So long QR!!

[GTRMagic]

QR's Reponse

What does Russell Think?

Is it me or is QR's story changing?

[Axeman444]

i don't understand Tetley's argument of V8SA can still run under AASA when they have to run CAMS as an FIA registered series...

when does the lease run out? maybe V8SA can buy the track to make it the permanent "great" track and do the mods themselves

[Crash Test]

As for the facilities, there isn't much wrong with them. JT is right, 362 days a year they are just fine. Not enough shade for the punters? QR would have been a perfect venue for a night round...

[Axeman444]

Is it REALLY that important to race at your home track from a results point of view? below in red are the "home teams". Top 10 from the 2x races this year at Winton

R5
1 888 TeamVodafone Craig Lowndes
2 1 TeamVodafone Jamie Whincup
3 6 Ford Performance Racing Steven Richards
4 15 Jack Daniels Racing Rick Kelly
5 14 WOW Racing Cameron McConville
6 9 SP Tools Racing Shane Van Gisbergen
7 22 Toll Holden Racing Team Will Davison
8 2 Toll Holden Racing Team Garth Tander
9 39 Supercheap Auto Racing Russell Ingall
10 34 Garry Rogers Motorsport Michael Caruso

R6

1 888 TeamVodafone Craig Lowndes
2 5 Ford Performance Racing Mark Winterbottom
3 2 Toll Holden Racing Team Garth Tander
4 10 Team Autobarn Paul Dumbrell
5 22 Toll Holden Racing Team Will Davison
6 18 Jim Beam Racing James Courtney
7 15 Jack Daniels Racing Rick Kelly
8 24 Bundaberg Red Racing Team David Reynolds
9 77 Team Intaracing Marcus Marshall
10 3 Sprint Gas Racing Jason Bargwanna

Top 10 from the 2x races this year at QR

R15
1 1 TeamVodafone Jamie Whincup
2 18 Jim Beam Racing James Courtney
3 5 Ford Performance Racing Mark Winterbottom
4 17 Jim Beam Racing Steven Johnson
5 111 Wilson Security Racing Fabian Coulthard
6 7 Jack Daniel's Racing Todd Kelly
7 33 Garry Rogers Motorsport Lee Holdsworth
8 25 Fujitsu Racing Jason Bright
9 9 SP Tools Racing Shane Van Gisbergen
10 67 Supercheap Auto Racing Tim Slade

R16
1 22 Toll Holden Racing Team Will Davison
2 888 TeamVodafone Craig Lowndes
3 39 Supercheap Auto Racing Russell Ingall
4 5 Ford Performance Racing Mark Winterbottom
5 10 Team Autobarn Paul Dumbrell
6 34 Garry Rogers Motorsport Michael Caruso
7 6 Ford Performance Racing Steven Richards
8 18 Jim Beam Racing James Courtney
9 25 Fujitsu Racing Jason Bright
10 15 Jack Daniels Racing Rick Kelly

I would suggest it is more of a commercial issue that the QLD teams have with not racing at QR

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Crash Test

As for the facilities, there isn't much wrong with them. JT is right, 362 days a year they are just fine. Not enough shade for the punters? QR would have been a perfect venue for a night round...

The lack of a pitlane side garage is said to be a sticking point (Oran Park's is still for sale..), meaning the cars have to drive from the paddock sheds to the lane...

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Axeman444

when does the lease run out? maybe V8SA can buy the track to make it the permanent "great" track and do the mods themselves

Like the last time they tried to roll Mr Tetley?

This actually makes sense... if there is a genuinely commercial business model attached to have the place upgraded from profits, to increase patronage... all the really "boring" things

[D.R.T.]

Originally Posted by Crash Test

Not enough shade for the punters?

Compared to Homebush the shade at QR shouldnt be an issue.

Overall I very sad situation that the series loses another permanent circuit with V8SC now only running on 2 permanent circuits on the east coast of Australia and they are both in Victoria!

A sorry state of affairs.

“Does he understand that AASA runs events like Targa Tasmania and Classic Adelaide?” Tetley asked.

