FIA double standards/Brundle attacks FIA against Sunday Times MERGE

[ensign14]

Originally Posted by Mystery

The FIA do of course have a right to defend themselves although I'd love to learn how a French court has jurisdiction over an English newspaper, but the French courts have been used this way many times in the post by someone with more lawyers than sense.

Two reasons:

1. the Sunday Times is published in France, albeit with a tiny circulation (maybe a thousand). Any publication "counts", not just the place where it's most available. The English Courts have accepted jurisdiction over claims involving the Wall Street Journal in the past for the same reason;

2. internet publication. Technically a website is published where it is downloaded and read, NOT where it is uploaded.

But normally people use the English Courts for defamation as it can award substantial damages. It is rare to use the French Courts - and here I am guessing Mosley is doing so for two reasons; home advantage, which in France is a MAJOR advantage (the French Courts follow the philosophy of M Chauvin), and a losing defendant can be found criminally liable.

[Alan Raine]

Looks like the FIA are going for the jugular!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64328

[Marbot]

The empire strikes back!

This is good isn't it!

TBH I think Martin will be up against it in any court of law,but good on him for trying anyway.

[ensign14]

"It is regrettable that instead of applauding the achievements of motor sport's international champions, who were recognised this weekend in a Gala prize giving ceremony in Monaco, Martin Brundle chose to continue his campaign against motor sport's governing body," [a spokesman] said.

"Instead of celebrating the results of the closest F1, WRC and WTCC championships for years, Martin has again sought to call into question the integrity of the FIA World Council."

OK, so I shall revise my posting.

Rejoice! Rejoice! The FIA's excellent decision making means that everything is jolly nice and fine. Thanks to the intelligence displayed by the WSMC and the FIA, David Richards is not going to lose millions of pounds next year running old McLarens. Those millions can be invested instead in a carbon-neutral Aston Martin factory.

And poor Fernando Alonso, tired out from hard racing for three years, is going to enjoy a "gap year" at Mr Mosley's subtle insistence. Whether he spends this mooching around the world or driving Renault's tribute to McLaren is entirely up to him. Choices! All thanks to the FIA!

Meanwhile, people are falling over themselves to get into F1! Look at the wonderful work of Jormidspykindia! So many people desperate to grab a grid slot. All thanks to the FIA!

And how about sportscar racing? Nobody wants to see the return of those rubbishy days when all you had were a bunch of identikit Porsche 962s and marketing exercises from Jaguar and Mercedes. So the FIA stepped in to ensure a rule shift so that all those talents were forced to prove themselves in F1. Exactly as it should be.

And everyone was getting bored with all those saloon car races. No interest to anyone, the best drivers kept winning and all that rubbish. So the FIA introduced the genius idea of handicapping! Just slow down the fast ones to keep the show on the road! Obviously the FIA didn't bother to do that in F1, instead they just handicapped all those behind Ferrari by banning things like beryllium and twin brakes and mass dampers, but we can't disappoint the mass audience around the world that want to see Ferrari win, can we? All thanks to the FIA!

Just one thing that does slightly bother me...

"Of course Martin is perfectly entitled to his opinion but he should try to understand that to accuse the regulator of a worldwide sport of conducting a witch-hunt against one of its licensed competitors is a very serious charge."

He didn't, though, did he? Far be it from me to criticize the FIA for misquoting, as the FIA can do no wrong. No, it must be that Brundle made a mistake in his original quote. Yes, he needs to retrospectively re-make it and correct it. Of course.

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

"Well if that's the kind of justice that our hall of justice claims, then I respect, respect, respect old Jesse James" - to quote a Don McLean song.

