Sportscar/GT (and Le Mans) Rumours and Repetition

[Pandamasque]

The key word here is 'customer'.

PS. Love the quote in signature above. Sums up why I hate DRS.

[Christian Mogami]

Level 5

He has the money to run a two car team in WEC.
Lately he likes to stay away from America
and by every day is getting more dislike for the NASCAR
P2/DP merg.


Greg Pickett(Muscle Milk) will not race under Nascar and at the last race(Laguna Seca) talked off the record that they will be in WEC next year.
He wouldn't race unless he had a car that could win(2014 coupe).

Rebellion have too wait and see

[Speed-King]

Tucker's team manager has gone on the record stating that they want to run in a Pro/Am class, though. P1 would be the opposite of that.

[Christian Mogami]

Mr Tucker likes to take on the next game(win privateer p1).

And he sees that Strakka has an am driver owner,who does ok.

[Breitling24]

Originally Posted by Christian Mogami

Greg Pickett(Muscle Milk) will not race under Nascar and at the last race(Laguna Seca) talked off the record that they will be in WEC next year.

Guess that "off the record" isn't so any longer.

[Christian Mogami]

Honda gave HPD the ok for the 2014 LMP1 project (the formula fits in their marketing plans... 'powertrain efficiency').

All HPD has to do now is find a team or teams to buy it!

So all we are waiting for is to see what team/teams sign the contract.

[Canada ALMS fan]

Originally Posted by Christian Mogami

Greg Pickett(Muscle Milk) will not race under Nascar and at the last race(Laguna Seca) talked off the record that they will be in WEC next year.
He wouldn't race unless he had a car that could win(2014 coupe).

He also said he could be in Indycar or stay in the USCR so....

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Mal

Being left field - it couldn't be McLaren could it - or someone associated with them?

Originally Posted by GT6

The whole point of rumours is that you can suggest anything

How about the return of "talbot"

There has been rumors about a Talbot brand revive. But that was as a Dacia competitor, running the old PSA platforms at a bargain price.

But as the brand is owned by PSA, I guess it's unlikely

[GT6]

I was trying to think of the most unlikely name from Le mans history and came up with Talbot.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by GT6

I was trying to think of the most unlikely name from Le mans history and came up with Talbot.

In a scary way, I'm sad to think that Mercedes is even more unlikely.

[vincegail]

After '55 and '99, the only way Mercedes is going back to Le Mans is when it's a 100% sure they will lock out the podium. And we all know that's almost impossible to achieve, so does Mercedes, so we'll never see them again I fear.

[TF110]

I think the SLS could do well in (if) GTE. I dont know about never coming back, I would hope thats not the case.

[GT6]

The way things are going at the top level with porsche and Audi if BMW send a car either GT or LMP to le mans the pressure on mercedes to be there will be to hard to resist IMHO

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by GT6

The way things are going at the top level with porsche and Audi if BMW send a car either GT or LMP to le mans the pressure on mercedes to be there will be to hard to resist IMHO

Really hoping BMW will send the Z4 into the GTE battle next year.

[GT6]

I am sure that is there ultimate aim but the GT class is looking very full already so they will have to be planning already and I am sure they are

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by GT6

I am sure that is there ultimate aim but the GT class is looking very full already so they will have to be planning already and I am sure they are

You're right. If they want to take two cars they just need to say the word and the ACO will grant that. By next June they will be winning consistently IMO.

I think a lot more depends on the USCR next year. There's an interesting question there as to whether we'll see an upturn in American teams or maybe they'll look to stay away and concentrate on a big year domestically.

We've certainly seen an upward surge in terms of entries from North American drivers. There's around 20 I think at Le Mans this year and a whole load more drivers who are US-based.

We need more American/USCR teams at the big race.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by TF110

I think the SLS could do well in (if) GTE. I dont know about never coming back, I would hope thats not the case.

From what I've heard, AMG are pretty much done with the SLS GT3 project. They are happy to sell additonal cars to anyone who has the necessary €400.000, but it really is just a customer program - much more so than Audi's GT3 effort for example.

That could mean two things: a) they have free capabilities to take the car to GTE or b) they are not interested in doing anything more with it than having a nice customer program that also happens to be a profit center.

[gustavobamba]

I´m talking about some team´s in a closely future using the 1.6 V6 Turbo engines but I would like to ask to anyone in this forum if is that possible?
I heard that the engine could be easily tuned for endurance, is that right??

Didn´t the ACO in the 2014 rules assume that the new F1 engines could be used in Endurance?

