #39 | |
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Basically FIA put their ham sandwich lunch in the refrigerator at work. Later in the day, their food was gone. Mysteriously, the lunchbox was still securely locked, but Ferrari's breath smelled suspiciously like ham and some wax paper that looked just like what had been used to wrap the sandwich was found in Ferrari's waste basket. While everyone in the office looked suspiciously at Ferrari, Ferrari said they know nothing about the missing ham sandwich (and then promptly went and brushed their teeth).
FIA decided they didn't have the time or money to pursue it any further as Ferrari has worked in the office a really long time and is a favorite of the owner of the business. So FIA just put an extra lock on their lunchbox and hoped for the best. So far it seems to be working. Richard |
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5 Mar 2020, 17:02 (Ref:3961765) | #40 | |
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I thought the teams had to prove their cars was legal at all times during an event.
It is therefore not up to the FIA to prove it illegal, so if Ferrari cannot prove beyond all reasonable doubt they were fully compliant then they should of been excluded from that event. It goes to show how close the Todt led FIA and Ferrari are in reality and that the poacher cannot become the gamekeeper. |
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5 Mar 2020, 17:03 (Ref:3961766) | #41 | |||
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5 Mar 2020, 19:26 (Ref:3961795) | #42 | |||
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5 Mar 2020, 21:26 (Ref:3961814) | #43 | |||
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[]yes []no []maybe. Tick the appropriate box. There are too many possible reasons for a reduced straightline speed for these signs to be considered sufficient evidence in a court. |
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5 Mar 2020, 22:29 (Ref:3961818) | #44 | |||
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the fact is in the 6 races after the summer break Ferrari scored 6 poles, 3 wins, 3 2nd places and a 3rd, in the 3 races after the technical directive Ferrari only scored 1 3rd place and no more poles The FIA probably has evidence but tries to cover it up because otherwise they would have to strip Ferrari of their poles, points and wins |
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5 Mar 2020, 23:29 (Ref:3961828) | #45 | ||
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5 Mar 2020, 23:34 (Ref:3961829) | #46 | ||
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They could have left them doing what they were, made the championship far more interesting, and banned the loophole for this season. Like the Merc DAS system? |
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5 Mar 2020, 23:37 (Ref:3961831) | #47 | |
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Every time they try and justify the result of the inquiry they open their mouth to change feet and add fuel to the fire. The FIA is simply delusional if they think any form of words that is not a full disclosure is going to kill the issue.
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5 Mar 2020, 23:52 (Ref:3961836) | #48 | |
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We still don't know what Renault were up to last year, do we?
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6 Mar 2020, 01:30 (Ref:3961840) | #49 | |||
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/51762454 |
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6 Mar 2020, 13:17 (Ref:3961921) | #50 | |
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And the FIA themselves have said they are not fully satisfied with Ferrari’s legality, so it seems this one may run a while
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