Such a shame to see double standards in use here. But if Renault chooses to leave, then one of the Red Bull teams (RBR?) loses out, as do many workers (unless a take-over is agreed), as does Fernando Alonso... Customer teams would have to be permitted just to make up the numbers... And with no Renault, RBR could suffer, and maybe even STR... I think Renault is the bottom row in a house of cards here. Mosley must be trying to keep them sweet. In a way, McLaren are almost as independent as Williams: neither one supplies another team; indeed the only affiliation from one to another is that Williams receives supplies from Toyota. McLaren is out on its own. And like has been said: Renault does not need F1 where it is reckoned that McLaren does.

The engines should be safe. Renault do the R+D, Meccachrome are the ones making them. With the engine freeze, i'd imagine there'd be no knock on effects so long as Meccachrome can continue supply.

[Ralf's Girl]

"It is regrettable that instead of applauding the achievements of motor sport's international champions, who were recognised this weekend in a Gala prize giving ceremony in Monaco, Martin Brundle chose to continue his campaign against motor sport's governing body," he said.

Ho ho ho. My heart bleeds, poor old FIA, being picked on by mean old Martin. I think complaints about a campaign against them are a bit rich coming from the FIA.

[Down F0rce]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64328

"It is regrettable that instead of applauding the achievements of motor sport's international champions, who were recognised this weekend in a Gala prize giving ceremony in Monaco, Martin Brundle chose to continue his campaign against motor sport's governing body," he said.

Talk about using the chewbacca defence.

Brundle has every right to say what he wants. We should all write letters to major newspapers and let them know exactly what we think of the FIA, and dare them, to sue us as well.

[Alex Hodgkinson]

Originally Posted by ensign14

And how about sportscar racing? Nobody wants to see the return of those rubbishy days when all you had were a bunch of identikit Porsche 962s and marketing exercises from Jaguar and Mercedes. So the FIA stepped in to ensure a rule shift so that all those talents were forced to prove themselves in F1. Exactly as it should be.

hmm!

[CDK 7]

Martin Brundle has been very vocal about what has been happening to McLaren this season.I wonder if he would have been quite so vocal if the same were happening to Ferrari![/quote]

i think so yes

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by martyn bott

I wonder if he would have been quite so vocal if the same were happening to Ferrari!

CDK7, I believe he would too.

[paddy]

The bloke know's the F1 business and speaks as he finds. As far as i am aware he's never had an agenda other than love of the sport. It doesn't matter what he's commenting on he speaks with knowledge and passion and gives his opinion. The FIA should take it on the chin and move on. It's a good job Jackie Stewart is not so quick to resort to the courts.

[EERO]

Originally Posted by littleman

F1 will only sort itself out if TV audiences plummet,sponsors dry up and spectators stop attending in droves. I would like to see that happen, so I'm starting a one man protest! Feel free to join in !

Add me to the list.

40 years of fandom.

10 GP's attended

Countless dollars spent on swag and tschotkes.

Books, magazines and an expensive cable TV package I will no longer need just to watch F1.

Unless they sort it out, and become a professionally administered international body, I'm done.

[Adam43]

I'm afraid that this will only serve to increase the audience. In which case they won't miss us EERO. It may be time for us to pass on F1 to the new viewers.

[garcon]

Unless the FIA in general and Mad Max in particular see sense and stop short of going nuclear, I can only see one ultimate conclusion - the acrimonious splitting up of our sport and the appearance of rival series under the auspices of a new body.

For one thing that could well take F1 (or whatever replaces it) to subsciption only tv, but more significantly it would cause utter chaos at club/national level.

The FIA have to realise that the very wellbeing of their sport is now at stake, and it is within their power to resolve things.

[foreversideways]

Sometimes things have to be broken apart for something better to emerge. With Max M in charge i see no other outcome than nuclear fall out. Do the likes of Mercedes, Renault, Toyota et all really wish to be associated with all this washing of dirty linen in public.
By the way i am pretty sure the Times will have taken relevant advice from lawyers before allowing the Brundle articles to be printed.

