[iV8SC11-R07&08&09] Trading Post Perth Challenge 29 April-1 May

[skells22]

how long was the delay to race 2?

[Razor]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

What colour scheme did the VIP car enjoy before it was wrapped?

Was the VIP car originally Murphy's Castrol EDGE car?

[Average Punter]

Originally Posted by PVDA

Longer version here of todays crash & burn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFG05xRM8Qw

As a non-flaggie, can I ask a silly question or ten?

In the footage you have posted the link to, I have noticed a few things.

At 1:12 the starter is ready with a sign and watches the field very carefully. He then holds it out when he sees the stall. Shame it is only a tad bigger than a business card. I guess it says "STALLED CAR" but really, what use is it? Overhead lights anyone???

What is the normal flag procedure for a stall? I saw a Porsche stall on the grid at Bathurst a few years ago and the flaggies along pit straight were almost climbing the fence with waved yellows...

The hit is at 1:16. By then there are waved yellows near the rear of the grid (remember Karl was row 6) but not many... Infact at the start, Karl's car is behind the point where the pit wall ends. So there are about 8-9 rows of cars who have no frantic flag warnings of a stalled car..... I see THAT as a problem.

The chase firies pull up at 1:27 by which time Karl is already wrestling with the belts.

Karl is out by 1:31 but obviously burnt/burning.
The first marshall to Karl is at 1:35 but he's NOT a firie. The firie has his back turned and is with the crumpled car. In his defence I'd say he would feel Karl had exited the car and was OK.

At 1:39 a pit crew member from Kelly Racing arrives with his extinguisher already discharging and it looks like one of Karl's crew arrive by his side (no extinguisher)

There are two firies at Owen's car as he's still in it. Then the cavalry arrives but Owen is still in the car until 1:59.

Personally I can't see any glaring blunders but in your opinion PVDA, how did it all go?

[fomoco]

Interesting comments about this, but having doen the fire Rescue training, fire Marshall did exactly what you have to do, MEdicos go to the drivers Fires put out fires. It is worth noting that Karl was out first , but Steve is still in his car, Fires were still checking the cars to make sure no more fires, or fuel leaking, again doing what they trained to do.

Now a reaction from the drivers:
http://www.speedcafe.com.au/2011/05/...8-safety-crew/

No Brighty, you need a fire crew and medical crew.

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by Rachel Richards

First Muppet I have seen in a fire suit !

Didn't you see Baretts and camera man, whilst fireis where checking the rear of Karls car.

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by PVDA

Longer version here of todays crash & burn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFG05xRM8Qw

6:21 , firerys checking back of Karls, car camera man moves in for close up.

[fomoco]

Originally Posted by Average Punter

As a non-flaggie, can I ask a silly question or ten?

In the footage you have posted the link to, I have noticed a few things.

At 1:12 the starter is ready with a sign and watches the field very carefully. He then holds it out when he sees the stall. Shame it is only a tad bigger than a business card. I guess it says "STALLED CAR" but really, what use is it? Overhead lights anyone???

What is the normal flag procedure for a stall? I saw a Porsche stall on the grid at Bathurst a few years ago and the flaggies along pit straight were almost climbing the fence with waved yellows...

The hit is at 1:16. By then there are waved yellows near the rear of the grid (remember Karl was row 6) but not many... Infact at the start, Karl's car is behind the point where the pit wall ends. So there are about 8-9 rows of cars who have no frantic flag warnings of a stalled car..... I see THAT as a problem.

The chase firies pull up at 1:27 by which time Karl is already wrestling with the belts.

Karl is out by 1:31 but obviously burnt/burning.
The first marshall to Karl is at 1:35 but he's NOT a firie. The firie has his back turned and is with the crumpled car. In his defence I'd say he would feel Karl had exited the car and was OK.

At 1:39 a pit crew member from Kelly Racing arrives with his extinguisher already discharging and it looks like one of Karl's crew arrive by his side (no extinguisher)

There are two firies at Owen's car as he's still in it. Then the cavalry arrives but Owen is still in the car until 1:59.

Personally I can't see any glaring blunders but in your opinion PVDA, how did it all go?

Some Cicuits have a Fire Crew and Medic crew following on the firts lap. Have done for years at some places, firerys did exactly what we cover on training, Medics are for treating Drivers, lack of medical team following the cars on thier first lap.

[Woolley]

Good work by marshals and medics. A shunt like that is scary and there's a lot of adrenaline going on along with the inevitable confusion of what's ended up where, who got out and where is it safe to go. Response times were quick, the fire was dealt with rapidly and neither driver seemed to be left unattended at any time. Well done.

[GTRMagic]

I still wonder why in any accident involving fire, it is the gloves and face that are most injured.. the face I kinda get, the helmet visor is flipped open to allow the pilot to breathe.. and the balaclava is sometimes considered a sweat absorber as opposed to a piece of safety kit.. but the gloves... they are clearly not quite good enough.. with burns to the hands almost guaranteed in most incidents of this type.

