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25 Jul 2011, 10:22 (Ref:2930818) | #401 | ||
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I thought my point was clear enough. Any drivers signing session I've ever attended (Indy Cars, V8 Supercars and local series) had drivers competing in an existing series meeting their fans, signing posters, talking about the racing etc. To me, drivers should first earn the respect of the fans by racing in the class they represent. You might call it Mana. Anything less is a rort! This proposed class has one prototype, hasn't run a race yet and might not yet. On top of that, the guys running this ship appear to have made a lot of fairly powerful enemies in a sport that isn't big enough in this country to have this sort of disharmony. And that's just wrong!
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25 Jul 2011, 10:39 (Ref:2930828) | #402 | ||
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Just for clarity, can someone confirm if the new NZ V8 is a spaceframe (with a choice of relevant Ford/ Holden engines & appropriate panels), whilst the NZ ST is a monocoque (with a spec LS7 engine & a choice of panels to represent a variety of cars, is that basically right??
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25 Jul 2011, 10:48 (Ref:2930832) | #403 | |
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I'd call it promotion, something that the SuperTourers so far seem to have a good handle on. When I was there on Saturday there seemed to be no shortage of people queing up for said posters so I can only assume there was demand for them? You obviously have your opinions but I personally cannot see how any of these drivers signing posters at a race meeting is acceptable but when doing so to promote and generate interest in a future event it is not Your reasoning seems to suggest that there should be no promotion or leveraging of the people involved until there are successful race meetings happening...you can't have the latter unless you do the former. One thing I do get the feeling they have grasped is that the people/personalities are as (if not more) important as the cars. NASCAR and Supercars have got this bit right and fans tend to follow driver first, car second.
I had a quick look at the new NZV8 car, it was quick mainly because although the car looked nice there was no one of 'interest' to me on the stand except to watch Clint Brown rah rah for a few moments in front of the camera. |
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25 Jul 2011, 10:51 (Ref:2930834) | #404 | ||
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25 Jul 2011, 20:06 (Ref:2931048) | #405 | |
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When you hear stories of young drivers being told that this series will get them a factory drive and that there has been no series sponsors announced or no series meeting structure announced and no TV program and media support package announced etc one can't help but think that Team Kiwi is the mastermind behind all this
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25 Jul 2011, 20:28 (Ref:2931056) | #406 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 383
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Both cars are spaceframes with the appropriate body panels nailed on.
A pity NZV8's couldn't get anyone better than Clint Brown to promote their new product. I threw out some mouldy cheese from the fridge the other day that was fresher than he is.......... I really feel for these guys, I do think they have been screwed big time. As far as the signing sessions go, I can see your point OTI, but I guess this is just clever leveraging by V8ST's off existing series and their respective "superstars" to try to promote a new product, a little underhand maybe but it obviously works. And when it comes to posters, punters would form a queue to a signing session for dwarfs racing miniature horses if the posters were free! The V8ST's appear to have the jump already with "the car" and the driver lineup already sorted. But there is now a big question mark hanging over whether they can actually use "the car" as the other side is claiming it belongs to them?? A series has been announced but it will only run at two tracks, and unlikely to become a support race for V8SC in the immediate future. There will be no "national status" and a promoter/owner/organiser with a long reputation as a rogue. There is no announcement yet of a major sponsor, and many questions yet to answered, such as will Holden Motorsport allow the use of the V8SC body panels, will Ford give their blessing to put Ford panels on a GM engined car etc. etc. The other series retains the national status, and its current major sponsor, has a "new" car that has been hastily built to put on a good front for the media, but appears to have lost the demon car, and many of its "star" drivers. The gloves will be well and truly off now between the two series to get any traction they possibly can. Unfortunately there won't be a good outcome for both sides, and possibly neither. The ****fight is far from over! Last edited by Woolley; 25 Jul 2011 at 21:53. Reason: autocensor is there for a reason. |
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25 Jul 2011, 20:37 (Ref:2931060) | #407 | |
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Fair enough, everyone is entitled to their opinions, but at least read some things before stating a fact that is already out of date, latest schedule for the Supertourers put them at four tracks over their 7 rounds.
Sprint Championship Round 1: 17-19 February – Hampton Downs Motorsport Park, North Waikato Round 2: 30 March – 1 April – Powerbuilt Tools Raceway, Christchurch Round 3: 27-29 April – Manfeild, Fielding Round 4: 18-20 May – Hampton Downs Motorsport Park, North Waikato Endurance Championship Round 5: 10-12 August – Taupo Motorsport Park, Taupo Round 6: 21-23 September – Hampton Downs Motorsport Park, North Waikato Round 7: 26-28 October – Final, Powerbuilt Tools Raceway, Christchurch Also over the weekend I see they have confirmed the NZ Honda Cup as one of their supports at Round 1, running alongside the CMC. |
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25 Jul 2011, 20:40 (Ref:2931064) | #408 | ||
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25 Jul 2011, 20:46 (Ref:2931066) | #409 | |
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Okay I stand corrected! Lets hope they still have a car they can race at all of those tracks then!
