Ross Brawn new spectacles appeal - Page 2

PaulSands · 30 Jun 2003, 08:06 (Ref:646858)

maybe it's the shared Voda**** sponsorship..some of Alex (we wuz robbed) Ferguson rubbing of on Ross and the gang

Hugh Jarce · 30 Jun 2003, 08:09 (Ref:646859)

®îjñtjûh - I'd forgotten about that one!

All I'd like to say on this one (because Ferrari bashing isn't dignified!) is that I think Brawn let himself and the team down with the immediate post-race interview / comment shown on UK ITV1.

* He reacted out of being pee'd off - better to keep your mouth shut when angry!
* He slagged off another driver big time - raise an issue but don't sling mud!
* He dragged up history - shows a 'bitter' edge. History is history - forget it!

I thought it was at best a bit sad, and at worst unprofessional for a man of his experience and standing.

It's interesting that when his guys have made mistakes that have ruined the races of others (Didn't Trulli get pushed off by MS a few races ago) he backed them no matter what and refused to comment.

I didn't hear him saying "Throughout his career MS is prone to naff moves when under pressure and today has made another such error."

Nope - he classed it OK even though it was a bad mistake. Double standards pal!

My advice to Ross Brawn - keep your mouth shut if you see the 'Red' mist.

climb · 30 Jun 2003, 08:18 (Ref:646869)

Ehy guys!
I'm with you that Ross is wrong (MS himself talked about "a normal contact"), but this doesn't allow anyone to insult him.
He's a man of Ferrari and (despite being wrong) he has the right to express his opinions in the interest of Ferrari, which is not ,of course, that of Montoya.
Nevertheless he cannot have suddenly become the most stupid man on earth, as someone seems to be defining him.

RussianFriend · 30 Jun 2003, 08:22 (Ref:646876)

Quote:

Originally posted by R
Ferrari died with Enzo. And when Jean Alesi left, so did the last remains of the Ferrari spirit.

And now it's just red evil Zombi...

Hugh Jarce · 30 Jun 2003, 08:23 (Ref:646878)

Climb - I haven't called him stupid - just highlighted the clear 'double standards'.

It's hypocrisy to moan about such an incident when its done to your team and totally ignore (with a slight grin) it when you do it to others.

If you want to handle it right either express that both are wrong when interviewed (which wasn't the case after the Trulli incident) or keep your mouth shut on both.

IMO - you can't have it both ways!

RussianFriend · 30 Jun 2003, 08:32 (Ref:646886)

Quote:

Originally posted by Hugh Jarce
Climb - I haven't called him stupid - just highlighted the clear 'double standards'.

It's hypocrisy to moan about such an incident when its done to your team and totally ignore (with a slight grin) it when you do it to others.

The real name of Ross position is Devil's Advocate. He's paid to defence any move his team does and moan and protest when others do the same with his team. He did his job very well. Unfortunatelly for F1.

Hugh Jarce · 30 Jun 2003, 08:38 (Ref:646890)

True - but many others in sport who have to comment on such issues don't take this position.

Everyone can see through it and it's not becomming of a great team to have one of their bosses 'playing the game'.

I don't believe someone like Frank Williams would do this. Someone here may correct me on that one, but I think he comes over with far more dignity that Mr Brawn did on Sunday.

My advice is always keep your mouth shut on contentious issues.

Use a bit of wisdom.
Refrain from commenting until you have reviewed the replay!
Tell the interviewer you didn't get a good view of the incident!
Say you think it's best to first talk to your driver.

We have all seen this done, and know it is the professional thing to do rather than slagging off another competitor.

IMO there's no room for playing Devil's Advocate when you are in his role.

Act like the professional that your position and salary demands of you!

RussianFriend · 30 Jun 2003, 09:03 (Ref:646921)

HJ,
Ross and his employers have different view of beeing professional. "The best defence is an attack" - when his own team involved into very controversal episode with "spectators" he decided to blame somebody else to draw away press attention.

I don't approve Ferrari PR policy. Thank God there're companies and teams still keeping different standard.

climb · 30 Jun 2003, 09:04 (Ref:646922)

Quote:

Originally posted by steve_r
There's a simple way to tell when he is talking - his lips move.

Hugh
I was not referring to your posts; you have to admit that such others are a little bit exagerated, aren't they?