Would Cochrane know what these events are?

[lookleft]

I can understand why QR took the position they have - no on-going Govt. support and a significant delta between operating cost and revenue for this event leave little option - they are running a Business. A worse outcome would have been they continued to deal with VESA and drive themselves to bankruptcy resulting in the loss of the track to the rest of the community.

As it stands, SE QLD is actually rather well served for "grass roots" events with Lakeside and Morgan Park being two of the better tracks to race/drive on in the country (facilities are sub-standard) and QR with decent facilities but aging track. If QR refocus on a life without V8's some minor track updates / changes could potentially open up new opportunities (i.e. two track configurations able to run concurrently for non race days).

Sure it would be a sad day when there are no major V8 races in SE QLD but if VESA are willing to make a commercial decision that this market is not important so be it. Does anyone really think that the government / taxpayers are going to continue to fund the Gold Coast event as a V8 standalone? It had a great life in the late 90’s early 2000’s but it is done now. The truth is that the Gold Coast track is rubbish for spectators, hugely expensive to run and produces very little actual racing – great for people who like to watch car get torn up but that is about it (oh, and the ladies….).

Prediction: QLD Govt. will pull funding from the Gold Coast event, TC will have a rant, a deal will be done for the Govt. to tip small amount of what they spent on Gold Coast into QR under a “win / win as we are serving the valuable local industry, keeping an event AND saving money” based on a 5 year deal with VESA to run at QR. V8s back in 2011.

[Mixer]

Another issue between V8s and QR was the race meeting’s sanctioning. V8s must run a meeting under CAMS sanctioning as it’s a full-fledged FIA championship. Queensland Raceway has been associated with the Australian Auto Sport Alliance (AASA) since 2002 and was unwilling to accept a CAMS event to be run at the track.

“Does he understand that AASA runs events like Targa Tasmania and Classic Adelaide?” Tetley asked.

This is political and its clear its been brought about by Tetley. If he thinks he's bigger than V8Supercars good luck to him.

The AASA is just track owners being greedy.

Note how every permanent circuit lost is mostly caused by that circuit's management: Calder, Eastern Creek, now QR all had their hand in their own demise. I don't recall Mallala's circumstances but its second rate in any case.

Meanwhile Tassie and WA got their **** together, improved the tracks, and put on great racing. Of all you'd think Tassie would have been the hardest to find the money.

[bortall]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

The lack of a pitlane side garage is said to be a sticking point (Oran Park's is still for sale..), meaning the cars have to drive from the paddock sheds to the lane...

Isn't this the same thing that they just had at Homebush??

[Wood-duck]

Originally Posted by FalconEL

You don't think they'll get back in next time Wood-duck? Actually I can't find anyone who admits to voting for them last time..........

Probably Falcon.. who knows, but i think bligh has cooked the goose this time. The public have had enough - all the coalition need is to get the same swing they got last time and they are in. Having said that, Bligh has 2 years to claw back the ground and the public seem to have a short memory when it comes to politics as GTR has mentioned in NSW....

I just can't see how they could possibly justify the expense of a brand new facility when it forked for one barely 10 years ago, and with driver training facilites in place at Mount Cotton and Norwell, it would be hard to justify another facility that will enhance training.

If they pull the pin on "indy", well, that changes the game dramatically. I cant see them "necking the golden goose to lay an egg".

We already have 3 permanent and 2 street courses in Queensland. If the government was less debt handicapped and V8SA got a case strong enough...

However,

Mr Cochrane did concieve Townsville and came riding over the sunset to save SuperGP, so the government does owe him a favour.....

will be interesting to see how it pans out

[Crash Test]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

The lack of a pitlane side garage is said to be a sticking point (Oran Park's is still for sale..), meaning the cars have to drive from the paddock sheds to the lane...

Pffftttt..... they drive to the pit lane in Sydney, and that's the biggest spectacle in the universe.

The sheds as they are now get used every single day as an accessible dummy grid/marshaling area. If they go and put a back on the sheds/roller door at the front, will that actually improve anything?

