British GT or Britcar in 2006?

[renkadima]

Originally Posted by SALEEN S7R

For me the British GT series is still the #1 series, the GT2 class cars are the ones I want to see here in the UK given the option of watching them or Britcar and its premier class being GT3 class machinery.

IMO the British GT series is fine as it is and dosent need any spicing up, although a switch to a longer race format such as 2 or 3 hour races would be a good thing. IMO.

Spot on! The British GT Championship is a remarkable survivor, having already lost the 'headlining' category twice - GT1 in 2000 and the old GT2 in 2002. As it stands, it is in danger of losing the current GT2 class; but Croft has shown that a British GT series comprising of just GT3 cars would be viable and entertaining (and, dare I say it, professionally run).

The one thing missing is an organisation that talks to its competitors (or 'customers' as one GT3 runner pointed out at Thruxton) and at least gives the impression that it cares about what they have to say. That, IMO, is why there is the current debate over BGT v Britcar; teams want to run in BGT, but are being pushed more and more in Britcar's direction by poor decision making and communication.

[Redlake27]

I agree Renkadima. SRO have not grasped that their competitors are their customers.
In the paddock, us competitors get treated like dirt by SRO.

[TheNewBob]

Perhaps it's this poor decision making that could result in the loss of the GT2 class, which would be the third class lost in the space of 4/5 seasons! Considering each class lost was the top class at the time, then that's really a heck of a slide downwards...

[SALEEN S7R]

Lets hope that the GT2 class dosent collapse though. Would certainly be a great shame if it does, sure the grids might be weaker next year but thats only to be expected. A lot of GT2 teams are waning to make the step up into FIA GT/LMES at the moment from British GT after all.

[Graham Goodwin]

And that's been the case for some time - The question is where are the next generation on the staircase coming from?

[SALEEN S7R]

GT3 Graham? Britcar? Porsche Carerra cup? Who can say, I guess this is one of the problems British GT faces thanks at least in part to our extremely strong International sportscar teams that we have in the LMES/ALMS/FIA GT. Correct me if Im wrong, but if we counted all the teams that are from GB that are in the ALMS/LMES/FIA GT I think we would find that we have more teams on a International level than any other country in sportscar racing. That is why IMO one of the reasons at least that our British GT championship isnt quite as strong as it has been in recent years.

[Graham Goodwin]

The problem is though that the teams at GT3 level are quite happy there - A lot of teams are running customer cars and very few indeed are looking to step up (I'm aware of just one possible)

The organisers will ignore the teams likes and dislikes at their peril

[SALEEN S7R]

Well thats a shame, and a big problem and hopefully one Ratel will address sooner rather than later. If the GT2 class goes then Im not sure if I see the point in the series continuing with just GT3 class machinery.

[Kicking-back]

Merge the Porsche cup, which always has grids of low teens into the GT3 category and that'll boost numbers a bit.

[JAG]

IMO, the only future for a top level national sportscar series in the UK is to follow the Belcar model.

This is were Britcar has a significant advantage over British GT.

There are many teams in the UK who would love to race in BGT but there cars are not homologated etc.

If BritCar added a GT2 level class in the next few years we could see some very interesting entries.

What are the chances of merging Britcar (GT3 and GT2?) with Britsports to create a mini LMES of our own in the UK?

[RacingRod]

EERC. BRITCAR



Press Release 3rd June 2005



Hawthorns Motorsport have decided to withdraw from the British GT series and enter their BMW Z3M Coupe GT3 race car in the EERC Britcar Series, where it will be classified as a group 2/3 car and therefore be more fairly matched against fellow competitors. “We have loved the experience of British GT and although we felt that we were slightly frowned upon for not having the proper support equipment such as expensive trucks and awnings, they treated us well and welcomed our efforts”. “The fact is that unless you have the right sort of car with about 400bhp+ to start with, you have little chance of being competitive against the Porsches and Ferrari’s and that seems to be the sort of cars people prefer to run”.

“If you can’t beat them, join them, or withdraw and come back when you have a car capable of being competitive, our BMW Only develops 325/340 bhp, and when all said and done, it’s a converted road car whilst 95% of the cars in the GT Series are purpose made race cars. We could buy a 996 Porsche GT3 for the money we would have to spend to make the BMW competitive in existing company, so we’ve decided to call a halt for to continue with the further development of the car would not be a viable or sensible proposition.” The recent issue over the Main Tyre supplier to the GT series has little or nothing to do with our decision, mind you if we had been asked we would have had an opinion, as would all the GT teams. Some of the teams are not that happy about the way things happened, we on the other hand spent 7 years in the TVR Tuscan Challenge and were well used to being told what was going or not going to happen, there you were lucky if they allocated you a race number unless you pre agreed to tow the line, a sort of benign dictatorship, great days really.