If all of this is correct, then Mercedes; Renault; Ferrari; Honda and possible Ford will have engines suitable for Private teams right????? P1 engine´s

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by gustavobamba

I´m talking about some team´s in a closely future using the 1.6 V6 Turbo engines but I would like to ask to anyone in this forum if is that possible?
I heard that the engine could be easily tuned for endurance, is that right??

Didn´t the ACO in the 2014 rules assume that the new F1 engines could be used in Endurance?

If all of this is correct, then Mercedes; Renault; Ferrari; Honda and possible Ford will have engines suitable for Private teams right????? P1 engine´s

1992 - Biggest reason why F1 and Prototypes cannot use the same engines.

[Gingers4Justice]

Originally Posted by Salamus

1992 - Biggest reason why F1 and Prototypes cannot use the same engines.

I can see the fear factor, but these are totally different circumstances.

[isynge]

Originally Posted by Salamus

1992 - Biggest reason why F1 and Prototypes cannot use the same engines.

Think your core point is right, in that the price point for a 2014 F1 spec engine is probably going to be way beyond the budget most teams have in mind, which is the core driver behind why 1992 happened - not a shortage of cars and engines, but a catastrophic absence of budgets to run them, all connected with the underlying economic situation. As an aside, there's an interesting story that the C91 more or less broke Walter Brun, which is pretty illustrative of what the price point looks like.

But let's broaden our perspective. 1972 introduced a common suite of engine regs, and while there is a school of thought that claims the end of the 917/512 era ushered in some form of dark ages, the presence of perfectly valid engine options from Matra, Alfa Romeo, Ferrari, and Cosworth, to say nothing of grandfathered in Porsche options, all looked perfectly valid, and led to a serviceable, if not classic, decade.

So let's look at 2014. If F1 engine manufacturers want to charge going rate for engines (and let's take the cited number of Renault's 17 million - never clear whether this is USD, GBP, or EUR) then it's going to be a non-starter without someone with very deep pockets suddenly having an urge to go out and win Le Mans. But turn this on its head, 17 million is probably a pretty arbitrary figure for a major manufacturer, because you have to look at offsetting the investment in terms of what it does for your brand - and if you figure that's all sorted by the simple presence in F1, then actually all your doing by charging for engines is recouping some cashflow. At that point you don't need to charge the 17 million, you can charge what you like, and the payback can be measured in additional exposure, which might change the financial picture quite a lot.

In short - speculatively if Mercedes reckon the sunk investment in their F1 programme gives them the ability, as a by product, to lock out the podium at Le Mans through giving a team the engines to bodge into the back of a Perrinn doesn't the equation start to look different?

Obviously this might not happen - it's completely reliant on there being a value proposition to be made from competing at Le Mans, which despite our predilections, isn't a done deal, but it does mean the correlation of engine convergence in 1992 and 2014, doesn't mean causation that 2014 will be like 1992.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by Salamus

1992 - Biggest reason why F1 and Prototypes cannot use the same engines.

Bad analogy. 1992 forced to use same 3.5L configuration, 2014 does not force a configuration at all. And nothing in the regulations specifically favors the F1 V6s as opposed to a clean sheet design.

[Baigu]

Besides factory teams or semi-works teams, I dont see any customers getting F1 engines, too much secret around them. Manufacturers wont risk getting there innovations stolen. The only way customers are getting F1 engines would be using 2014 F1 engines in 2015...

[zanfo zanfagni]

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

I can see the fear factor, but these are totally different circumstances.

Totally agree. '90 WSC used the same engines and transmissions taken directly from an F1. A 2014 V6 F1 turbo unit would require extensive modifies to be used in an lmp1. Do you think that Mercedes, Renault, Honda and Ferrari will invest money to develope this modified engine just to supply it to some private team? In a parallele universe maybe. Don't forget that renault will ask 22ml€ per season to the teams that will use their new engine. Private lmp1 teams have a whole season budget less than that.

[Christian Mogami]

Most likely a lease program on a petrol HPD 2.2-2.4L Indy V6 turbo with or with-out hybrid option and you can still buy the NA 3.4L V8 too.

With the budget that Honda gives HPD their not going to make a new engine and HPD has nothing to do with the new Honda F1 V6 e-turbo engine and the price problem of using it (15-20 mil a year).What privateer team can afford that?

Now if Honda backs the program to get their feet wet before F1 in 2015,then we might see the 1.6L V6 e-turbo!

Also HPD can surprise use and add turbos to the 3.4L V8.