[lookleft]

Originally Posted by Mixer

......
Note how every permanent circuit lost is mostly caused by that circuit's management: Calder, Eastern Creek, now QR all had their hand in their own demise. I don't recall Mallala's circumstances but its second rate in any case.

Meanwhile Tassie and WA got their **** together, improved the tracks, and put on great racing. Of all you'd think Tassie would have been the hardest to find the money.

What do you mean by demise?

Booked out most weekends and frequent mid week private booking? If so, then yes I agree

[Axeman444]

Originally Posted by lookleft

A worse outcome would have been they continued to deal with VESA and drive themselves to bankruptcy resulting in the loss of the track to the rest of the community.

not sure how the track would be lost to the rest of the community when it is only leased to Tetley? if he went bankrupt, then someone else would be able to run it

Originally Posted by bortall

Isn't this the same thing that they just had at Homebush??

Homebush is a temporary track, QR is permanent, i can see the difference...

[Oldtony]

Originally Posted by lookleft

I can understand why QR took the position they have - no on-going Govt. support and a significant delta between operating cost and revenue for this event leave little option
Prediction: QLD Govt. will pull funding from the Gold Coast event, TC will have a rant, a deal will be done for the Govt. to tip small amount of what they spent on Gold Coast into QR under a “win / win as we are serving the valuable local industry, keeping an event AND saving money” based on a 5 year deal with VESA to run at QR. V8s back in 2011.

Pretty accurate summary I think lookleft.
This would seem to be an attempt by TC to put VESA in a win/win situation over the possible cancellation of the Gold Coast. Either the Govt. gives them the funding and control of the Gold Coast or they make life difficult by pulling the whole V8SC industry from SEQ because of no testing. As much as I will hate to see Surfers go, I think that as you say the money will go to Willowbank and the Surfers event will be history.
It would be great if we could get someone in Qld Events to say to Cochrane, "We are running GP2/GT1/F3 or whatever at the Surfers, and we can put together a local support programe, you can be on it if you apply".
Won't happen, but it would be great theatre watching the climb down messages issuing from Stalag Nerang.
By the way what was the consultation process with the Qld teams?

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by Oldtony

Pretty accurate summary I think lookleft.
This would seem to be an attempt by TC to put VESA in a win/win situation over the possible cancellation of the Gold Coast. Either the Govt. gives them the funding and control of the Gold Coast or they make life difficult by pulling the whole V8SC industry from SEQ because of no testing. As much as I will hate to see Surfers go, I think that as you say the money will go to Willowbank and the Surfers event will be history.
It would be great if we could get someone in Qld Events to say to Cochrane, "We are running GP2/GT1/F3 or whatever at the Surfers, and we can put together a local support programe, you can be on it if you apply".
Won't happen, but it would be great theatre watching the climb down messages issuing from Stalag Nerang.
By the way what was the consultation process with the Qld teams?

Only thing with your thoughts there is that VESA hold a five year contract to be the joint main ticket at Gold Coast, so no likelihood of them being offered a support cat deal, hence no need to climb down.

Given past history and that this would have gone to the VESA board for discussion / approval, between the team reps on the board and the normal very good communications with teams I'd suggest that the Qld teams were kept in the loop.

[Falcadore]

Originally Posted by Mixer

Note how every permanent circuit lost is mostly caused by that circuit's management: Calder, Eastern Creek, now QR all had their hand in their own demise. I don't recall Mallala's circumstances but its second rate in any case.

Meanwhile Tassie and WA got their **** together, improved the tracks, and put on great racing. Of all you'd think Tassie would have been the hardest to find the money.

Taking it caes by case, Calder - Bob Jane and VESA had a fight. Eastern Creek - ARDC and VESA had a slanging match. VESA disliked ARDC's promotion and roundly blamed it, but there is supporting evidence that it would not have made any difference. Mallala was shafted, pure and simple. Adelaide 500 organisers were nervous about what crowd they would get so had it written into contract that they had to be the only V8 round in South Australia. So Mallala was was given a stand-alone Fujitsu round, but they were shafted.

