[BTCC] BTCC 2020 season discussion, News and Rumours!

[MagicBoy]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Push to pass is computer game nonsense and isn't racing to me. I'd rather watch NASCAR where the best car/ driver combination normally wins... normally.

The NASCAR that splits the race into sections, has competition yellows to close everyone back up and playoffs to keep it interesting to the end of the season?

[porsche962fan]

Originally Posted by S griffin

. However the worst was when we had the boost changes which meant drivers couldn’t get past in the straight line

or the mandated final gear which was too short and made slipstreaming at Thruxton pretty useless

[Moneyseeker]

I thought the BTCC had push to pass already....

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[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by Moneyseeker

I thought the BTCC had push to pass already....

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Very good but I think you're getting mixed up with the move invented by a certain long standing driver which is called Bash The Car Clear.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

Very good but I think you're getting mixed up with the move invented by a certain long standing driver which is called Bash The Car Clear.

Just the one driver?!

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Just the one driver?!

A move invented by one, but now used by most...

[S griffin]

Here we go again, they are now a lot tougher on push to pass and have guidelines on what is considered an acceptable overtaking attempt. In the past JP might have got away with what he did at Snetterton last season, but not anymore

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

Very good but I think you're getting mixed up with the move invented by a certain long standing driver which is called Bash The Car Clear.

Actually, when watching back the old Donington Park races last weekend, I think it was 2012, 2014 and 2018 races, the driving standards were so much better in the 2018 race. The 2012 one had cars punted off everywhere 😂

[S griffin]

Indeed, driving standards hit an all time low in 2012. They’ve gradually improved since then, although there is still the odd meeting when things get out of hand, but they are usually the exception

[Johno.UK]

I get the arguments against the "push to pass" system in some forms of motorsport but in the BTCC?

Is it "fair" when a driver overtakes another who is on an inferior tyre or when a driver with 50kg of ballast is left for dead on a corner exit? BTCC is the ideal series for it IMO.

Leaving aside the ballast replacement differences in power if driver A finds themselves without boost and driver B goes past them then that means driver A has used their boost somewhere else on track already presumably to gain an advantage over driver B in the first place.

[bella]

Originally Posted by Johno.UK

I get the arguments against the "push to pass" system in some forms of motorsport but in the BTCC?

Is it "fair" when a driver overtakes another who is on an inferior tyre or when a driver with 50kg of ballast is left for dead on a corner exit? BTCC is the ideal series for it IMO.

i'm inclined to agree with johno here. push to pass is a bit crap, but btcc isn't exactly the last outpost of true motorsport. at this point it exists for pure entertainment and looking at the crowd numbers, it's doing a decent job.

i feel as though btcc is a great place to introduce more and more people to having some form of hybrid tech in their cars, particularly if it can relate directly to the way we use our cars now. it relates back to the win races on sunday, sell cars on monday principle - if for example toyota can bridge the gap between uber-tech racing use and road car use via a sport model of a ICE-only car rather than erm, a prius, then it's going to help.

[Matt K]

Using hybrid technology in BTCC cars as a means to promote road cars is a very relevant and good thing but it doesn't have anything in common with Push to Pass. Hybrid systems could be used differently, as someone has suggested here, and it wouldn't hamper racing product.

[S griffin]

It’s something I don’t think is needed, the boost button. If it ain’t broke as they say. But I wouldn’t be against if it was introduced either

[bella]

Originally Posted by Matt K

Using hybrid technology in BTCC cars as a means to promote road cars is a very relevant and good thing but it doesn't have anything in common with Push to Pass. Hybrid systems could be used differently, as someone has suggested here, and it wouldn't hamper racing product.

it doesn't hamper the racing product in the first place, it's the btcc the thing about push to pass is that it is road relevant - it's a direct way of demonstrating how much faster the car can go if you add a hybrid system...

[Sodemo]

I genuinely don’t see the point in it from a racing point of view.

If two drivers battling use it at the same time whilst battling, it will cancel each other out as neither will gain anything. If a driver behind uses it on a driver in front (who doesn’t use it) well it will be a candy from a baby pass, and the guy in front likely won’t even fight it, so again, pretty pointless.

[Greem]

It just becomes part of race strategy. Watch IndyCar races and you'll see some drivers use all of theirs early to gain an advantage, while others save as much as possible to as late as possible in the race to pounce on their rivals.