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25 Jul 2011, 20:50 (Ref:2931068) | #410 | ||
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every one has a 'wish list' |
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25 Jul 2011, 21:08 (Ref:2931073) | #411 | |
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Manfield website doesn't have the BNT NZV8's either, dun dun duhhhhhh.
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25 Jul 2011, 21:50 (Ref:2931089) | #412 | ||
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I'd say more 'posturing' than promotion.
Not at all, promotion is very important. But I think an old phrase applies here ; You have to "earn your stripes". I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. |
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26 Jul 2011, 00:00 (Ref:2931139) | #413 | ||
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Sounds like an interesting battle in the weekend and I hear ST sold plenty of tickets but both parties apparently have no ownership in the IP of the chassis. The manufacturer who designed it and built it is the owner so maybe both parties should save their legal funds to go and buy it from him if they want to throw their ego's around.
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26 Jul 2011, 00:20 (Ref:2931142) | #414 | |
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As with any decent train smash it never boils down to one simple point. The IP is apparently just one thing.
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26 Jul 2011, 02:15 (Ref:2931159) | #415 | ||||
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I suspect neither side is going to "win" and the harder the fight gets, the less likely we'll see the two sides get together to work out a solution that's going to best for me, the casual motorsport fan. |
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26 Jul 2011, 08:39 (Ref:2931218) | #416 | |||
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BTW, where is Mark?? seems to be very quiet of late?? |
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26 Jul 2011, 09:01 (Ref:2931223) | #417 | |||
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Nice one, Centurion! |
26 Jul 2011, 22:52 (Ref:2931547) | #418 | |||
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Pretty damning article on the V8ST/NZV8 split
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26 Jul 2011, 23:36 (Ref:2931560) | #419 | ||
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Well said. As soon as people go racing for a profit you can be pretty sure the sport will suffer. Wouldn't it be nice if both sides would just pull their heads in and just get on with the racing in a single series? Frankly, they should both be ashamed of themselves.
Not a chance, I suspect. |
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27 Jul 2011, 00:21 (Ref:2931574) | #420 | |||
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Nice one, Centurion! |
27 Jul 2011, 02:01 (Ref:2931588) | #421 | ||
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I think a lot of times when CAMS and MNZ got involved with series like this, it was with good intentions, but it is best for these organizations to be a level above as an overseer of safety, licensing and so on. You just end up with too many conflicts of interests and politics. Best to let private enterprise run with it. |
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27 Jul 2011, 02:36 (Ref:2931590) | #422 | ||
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Motorsport NZ is the major shareholder in TMC, the full shareholding list from the Companies Site is below, but most of the circuits (via the clubs that own them) have a shareholding also.
THE MOTORSPORT COMPANY LIMITED Total Number of Shares:150000 Extensive Shareholding:No Shareholders in Allocation: 90000 shares MOTORSPORT NEW ZEALAND INCORPORATED 11250 shares SOUTHLAND SPORTS CAR CLUB INCORPORATED 11250 shares SOUTH CANTERBURY CAR CLUB INCORPORATED 11250 shares THE CANTERBURY CAR CLUB INCORPORATED 11250 shares THE MANAWATU CAR CLUB (INCORPORATED) 7500 shares TAUPO CAR CLUB INCORPORATED 7500 shares NZ INTERNATIONAL GRAND PRIX (AUCK) INC As I remember it, TMC was set up at a time when getting someone to promote the Summer Series was a problem and so I think it was setup with good intentions. It has been suggested by others that MSNZ being the regulator and (effectively) the promoter is a conflict of interest. But it also could be argued that they will (or at least should) have the sports best interest in mind. You do not seem to see (or at least I haven't) the same sort of conflict going on with the equivalent Rally Promotions company (Rally of New Zealand Limited) who are now running both the International Rally and the National Rally series. If this is the case can we learn something from this side of the sport. Last edited by MS Fan; 27 Jul 2011 at 02:58. |
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27 Jul 2011, 03:18 (Ref:2931595) | #423 | ||
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Some very interesting discussion going on in this thread, and for the most part very civil too! |
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27 Jul 2011, 04:11 (Ref:2931609) | #424 | |||
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Maybe it all comes down to personalities... I think TEEGA became VEEGA after a sort of bust-up between the teams and TMC, but I don't know the intricacies of what went down. VEEGA are still tied contractually to TMC is my understanding, how exactly I don't know. |
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Nice one, Centurion! |
27 Jul 2011, 04:16 (Ref:2931611) | #425 | ||
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The bit I don't get then is how one lot can contest the other lot over IP when a 3rd party built the car, and probably provided some design elements/guidance as well as part of that process.
There's a number of interesting other questions too, such as which of the parties at war left Speedshow first, and who actually owns race car car IP, along with specualtion Ford will only let a Ford run with a Ford engine? Oh boy, oh boy!! |
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