Only 4 Teams survived the last decade

[Dutton]

The age of the privateer is pretty much dead (for the time being at least). With the exception of Arabian Princes, or a State, or somethng else that isn't a manufacturer but has a ridiculous disposal income starting one.

[Adam43]

Is this any different to other eras of F1?

[Dutton]

I would say it is.

In the last decade the sheer scales and complexities of what it takes to succeed in F1.....the overall global economic development with this too....

I think the situation is quite different.

[Kicking-back]

Since 1983, only McLaren, Williams and Michael Schumacher have won championships.

So, the comparative difficulty of winning the big prize is as much as ever.

[Dutton]

Rather more difficult, I would say.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Dutton

I would say it is.

In the last decade the sheer scales and complexities of what it takes to succeed in F1.....the overall global economic development with this too....

I think the situation is quite different.

I agree that the situation is different. However in other ways we have more stbility in terms of teams. I'm not saying one way or the other, but perhaps some thought need to be given to previous eras and how manufacturers flitted in and out with ease. Remember the Penske from a few days ago - a good example of a good team doing jsut that. Also consider 1959 - some races that year had few teams and drivers.

[Dutton]

I am not trying to suggest there is instability, in a lot of ways kind of the contrary.

As I said at some point, perhaps in another thread, a departing manufacturer, unless there are extreme circumstances preventing it, will always sell the team on first. So you end up with yoyyoing ownership but a pretty consistent team base.

I don't have a great demmand for having to have loads of teams. I would like more teams, it is always fun having more competitors on track. HOWEVER, I would much prefer fewer teams that are, releatively speaking, more or less competitive than say 5 more teams where 4 of them are rather crap.

As things stand, I think, in terms of the number of teams with solid foundations and real potential/present realities, the situation is rather impressive. Not fully appreciated I would say, to a large extent.

I often feel went can't see the woods for the trees, as it were.

[Born Racer]

Since 1983, only McLaren, Williams and Michael Schumacher have won championships.

[Kicking-back]

Why the puzzlement?

It's absolutely true

[Dutton]

Well you didn't mention Ferrari seperately of Michael, as the WCC's could be considered a Ferrrari achievement and not Michael's - the two absolutely MUST be considered seperately in 1999, but I would argue every year.

There is also the 1995 WCC for Benneton.

I suppose yur wording could cause confusion and be taken as you including 1983, which, as we know, Ferrari won (unless I am going insane).

[Kicking-back]

Solely talking about drivers titles.

I tend not to care about the constructors championship - I'm not into cars.

[Dutton]

Come to think of it, Piquet won the 1983 WDC in hois Brabham. Since you know that, presumably you were not meaning to include 1983 in the title years. A potential confusion in your post.

Also that you used Williams and Mclaren without adding you meant their drivers only, and refering to championships rather than specifying only WDC made it seem you were encompassing both.

It is no big deal, and in your post at 18:02 you clarified this matter quite clearly. Just thoughtI would add where the confusions probably came from - although, I am sure, you have sussed it out ! :-)

[Korr]

If you look at all the teams that are currently in F1, there's only ONE team that hasn't changed ownership at all.

[DKGandBH]

Yeah...
It's not like Fiat bought them... Or GM...

DKGandBH

[Louis B.]

I also hear, from time to time, the voice of Enzo Ferrari himself complaining about the harm Montezelo & Todt did to the image of his beloved team & sport (the 2002 scandal in Austria is one example; this year's "opportunism" at Indy is another).

[Dutton]

Korr, over all time, yes, but it is the last decade we are talking about.

[DKGandBH]

.

[Korr]

I was hoping someone would say Williams!

[Nicholosophy]

It's always good to see Ferarri bashing get in the way of a good discussion But back on topic...

Change is inevitable. More teams would be nice; but there has to be conditions condusive to other people/companies wanting to start teams.

[Adam43]

Is this normal? (revisited).

OK we are considering '96 to '06 (as we still for the moment have Sauber and Jordan).
So that is Williams, McLaren, Ferrari, Minardi.

What about the previous ten year lots. This is very much of the top of my head. If you can think of any other teams do say.

'86 - '96 I make it 7 teams hat were around at both.
Williams, McLaren, Ferrari, Ligier, Benetton, Tyrell, Arrows.

'76 - 86 7 teams
McLaren, Ferrari, Tyrell, Lotus, Brabham, Williams, Ligier

'66 - '76 4 teams
Brabham, Ferrari, McLaren, Williams

'56 - '66 2 teams
Ferrari, BRM

the thing that strikes me most is that in the past when teams died they died now they are re-named. I'm not sure whether that is better or worse.

[Hazard]

Of course Minardi was quite heavily bought out by Stoddart...it's just great he kept the name.

In 1996 it was Minardi Scuderia Italia still wasn't it, after merging with BMS Scuderia Italia in 1994?

[Adam43]

Good point, so is that only three then for '96 to '06? On a similar note you can rule out McLaren in the '76 to '86 bracket. Or Brabham in the '66 to '76 and '76 to '86 (I think, when did Bernie sell?) bracket too. And possible Ferrari, depending on your views of Fiat

[Raglanparade]

I dont think Williams were in f1 in 1966 :P

[Adam43]

Your right, I wrote my guesses on a piece of paper and then copied them wrong. The '66 to '76 Williams should, of course, read Lotus.