It can make for some really exciting race finishes.

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

I genuinely don’t see the point in it from a racing point of view.

If two drivers battling use it at the same time whilst battling, it will cancel each other out as neither will gain anything. If a driver behind uses it on a driver in front (who doesn’t use it) well it will be a candy from a baby pass, and the guy in front likely won’t even fight it, so again, pretty pointless.

This exactly! It's hardly like drivers find it difficult to overtake with the current rules.

[crmalcolm]

I think possibly a few of us are looking at it from a different perspective to the organisers?

BTCC is not a series that has an issue with lack of overtaking, I totally agree with.
But, the 'push-to-pass' is not being introduced to give more overtaking.

BTCC has decided to introduce hybrid power, and so the 'challenge' is how to introduce it in a way that makes it obvious to the casual viewer that hybrid gives a benefit over conventional power.

If all cars had a system that directly complemented the existing drive train continuously, it would be difficult to highlight that in a simplistic manner.

This solution means that overtakes can be 'sold' to the viewer as being a demonstration that hybrid is better.

[Sodemo]

That’s understandable, but Le Mans prototypes didn’t work that way. They just complimented the normal drivetrain.

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I think possibly a few of us are looking at it from a different perspective to the organisers?

BTCC is not a series that has an issue with lack of overtaking, I totally agree with.
But, the 'push-to-pass' is not being introduced to give more overtaking.

BTCC has decided to introduce hybrid power, and so the 'challenge' is how to introduce it in a way that makes it obvious to the casual viewer that hybrid gives a benefit over conventional power.

If all cars had a system that directly complemented the existing drive train continuously, it would be difficult to highlight that in a simplistic manner.

This solution means that overtakes can be 'sold' to the viewer as being a demonstration that hybrid is better.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

That’s understandable, but Le Mans prototypes didn’t work that way. They just complimented the normal drivetrain.

Yes, understand.

I wonder though, when hybrid power was first used in LMP, did the series organisers 'sell' the benefits of hybrid in any way?

LMP, IMO, tends to be more 'technical' and 'pure racing' in it's followership, whereas BTCC is more 'entertainment' focused.

[Moneyseeker]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I think possibly a few of us are looking at it from a different perspective to the organisers?



BTCC is not a series that has an issue with lack of overtaking, I totally agree with.

But, the 'push-to-pass' is not being introduced to give more overtaking.



BTCC has decided to introduce hybrid power, and so the 'challenge' is how to introduce it in a way that makes it obvious to the casual viewer that hybrid gives a benefit over conventional power.



If all cars had a system that directly complemented the existing drive train continuously, it would be difficult to highlight that in a simplistic manner.



This solution means that overtakes can be 'sold' to the viewer as being a demonstration that hybrid is better.

The biggest example of this is F1, to the casual observer the cars just seem a lot quieter, do they even know they are massively sophisticated hybrid engines, does F1 even promote the use of this technology.

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[redshoes]

So in case you missed the news, BTCC website has updated the driver and team pages.
http://www.btcc.net/2020/04/04/2020-...ages-now-live/
Good job the season didn't start on time, otherwise this would have been a bit late.

Points to note:
They had to truncate at least one team name on the index page - "MB Motorsport Accelerated by Blue" drops the 'Square'

Carl Boardley's car is missing most of it's sponsors and the rear half of the livery. After an off in testing at Brands Hatch they didn't have time to finish the car before the media day. Most of the photos from the media day show the other side of the car so it all looks ok.

[touringlegend]

Originally Posted by Evantra

This exactly! It's hardly like drivers find it difficult to overtake with the current rules.

Originally Posted by Sodemo

I genuinely don’t see the point in it from a racing point of view.

If two drivers battling use it at the same time whilst battling, it will cancel each other out as neither will gain anything. If a driver behind uses it on a driver in front (who doesn’t use it) well it will be a candy from a baby pass, and the guy in front likely won’t even fight it, so again, pretty pointless.

When the Hybrid technology is fully introduced I’m sure it’s planned success ballast will be done away with completely. And if you are more successful you get less electric power available. Or did I make this up?

[medius]

Gotta feel sorry for Howard Fuller waits years for another got at the BTCC. Gets a call up to drive the VW as a sub but surely if we get going at all this year he won't get any racing mileage?

[S griffin]

And even if if did, Bushell might have recovered enough to drive the car by the time we race again