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24 Apr 2014, 15:50 (Ref:3397779) | #376 | |
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I'm up for the return of sparks tbf.
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24 Apr 2014, 16:26 (Ref:3397790) | #377 | ||
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I've wanted them to get rid of the wooden plank for decades. However then people bring up the fact that one of the possible theories over the death of Ayrton Senna was the fact that his car bottomed out excessively, causing the aero to stall. I'm no expert in car dynamics, nor am I crash investigator, however I personally subscribe to the steering column failure. Anyway, I digress, what would they do, replace the wooden plank with a titanium one? Would they do away with the plank all together?
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25 Apr 2014, 01:49 (Ref:3397955) | #378 | |||
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They still use a wooden plank under the car? On a serious note.. I'm all for glowing brakes and sparking cars. They need to get rid of the brake ducts (which are more of an aero component these days than brake cooling) and bring back active suspension. Would be good additions to the regulations IMO. |
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25 Apr 2014, 04:59 (Ref:3397981) | #379 | ||
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It also had to be completely flat and unbroken which neatly prevented the clever from misinterpreting the usually badly and inaccurately drafted F1 legislation. But why not change the plank with titanium inserts to a high tech multi-layered carbon fibre and kevlar composite honeycomb structure of specified density and abrasion resistance, better yet, use sensors of dodgy reliability feeding back instantaneous ride heights to the event stewards. Or just use the bottom of the chassis! Achieving what? Every class of racing should think about the plank rule, it is cheap effective and stops huge damage to the underside of the car! |
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25 Apr 2014, 10:30 (Ref:3398073) | #380 | |
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Mentioning of sparks brings back memories of Senna and Mansell in Spain. Enough said.
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25 Apr 2014, 12:35 (Ref:3398102) | #381 | ||
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25 Apr 2014, 12:47 (Ref:3398105) | #382 | |
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25 Apr 2014, 13:26 (Ref:3398116) | #383 | ||
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In any case the bottoming of the car is very undesirable, because it slows the car down and could make the driver lose control abruptly. However, as limited wear to the wooden plank is tolerated, it did not prevent the cars from bottoming. Either a very high ride height or active suspension would.
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25 Apr 2014, 13:42 (Ref:3398121) | #384 | |
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Something like titanium pads clearly work, but they work too well. They allow the car to ride on them for extended periods. However, the wood will quickly wear if used in the same way. For the wood planks, occasional bottoming out is fine, dragging the bottom down the front straight is not. I haven't looked at those regulations for quite a awhile, but I believe they measure the plank post race to look for excessive wear.
Ultimately the question is if riding on stops for an extended period is OK or not. This goes to the points above about the Senna accident. I also suspect it was more of an issue with the steering column, but who wants to undo anything that can be viewed as a "safety" component. It also may be viewed as a regulation that is simple and "just works". So I don't see this getting changed anytime soon. Regardless, if active suspension shows up, I expect aero will be set to work at a specific optimum ride height and it will be more of the active suspension that solves this problem more than anything else. Lastly... Wood is an awesome material. It may not be quite as flashy as CF or other man made composites, but as a natural material, it is quite good. Richard |
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25 Apr 2014, 15:18 (Ref:3398152) | #386 | ||
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The Strategy Work Group's proposals are mostly aimed to add visual drama artificially. I hope this is not the best they can come up with.
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25 Apr 2014, 16:24 (Ref:3398170) | #387 | ||
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25 Apr 2014, 17:05 (Ref:3398189) | #388 | |||
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Quote:
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25 Apr 2014, 17:19 (Ref:3398196) | #389 | |
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25 Apr 2014, 18:17 (Ref:3398212) | #390 | |||
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skid_block F3000 & F3 have also jused Jabroc. I thought Indycars did too, but apparently not. I liked the sparks! |
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25 Apr 2014, 18:20 (Ref:3398215) | #391 | ||
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25 Apr 2014, 19:08 (Ref:3398239) | #392 | ||
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AekgFOcqOkg
These Indycars can seem to bottom out at over 200mph. This is what I mean, it seems to be quite commonplace in other series, but yet, have there been accidents because of this? You'd have thought that if there was a danger, then this kind of racing where the speed is constantly high would expose that risk. I still don't think bottoming caused Senna's crash, i'm sorry for bringing it up, I know its an emotive topic for many, but when such a phenomenon like this (bottoming) is commonplace and has been so for years, where does the risk come from? |
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25 Apr 2014, 19:23 (Ref:3398242) | #393 | ||
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At the time of Senna's accident active suspension had recently been banned and Williams was the team using it for the longest period. With a flat bottomed car to work well aerodynamically it was necessary to have a stable platform and as close as possible to constant ride height. If a car car with a flat bottom bottomed out at the wrong time there could be very little air going under the car causing a complete loss of underfloor downforce. Were this to happen in the cornering phase then a loss of control by the driver is quite possible. |
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25 Apr 2014, 20:05 (Ref:3398249) | #394 | ||
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One could doubt the necessity of the wooden plank since the introduction of the stepped floor in the 1995 season.
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25 Apr 2014, 20:44 (Ref:3398260) | #395 | |
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Was the wooden plank introduced to prevent bottoming? I thought it was purely to cut downforce levels in a very significant and dramatic way, by forcing a raised ride height.
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25 Apr 2014, 21:35 (Ref:3398277) | #396 | |
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It would have raised the ride height and changed the underbody aero and the fact that it wasen't allowed to be worn away meant that running as close to the ground was no longer an option.
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26 Apr 2014, 00:21 (Ref:3398320) | #397 | ||
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Especially the wood bit, very underrated material! If you want sparks all you need are titanium rubbing blocks, that is the material that generates the showers of sparks that look so spectacular. Titanium framing on edges of the plank should do a great job. |
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28 Apr 2014, 10:37 (Ref:3399138) | #398 | ||
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A great article on the proposed changes.
Analysis: Active suspension, sparks, and glowing brakes – The F1 Strategy Group’s proposals to spice up F1 Worth a read. |
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28 Apr 2014, 23:11 (Ref:3399419) | #399 | ||
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Solid wing end plates and constant chord wings should save money and bring them back, but they would just be artificial now! Why not give fairy lights a go too! P.S. Take more down force off! |
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29 Apr 2014, 15:51 (Ref:3399705) | #400 | |||
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