Tassie found the money - it came from Tasmanian texpayers.

QR have been improving facilities, the catering was rebuilt last year and resurfacing was scheduled for this year. It appears to have come down to conditions of contract this year.

[Crash Test]

Is there anything in the rules that prohibits Morris from using Norwell as a test track? It'd be ridiculously close to home, and they could probably get some long days in there. A downside would be that they would potentially lose use of the track from its regular activities while testing is on.

[Falcadore]

Originally Posted by Crash Test

Pffftttt..... they drive to the pit lane in Sydney, and that's the biggest spectacle in the universe.

The sheds as they are now get used every single day as an accessible dummy grid/marshaling area. If they go and put a back on the sheds/roller door at the front, will that actually improve anything?

And if the were smart about it they could turn it into some kinda of parade getting the cars from sheds to pits, drivers and cars up close to the fans, instead of tucked and hidden away from the fans in a track edge pit bunker.

Look at the positive opportunity.

[Falcadore]

Originally Posted by Crash Test

Is there anything in the rules that prohibits Morris from using Norwell as a test track? It'd be ridiculously close to home, and they could probably get some long days in there. A downside would be that they would potentially lose use of the track from its regular activities while testing is on.

Yes. I remember Morris complaining a couple of years ago they couldn't even fire up the cars engines at Norwell because of the testing regs.

[Falcadore]

Originally Posted by Axeman444

i don't understand Tetley's argument of V8SA can still run under AASA when they have to run CAMS as an FIA registered series...

when does the lease run out? maybe V8SA can buy the track to make it the permanent "great" track and do the mods themselves

To simplify the debate:

Why don't you run QR as AASA?

We have to run CAMS.

Why?

Because we're an FIA international series and registered with CAMS.

Why?

and the answer to that question becomes interesting...

[scoupe]

Originally Posted by Falcadore

To simplify the debate:

Why don't you run QR as AASA?

We have to run CAMS.

Why?

Because we're an FIA international series and registered with CAMS.

Why?

and the answer to that question becomes interesting...

Maybe they dont like the AASA policy ... has anyone ever read it or seen a copy, is it available to download ?

[Crash Test]

Originally Posted by Falcadore

Yes. I remember Morris complaining a couple of years ago they couldn't even fire up the cars engines at Norwell because of the testing regs.

Is it because the teams can only have one nominated test track, which has been QR? Would Norwell be suitable? What is that teams go testing for? Do you test for driving in a straight line or for going around corners?

It is interesting that the V8 testing at QR has been running under AASA auspices for several years now. I wonder if that will now be an issue?

The V8s would have been the only CAMS event at QR this year, and it probably would have been a fair enough wack that V8SA cough up for the privilege of having Tim & Co turn up.

As for AASA Vs CAMS in QLD, I think it's a massive non-issue. People have realised that a AASA meeting is exactly the same as a CAMS meeting. Victoria is the place where the niggle is at...

[Falcadore]

Originally Posted by Crash Test

Is it because the teams can only have one nominated test track, which has been QR? Would Norwell be suitable? What is that teams go testing for? Do you test for driving in a straight line or for going around corners?

It is interesting that the V8 testing at QR has been running under AASA auspices for several years now. I wonder if that will now be an issue?

Don't recall the specifics. Just Morris making the complaint that his race cars had to be pushed everywhere at Norwell. Would have thought Norwell was to small and too slow to get sufficient meaningful data from it. Is there anything there that could simulate a high speed sweeper?

Winton testing is AASA too from what I recall.

[D.R.T.]

Originally Posted by Mixer

This is political and its clear its been brought about by Tetley. If he thinks he's bigger than V8Supercars good luck to him.

The AASA is just track owners being greedy.

Note how every permanent circuit lost is mostly caused by that circuit's management: Calder, Eastern Creek, now QR all had their hand in their own demise. I don't recall Mallala's circumstances but its second rate in any case.

An interesting and severly skewed post on things.

I am interested to see you expand on this Mixer.