Dutton · 30 Jun 2003, 09:53 (Ref:646968)

Yes, indeed, ghinz: politics is so very boring....

alesi95 · 30 Jun 2003, 10:11 (Ref:646980)

Ferrari is long dead and is now a soleless conglomerate shared by Fiat, Phillip Morris and Vodafone.

So Ross Brawn doesn't think Montoya is a classy driver.

Remember the 94 season Ross? That was real classy. How many times did you cheat?

Is that Classy?

steve_r · 30 Jun 2003, 10:11 (Ref:646981)

Quote:

Originally posted by climb
Hugh
I was not referring to your posts; you have to admit that such others are a little bit exagerated, aren't they?

If you cant tell that my post was a light-hearted joke you need a sense of humor transplant.

Did anyone else in the F1 fraternity back up the big-guys claim?

**ghinzani** · 2 Jul 2003, 10:43 (Ref:649413)

He's off again!what a little tinker he is ;-)
: http://www.autosport.co.uk/featuresi...p?id=23658&s=5

Valve Bounce · 2 Jul 2003, 11:19 (Ref:649454)

Was SchM a classy driver when he:
1. Ran Mika into a concrete wall at Macau
2. Drove Damon off the track in Adelaide so he could win the championship
3. Rammed Jacques in his endeavor to win the championship at Jerez, then told lies afterwards
4. Tried to run his own brother, (poor) Ralf into the concrete pit wall
5. weaved all over the place in front of other drivers to cut them off after the start

Although these questions would best be aimed at Ross Brawn, I doubt he reads our forum, and I doubt if he cared to answer them anyway.

Hugh Jarce · 2 Jul 2003, 14:52 (Ref:649758)

Nive one VB!

I expect RB would say something along the lines of 'Micahel is a great competitor and such 'racing incidents' will occur from time to time.'

**ghinzani** · 2 Jul 2003, 15:07 (Ref:649771)

He's made himself look such a tool has'nt he? especially with Michael the stock car driver on his team, I mean if it was Rubens then maybe we would have more sympathy because he doesnt resort to bumper cars.

Gt_R · 2 Jul 2003, 16:15 (Ref:649810)

Quote Hugh:"* He reacted out of being pee'd off - better to keep your mouth shut when angry!
* He slagged off another driver big time - raise an issue but don't sling mud!
* He dragged up history - shows a 'bitter' edge. History is history - forget it!"

Yet...when VB drags history about Aust94,... "Nive one VB!"

??!!

Now to quote what you said, HJ,"I... just highlighted the clear 'double standards'." in your own words

Com'on, i think it's just a racing incident too, but in the flash of the moment, post race, Ross perhaps is seething at the lost point and from certain angle, the move does look a little optimistic..as much as it is daring. Afterall, Ross can't help but be reminded that JPM-MS clash are too much of a coincidence, where out of 4 high profile clashes, 3 resulted in MS losing positions/car damage (Austria 2001,Malaysia 2002,Nurburgring 2003) and 1, though a great overtaking move, din't end in another misery because MS avoided it and gave in (Brazil 2001). So give him a break...

But its a pretty raw and daring move, well done to JPM.

Dutton · 2 Jul 2003, 18:15 (Ref:649937)

I love it how when it comesto Michael it always comes down to basically 2 incidents (maybe 3/4 if someone is really trying tobe original). Jesus.

MOVE THE HELL ON.

OOOOOOOORRRRRRRRRRRR

Let us have a proper debate about all the drivers, ever, who have ever done something along similar lines.

You will see it is quite regular, in my view.

**ghinzani** · 2 Jul 2003, 18:39 (Ref:649958)

Yeah but Ross had time to reconsider before he gave that interview - nuff said.

Gt_R · 3 Jul 2003, 01:40 (Ref:650367)

But who can be more sore than a particular team boss from Mclaren

The ultimate sour grape if you ask me...

Valve Bounce · 3 Jul 2003, 04:18 (Ref:650422)

I checked out the link that ghinzani posted and I couldn't help laugh at the irony when Ross says that SchM and Mika always had clean battles. Then I remember Macau vividly, Mika sitting on the road after SchM ran him into a concrete wall - what a classy driver!!, and I started to laugh at Ross Brawn's comments. To be fair, they are no sillier than the many stupid comments coming out of Ron Dennis - almost as silly as David Campese.

I had vowed never to revisit Jerez nor Adelaide, and I will never go into these two incidents again in any discussion. However, listing them for historical (and hysterical

) purposes does not constitute any discussion on my part.

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