GT1 to be dropped from ACO racing

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Birddog07

Sounds like a good move to me. Now if they open the LMGT AM for GT3 cars they will be money. Hopefully the ALMS will follow suit and drop the lame GTC category. I wonder if GT AM cars will basically be GT2 cars with AM drivers, or if they will be homoligated cars with development freeze (aka GT3).

Sounds like it will all be current GT2 cars, with the Pros having the latest spec and Ams getting last years spec. IMO, GT2 needs sped up alittle, carbon brakes, that'll be a good 'LMGT Pro' class. GT AM should be the current GT3 structure, but ACO still wants to keep it all Am drivers rather than Pro-Am, which is a good choice IMO, saves money on a Pro drivers check aswell as further splits the classes. Wonder if they'll do something similar with the new LMP's? I'd be for that.

ALMS will not drop GTC.



L.P.

[6157]

Originally Posted by Gil Abobeleira

The Rat (and Nissan!) won't be happy...

The Rat can go take a walk off a cliff.

[Sportscarguy08]

I am surprised the reaction most have had on GT1s demise at Le Mans. More so, that the race has not even started!


I think that this is not the best time for the ACO to be transforming the regs like this. I am almost certain there there will be NO Corvette GT2s raced in Europe next year, due to the car's HEFTY price tag. The worlds economy is still hurting and the new rules forces teams not in GT2, to buy brand new cars.

GT1 is great for what it is (sprint) however I think they should still be allowed atleast one endurance race a year, whether its Le Mans or Spa.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Sportscarguy08

I am surprised the reaction most have had on GT1s demise at Le Mans. More so, that the race has not even started!


I think that this is not the best time for the ACO to be transforming the regs like this. I am almost certain there there will be NO Corvette GT2s raced in Europe next year, due to the car's HEFTY price tag. The worlds economy is still hurting and the new rules forces teams not in GT2, to buy brand new cars.

GT1 is great for what it is (sprint) however I think they should still be allowed atleast one endurance race a year, whether its Le Mans or Spa.

Le Mans GT-1 died last year!
It is the best time to show/inform all teams and mfgs. that the Rats Sprint GT-1s will not be afforded special treatment! The reasons given by the ACO for this decision are spot on!



L.P.

[Fogelhund]

Most people knew that this incarnation of GT1 was coming to an end soon at LM, I think more people were shocked that the ACO allowed SRO's GT1 another year, than the number shocked that GT1 was dropped.

Even the people at Nissan were told that GT1 was on the way out... several years ago.

[I Rosputnik]

To toss something up, -ignoring the fact it uses GT1's- if the GT1 WC races were the same length as Japan's super GT (300K/400K) would it be more creditable?

It's worked over in Japan.

[Birddog07]

More tidbits on PLM.

http://www.planetlemans.com/2010/06/...at-the-future/

GT Racing

With eight GT1 cars here and only a couple on average in each Le Mans Series race the ACO has decided to no longer allow GT1 cars in the 24 Hours of Le Mans. Three reasons were given:

- Numerous date clashes on the calendars
- Very small fields outside the 24 Hours of Le Mans
- Current category is entirely sprint based

As a result the ACO has created a GT Endurance category with a single set of regulations valid between 2011 and 2013. The regulations are based on the 2009 regulations with some modifications:

- Steering wheel-mounted paddleshifts
- 1 evolution per year allowed
- 2 evolutions per year allowed for new cars
- Measures to reduce top speed without reducing power (it is believed to a maximum of 290kph)

The GT Endurance category will have two classes:
- GT Endurance PRO – professional category, cars and drivers free
- GT Endurance AM – cars over one year old and a minimum of two drivers classified in the bronze or silver categories

It was also confirmed that the ACO is already working on the rules for 2014-2015 in cooperation with all the manufacturers.

Sounds good. I still think they should have GT3 cars for the GT AM. Any arguement that they are sprint cars is BS, they compete fine in many endurance races (Spa and Nurburgring the ones which first come to mind). The teams in Europe are abundant and I'd love for the ALMS to adopt a LM GT3.

[I Rosputnik]

Originally Posted by Birddog07

More tidbits on PLM.

http://www.planetlemans.com/2010/06/...at-the-future/



Sounds good. I still think they should have GT3 cars for the GT AM. Any arguement that they are sprint cars is BS, they compete fine in many endurance races (Spa and Nurburgring the ones which first come to mind). The teams in Europe are abundant and I'd love for the ALMS to adopt a LM GT3.

If GT2 is being renamed GT Edurance, then I see no problem in GT1 becoming GT Sprint. No sure what you could call GT3.

[KA]

Originally Posted by E-racer

You are missing the point. The GT1 world championship was created to be just that. A GT1 world championship. Le Mans isn't part of that. Bartels happily raced in gt1 for ages with no shot at Le Mans and that didn't seem to bother him. On a separate note I can't believe that some people prefer Gt2 cars to 6 litre v12 GT1. I will really miss these cars next year...

I wouldn't be surprised if Nissan see it slightly differently...

[Purist]

With how upright and blunt the GT-R GT1 is compared to the other cars in the class, do you honestly think it would have stood a chance at Le Mans? With this in mind, do you think they had Le Mans in mind when they designed it?

[I Rosputnik]

I guess not, the thing is a tank. When you compare it to the MC12, it drawfs it.

[Birddog07]

Originally Posted by I Rosputnik

If GT2 is being renamed GT Edurance, then I see no problem in GT1 becoming GT Sprint. No sure what you could call GT3.