[Chiefy]

Earlier this year I had some bother with university accommodation. Whilst trying to re-house myself, so to speak, I told those giving me help that I was grateful for the assistance. My mother, meanwhile, slammed them for causing (in part) the initial problems. I think my philosophy was "Don't bite the hand that feeds you" ... However, I don't think Brundle should be taking a leaf out of my book, because this whole spygate saga is lunacy, and Brundle is blatantly in the right. To tell him that he should instead having given his attention to the success of various drivers and teams in the close season was a bit too predictable (and weak) a defence from the FIA.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by autosport.com

An FIA spokesman told autosport.com Brundle was "perfectly entitled" to his opinion, but will need to defend his accusations in a court of law.

What is this if its not totalitarianism ? Surely it doesn't matter whether Brundle is right or wrong. He is expressing his opinion and can not be chastized for that under UK law unless its deemed to be insighting violence or hatred ?

Should we all be careful what we write on forums like this in case the FIA come after us too ?

[Knowlesy]

Originally Posted by FIA Plastic

"It is regrettable that instead of applauding the achievements of motor sport's international champions, who were recognised this weekend in a Gala prize giving ceremony in Monaco, Martin Brundle chose to continue his campaign against motor sport's governing body," he said.

"Instead of celebrating the results of the closest F1, WRC and WTCC championships for years, Martin has again sought to call into question the integrity of the FIA World Council.

"Of course Martin is perfectly entitled to his opinion but he should try to understand that to accuse the regulator of a worldwide sport of conducting a witch-hunt against one of its licensed competitors is a very serious charge.

"The FIA World Council unanimously decided that this could not be left unchallenged. He will now be given the opportunity to try to substantiate his claims in front of the courts."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/64328

I am at a loss really.

**** me.

[ensign14]

FIA Plastic?

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by foreversideways

By the way i am pretty sure the Times will have taken relevant advice from lawyers before allowing the Brundle articles to be printed.

that for me is the problem, too many large news outlets covering sports on the basis of "expert opinion" and printing whatever they want because an expert/insider told them too. far too much opinion in the media imo.

while i dont think what Brundle said was bad, or even far removed from the truth, there are too many pseudo journalists in sports taking things way too far without anything to back it up. whether its war reporting or just sports, it should be held to a higher standard.

that said, is this the best example to make that case with, absolutely not!

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by davyboy

What is this if its not totalitarianism ?

if its was totalitarianism they would have simply removed his press credentials and been done with it. instead Brundle has the opportunity to back up what he said...sounds pretty fair to me.

[Knowlesy]

Originally Posted by ensign14

FIA Plastic?

I felt it politer than the (rhyming) word that first comes to mind.

[Alan Raine]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

that for me is the problem, too many large news outlets covering sports on the basis of "expert opinion" and printing whatever they want because an expert/insider told them too. far too much opinion in the media imo.

while i dont think what Brundle said was bad, or even far removed from the truth, there are too many pseudo journalists in sports taking things way too far without anything to back it up. whether its war reporting or just sports, it should be held to a higher standard.

that said, is this the best example to make that case with, absolutely not!

I think it's because it is Brundle that the FIA are taking this ridiculous action. Like Ron they want to bring him down a peg are two. They don't care about pseudo journalists.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

that for me is the problem, too many large news outlets covering sports on the basis of "expert opinion" and printing whatever they want because an expert/insider told them too. far too much opinion in the media imo.

So would you advocate the restriction of opinion based expression ? Isn't that what we have in places like Uzbekistan ? Aren't we intelligent enough to be able to interpret an opinion and glean from it what we wish ?

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by davyboy

Aren't we intelligent enough to be able to interpret an opinion and glean from it what we wish ?

Actually most people aren't, but that is a different topic!

I see that Brundle's comments are nothing compared to what some people say around here! I don't just mean about the FIA, I mean about anything.

He wasn't being nasty or insulting as far as I can tell. The reaction to many things in F1 recently has been vicious and desperate for a guilty party. This spy thing is just one of them. Most unpleasant.