While there is a need for the fingers to be free and tactile. there are no 3 layer protection designs for the hands...

[Axeman444]

Originally Posted by fomoco

It is worth noting that Karl was out first , but Steve is still in his car, Fires were still checking the cars to make sure no more fires, or fuel leaking, again doing what they trained to do.

Mr Owen was interviewed and advised he chose to wait in the car until the firies put out the fire, as he couldn't get out without walking into a wall of fire...

not sure if i'd do the same thing as him in the circumstances sitting on a full tank of fuel, but hey, i wasn't the one there...

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Axeman444

Mr Owen was interviewed and advised he chose to wait in the car until the firies put out the fire, as he couldn't get out without walking into a wall of fire...

not sure if i'd do the same thing as him in the circumstances sitting on a full tank of fuel, but hey, i wasn't the one there...

Did each pilot pull the pins on their firebombs?

[GTRMagic]

Look how high they both get

(Pic from Daily Telegraph Here)

[GTRMagic]

How hard did they hit...



Mr Owen is lucky not to be more seriously hurt!

[wishbone]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Did each pilot pull the pins on their firebombs?

from the photos and video i have seen it looks like niether did, from the footage it doesn't look like the fires tried to use the fire booms either.

[St00ge]

http://www.speedcafe.com.au/2011/05/...for-burn-outs/

Jamie Whincup, Jason Bright and Garth Tander have received a reprimand for doing burnouts on the front straight at Barbagallo Raceway.

As the three place getters exited Turn 7 and approached the podium parc ferme, all three lost traction in the form of a ‘burnout’ – in breach of specific instruction given at the driver’s briefing on Saturday morning.

After an investigation and an admission of the breach of the rule (failing to obey an instruction of an official of the meeting), the stewards imposed the penalty of a reprimand.

Tander said that the idea of a penalty was ridiculous.

“We’re not allowed to show any emotion and put on a show for the people who pay the money to come watch us race,” Tander said.

“It was absolutely silly that we all got told off after Shane’s win in New Zealand. What a joke

....

****ing joke v8s, the punters want to see this kinda stuff...

[GTRMagic]

Interview with Karl Reindler...

[Average Punter]

RE GTR's pic above:

So why aren't the marshalls on P11 going nuts with yellows??????

[PVDA]

Originally Posted by Average Punter

RE GTR's pic above:

So why aren't the marshalls on P11 going nuts with yellows??????

Because up til it was hit and pushed forwards the stalled car is not in thier yellow sector.

Cant fault the guys in 11 on this one.

In your earlier post AP you asked my thoughts.

I give the handling of the incident a pass mark, things can be done better but in the heat of "Battle" in the split seconds we have to react they did a damn good job.

As with all things it's easy to look at things in hindsight and slomo replays but in the real world at real world speeds with zero forewarning they did a good job.

[Average Punter]

Thanks PVDA but I also asked what is the "normal" flag procedure for a stall on the grid?

[pascofi m-sport]

the footage from TEGA gives a different view of the crash. But what do they make those out of, as both cameras survived the impact. Is it the same material they use for the black box.

Even though the WA safety teams were there, full credit to the other pit crews who raced to help after the initial impact. Keep up the good work.

[bludvl_x19]

Originally Posted by Average Punter

Thanks PVDA but I also asked what is the "normal" flag procedure for a stall on the grid?

Gridmarshals on each row of the grid stand facing the start line. If a car stalls next to them, you wave your flag like it is going out of fashion. If someone further up the grid waves their flag, you stick yours out as well and again, wave the thing like your arm is about to drop off.

The guys at 11 in that image, I don't believe that they are 'part of the action' just yet. The crash happened on the grid, so imo (and I am prepared to be wrong) so they aren't required to wave their yellow. Once the grid clears, then I think it is the flaggies track. I can deal with being wrong if someone can clear that bit up for me.

[Average Punter]

Thanks bludvl_x19. That's what I thought.

If that's the case, isn't there something fundamentally wrong with a grid design that allows up to 8 rows of cars without grid marshalls???

By pushing the front row back far enough to allow a decent run into turn one, they've left the back markers very vulnerable to stalls on the grid as there are no grid marshalls alongside each row from about Row 6 back.....

[PVDA]

Bludvl is pretty close to correct except the normal flag posts would wave a yellow if the stalled car is in thier yellow sector even if it's on the grid at the start.

In the photo above where the car was stalled would be in the prior posts yellow sector so they'd cover it with a yellow and the guys at 11 would inherit it once it was shoved over the imaginary line into their sector.

At least now when pit crews complain about not being allowed to stand on the pit wall at race starts we can use this as an example of why they've got to stand well back (or bring marshmellows with them).

[GTRMagic]

And a full waved yellow at 11 would be almost useless since Mr Owen was among the last cars off the grid... so they would be waving flags at the chase cars

[GTRMagic]

Story Here