We are looking forward to joining the Britcar series for the Brands Hatch round and hopefully for the rest of the season, for we are having detailed discussions with one or two of the existing successful preparation teams in the series that currently run BMW’s, we are sure that we will find a home fairly soon. Unfortunately, Colin Blower Motorsport are unable to run us in the Britcar series as they have pre commitments throughout the rest of the 2005 season, but we will part on the best of terms which is hardly surprising after such a long and successful association. We prefer not to run our own team as we used to do a few years back, it was hard work and took a lot away from the enjoyment that at our age we feel we should not be missing out on, life’s too short, let others do the hard work, we’ll do the racing!!

As to 2006, who knows, maybe we will re-join the British GT series if we buy a 996 GT CUP Car, there again we might love Britcar and become very attached to our ultra reliable Z3M coupe GT car and decide to live out our remaining race years in glorious Britcar style.



Rod Barrett & Jan Persson

Hawthorns Motorsport

[DriversKnow]

I think that you will definitely get entertainment and value from Britcar, Hawthorns.

As you may have read in Motorsport News, Dunlop are to provide tyre support to Britcar through to the 2008 season. There is huge opportunity for growth in what is already the biggest endurance racing championship in Britain. We also look forward to continuing to support our loyal teams who may race in Britcar next year, having previously raced in other championships.

Dunlop are more committed than ever to UK motorsport at all levels. Our investment in the BTCC this year, with TV advertising and increased promotion, through to the Dunlop Race Academy at grass roots level (5000 entrants so far, and only two weeks left to enter at driversknow.co.uk) shows how our partnerships in motorsport can benefit drivers, teams and fans alike. Losing B-GT is extremely disappointing, but we will instead reinvest those resources elsewhere. Dunlop's overall brand marketing strategy is based around motorsport and our investment will continue to increase.

Best of luck Rod and Jan, I thought your car looked great at Thruxton.
James Bailey
Corporate Communications Manager
Goodyear Dunlop UK

[RacingRod]

Hi James,

We never had any doubt about Dunlops commitment, we've had an account with you guy's for years which is why Jan and I both carry DUNLOP logo's in pride of place on our race suits, and that's where they are staying

We used Dunlop tyres for the 7/8 years we spent in the TVR Tuscan Challenge and I would hate to add up the number of races we did but in all that time we never even had a puncture. In our opinion, with Tuscans being the gripless buggers that they are, if we had relied on any other tyre our life stories could have been very different.

[RacingRod]

P.S Can you transfer my account to the Britcar Dunlop support team, or is Michael running that show as well, just thought I would ask as GT's have a race at CC on the same weekend that Britcar are at Brands.


Here's your new resonse to the recent news,

YOU CAN TAKE DUNLOP OUT OF BRITISH GT'S
BUT YOU CAN'T TAKE GT's OUT OF DUNLOP
GT's.........."GREAT TYRES"......FROM DUNLOP

[DriversKnow]

I fear that our advertising agency may feel threatened by your copywriting creativity.........

This year BritCar is handled by one of our dealers, but we can discuss accounts with Michael and the motorsport guys when they are back in the office on Monday.

[TheNewBob]

I did like that suggested "Mini LMES" idea suggested... would make for some massive grids!

[RacingRod]

Originally Posted by DriversKnow

I fear that our advertising agency may feel threatened by your copywriting creativity.........

This year BritCar is handled by one of our dealers, but we can discuss accounts with Michael and the motorsport guys when they are back in the office on Monday.

Many thanks, and please use the new strap line, in exchange for a supply of your black donuts

[spanner]

I am sorry to hear about you wanting to leave the British gt championship but I've read you statement above, but your reasoning sounds strange.

Your saying that your withdrawing from the Brit GT because the car is underpowered compared to the porsches and ferraris in the gt3 class and your not prepared to spend the kind of money needed to develop it, when you could spend the money buying a porsche.

The porsches and ferrari's have been running for a long time, do you really think that the BMW was going to be competitive with limited development? You must have realised just how quick the others were going to be?

[RacingRod]

Yes, we knew how quick the other cars were, what we didn't fully realise was the extent of the development work needed to make the BMW competitive. We could have gone the whole hog and spent between £15k/20k on the engine that would then yield 400+ bhp, trouble was, it would lose a lot of it's reliability as it was still a 3.2 but now pushing the limits by producing 125 bhp per litre and would continue to cost ££££ to maintain if It went wrong. Then add the fact that most of the other cars were purpose built race cars, many with downforce and start calculating the cost of re-designing and changing the millions of pounds spent by BMW developing the car for road use, lowering it, re- doing the suspension, the diffs, drive, gearbox etc etc, cut a long story short and you are looking at spending a fortune with no guarantees of success.