But the point isn't to have a sprint class, since Le Mans type races are all enduros. GT2 is being turned into LMGT, with classes for pros/manufactuers and ametuers/privateers in the same cars. You really don't see so many true privateer GT2 teams running AM drivers (why the GT2 Euro Cup failed, right?) so why not just have the privateers/AM's run GT3 cars? Lots of teams that would probalbly be interested. If not full European (and/or possibly International?) seasons, then atleast their national LMS endurance round.

[JAG]

I like the idea of a 290kph speed limiter as this means cars can run with 500bhp+ like their road going equivalent while still keeping them pegged behind the P1/P2's on the straights.

Allowing Paddle shifts is also a good move.

I'm not sure what the evolution rules would allow but GT Endurance PRO sounds very much like a GT2+ class.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by I Rosputnik

If GT2 is being renamed GT Edurance, then I see no problem in GT1 becoming GT Sprint. No sure what you could call GT3.

I'd prefer LMGT over GT Endurance. GT Sprint sounds great but is now a support class of the Italian Superstars, so it won't go. And don't forget that GT4 might also need a new name.

[Flat12-Aircool]

Originally Posted by JAG

I like the idea of a 290kph speed limiter as this means cars can run with 500bhp+ like their road going equivalent while still keeping them pegged behind the P1/P2's on the straights.

It shouldn't be too difficult to do, looking at last years Le Mans qualifying speed trap data the fastest GT2 was a Porsche 911 GT3 RSR going 286.46kph.

Even the GT1's were struggling to break the 290kph barrier, with a Corvette doing 290.81kph.

[cmk]

Originally Posted by Birddog07

But the point isn't to have a sprint class, since Le Mans type races are all enduros. GT2 is being turned into LMGT, with classes for pros/manufactuers and ametuers/privateers in the same cars. You really don't see so many true privateer GT2 teams running AM drivers (why the GT2 Euro Cup failed, right?) so why not just have the privateers/AM's run GT3 cars? Lots of teams that would probalbly be interested. If not full European (and/or possibly International?) seasons, then atleast their national LMS endurance round.

I think the reason GT2 Euro Cup failed is not that privateer or semi-privateers don't run Pro-Am or Am-Am GT2 cars, but rather that there was already a perfectly suitable and popular venue for sprint races in those cars; GT Open. This is a different sort of package, based on substantially longer races. I am perfectly fine keeping GT3 with its totally absurd pace of vehicle development from several manufacturers out of the ACO-regs sportscar world.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Flat12-Aircool

It shouldn't be too difficult to do, looking at last years Le Mans qualifying speed trap data the fastest GT2 was a Porsche 911 GT3 RSR going 286.46kph.

Even the GT1's were struggling to break the 290kph barrier, with a Corvette doing 290.81kph.

This seems to be the ideal solution if the ACO are only concerned with GT2 cars top speeds against P1/P2's rather than their quite conservative laptimes.

With this speed limiter you shouldn't have the ridiculous situation of 550+bhp road cars running with under 500bhp in ACO GT2 trim.

[pederb]

Originally Posted by I Rosputnik

What about Reiters SV-R?

I guess Reiter have to focus on the GT2 version of the Gallardo.

Gallardo GT2 (GT2)

[MJ_N_09]

^ I haven't heard from that car since Spa '09. I'd love to see it come back.

[JHamilton]

Originally Posted by Gil Abobeleira

Well the guys at Matech said that they wont make another car to conform to the GT2 rules: http://endurance-info.com/version2/a...ance-4618.html



If the ACO has any balls in it (and they showed that they have in the case of the MC12), they'll say "NON!"

Why would they? How much longer can they even run that car?

[Purist]

Since the Matech Ford GT1 was only homologated last year, I think it's good to go through 2013 or 2014.

Sad thing is with the Reiter car, the GT3 Gallardo looks leaner, meaner, and more trim than that GT2. The GT2 just looks like they added fat to the poor beast. Of course, the Murcielago still easily looks better than the Gallardo, in road or racing trim.

That comparison of the Reiter GT2 to their GT3 also reminds me of the Ferrari F430. Honestly, the F430 Scuderia GT3 looks decidedly more purposeful than does the F430 GT2.

[pitviper]

Completely agree. I would be perfectly happy with current GT2 cars/underpinnings with current GT3 aero. If they are going to be the top GT cars, they need to look the part. The Matech Ford GT1 is lightyears beyond the Doran Ford GT2 (as an example) in regards to the way they look. Even the Super Tropheo Gallardos look way better than the "GT2" Gallardo. They need to LOOK RIGHT as well as perform the way the ACO wants. I'm fine with their performance, in fact... just not quite so much with the timid aero and stance.

pit

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by pitviper

Completely agree. I would be perfectly happy with current GT2 cars/underpinnings with current GT3 aero. If they are going to be the top GT cars, they need to look the part. The Matech Ford GT1 is lightyears beyond the Doran Ford GT2 (as an example) in regards to the way they look. Even the Super Tropheo Gallardos look way better than the "GT2" Gallardo. They need to LOOK RIGHT as well as perform the way the ACO wants. I'm fine with their performance, in fact... just not quite so much with the timid aero and stance.

pit

In politics, there is a saying for the line of thought-- symbolism over substance.

[Spyderman]

I hear that it's quite in vogue these days Bob.

[mirkob]

I still hope that ACO will find a way to allow Matech, Nismo and why not, Audi R8 GT3 and Gallardo GT3 with a "GT Endurance Class kit"

:-D