That is why we left GT's, we couldn't compete, so we opted for Britcar where we could race in a class of cars more in line with our level. If we like it we shall stay, If we want to go back to GT's then at least we can give our BMW some credibility in Britcar before selling it, for it will go well and might even win an egg cup or two, which would be good as few people would be prepared to look at buying a car that came last in every race it entered.

One thing is for sure, if we were to go back to GT racing, we would need a similar car to those being run currently together with a much bigger budget, plus support that allows you to develop your car and team. Now if we were 20 years younger that could appeal but I have a feeling that we just might find Britcar now and in the future, more suitable to our budgets and ambitions.

[RacingRod]

Yes, we knew how quick the other cars were, what we didn't fully realise was the extent of the development work needed to make the BMW competitive. We could have gone the whole hog and spent between £15k/20k on the engine that would then yield 400+ bhp, trouble was, it would lose a lot of it's reliability as it was still a 3.2 but now pushing the limits by producing 125 bhp per litre and would continue to cost ££££ to maintain if It went wrong. Then add the fact that most of the other cars were purpose built race cars, many with downforce and start calculating the cost of re-designing and changing the millions of pounds spent by BMW developing the car for road use, lowering it, re- doing the suspension, the diffs, drive, gearbox etc etc, cut a long story short and you are looking at spending a fortune with no guarantees of success.

That is why we left GT's, we couldn't compete, so we opted for Britcar where we could race in a class of cars more in line with our level. If we like it we shall stay, If we want to go back to GT's then at least we can give our BMW some credibility in Britcar before selling it, for it will go well and might even win an egg cup or two, which would be good as few people would be prepared to look at buying a car that came last in every race it entered.

One thing is for sure, if we were to go back to GT racing, we would need a similar car to those being run currently together with a much bigger budget, plus support that allows you to develop your car and team. Now if we were 20 years younger that could appeal but I have a feeling that we just might find Britcar now and in the future, more suitable to our budgets and ambitions.

Hidden in your question is the inference that at best we were nieve, and at the worst, plain stupid to have even considered that we had a chance in GT's and after 10 years in Motorsport, running teams of up to four cars , we should have learnt a thing or two. Well, we have, we've learnt to realise and accept the cost when you get it wrong, and not allow pride to prevent you from admitting it. Hows that for a straight answer.

[Redlake27]

It is going to be interesting to see the how the Brands Hatch Britcar event on 25 June compares to the BGT race at Combe on the same day.

MotorSportVision have really thrown their weight behind BritCar, and it was heavily promoted at last weeks BTCC race as being the 'Post Le Mans Endurance Weekend'

I think this is a great title to give the race weekend and makes it appealing to casual spectators that wouldn't know what a GT car is.

It sticks one up SRO....deserverdly!

[TheNewBob]

A good idea - I still can't believe how many people I come across who haven't even heard of GT racing, never mind knowing or seeing how great it is! Even if my heart would generally be with BGT, MotorSportVision are at least doing something to help with promotion.

[Wilbo]

'Post Le Mans Endurance Weekend' FANTASTIC!!!

JP was present for the last Brands round on the Indy and must have liked what he had seen that day. Credit must go to James and his team. I very exciting future, can't wait to see what next year has in stall for us and we still haven't got half way through this year yet!

Will be very interesting to start a Combe versus Brands thread!? since as you mention they are both on the same weekend. I hope the fact that Belcar are present is advertised and that the public find out that there is a series they can watch that has Sportscars/prototypes, GT's and Production Saloons all of very good quality and that they find out for themselves that the future is BRITCAR!

[Svierge]

Originally Posted by Wilbo

...the future is BRITCAR!

Speaking as a BGT competitor, I sincerely hope not.

[SALEEN S7R]

So do I Svierge. British GT is the future, Britcar is great dont get me wrong but its a club series. British GT is needed, and will undoubtedly ensure strong grids for the LMES and FIA GT championship, as well as doing well in its own right. Yes Britcar is getting a lot of promotion at the moment, but has anyone seen just how much exposure Motors TV are giving British GT at the moment? They are showing every round of the British GT championship and this week alone ive counted it being on at least 3 or 4 nights this week. Granted it wasnt always on at prime time slots, but at least its being shown. What does Britcar get? The same its always had for the last few years on Sky Sports "World Motorsport's" a half hour slot once or twice a week. Spot the differnce. Then theres the radio exposure British GT gets over Britcar, with Crash.net radio both sponsoring the series and giving it lots of radio time, and of course Globecast radio being there at every round of the British GT/F3 tour.

Yes a lot of people's noses were put out of joint in British GT by the sudden announcement by SRO but things seem to have calmed down now. I really dont think British GT has much to worry about in the form of Britcar.