OWR Press release

[GP Racer]

Don't worry about me jj, I'm over it, and so is CART...

[Mags]

Originally posted by GP Racer
Don't worry about me jj, I'm over it, and so is CART...

CART might be over, but OWR isn't! The news series will be vibrant, and I can't WAIT for Long Beach, when I will be live, reporting and sending you all pictures and being able to say "I Told YOU So!!!!!

[sgjb]

Why do smart people say such stupid things. KK seems to now care about the millions of fans that want to see racing in america. He doesn't seem to care at all about the fans who had faith in CART enough to purchase shares to help the series thrive. Their are alot of people who bought shares that everybody fails to remember, not all the shares are owned by money hungry corporations.

As for his comment about TG wanting to kill the series and them wanting to build the series. I only see these types of comments as antagonistic towards TG. If I were OWRS I wouldn't be goading TG at all. If TG feels he has already gotten a bad rap and people feel that he is bad, why not just kill the series, as everybody has already blamed him for everything else. The money needed to kill CART and help his series is a pitance to what TG spends in a week helping the irl.

I wish the OWRS people would just stay quiet and get the deal done. Critising another person helps no-one, especially if it is TG. It is clear he operates not always on straight business logic but alot of emotion as well. Why wake a BEAR!

Long live CART!

[Snrub]

Originally posted by GP Racer
KK's statement about caring about American jobs, really frosted my butt, as you probably noticed, and I know I'm not the only American to feel this way. I think many of us feel that the series abandoned us quite some time ago.

I still don't get the outrage. I think we both agree CART didn't do anything to cause or prevent the lack of american's situation. As for prevention, CART's job is not to hire drivers. Until 2003 CART didn't have a substantial roll in how teams operated (ie. they paid for them in 2003). Also, it's at the very core of 'american style' democracy that they let the teams do their thing. The very foundation of CART was suppose to be somewhat democratic with the participants of CART calling the shots. Is TG more 'patriotic' for making a farce of his own rules by letting GM introduce a radically new engine mid-season because they are based out of the US? Atleast to me this kind of behavious is the most 'anti-american'. Let the lack of americans annoy you, but the outrage you've expressed is uncalled for (IMO).

As I mentioned before, the marketing of Andretti and Unser Jr. clearly shows CART knew the importance of having Americans in the series. Would it not be against American values that they did not hype Zanardi and JPM the way they did Andretti, even though both were clearly superior than Andretti during the periods they competed with him?

Bottom line: Not getting Americans into the series was perhaps short sighted from a business perspective, but in no way amoral.

[Hazza]

You are forgetting the small part about the new GM engine not being a GM engine, remember...

[dirtfan]

Coventry isn't exactly a suburb of Dearborn, and Ilmore isn't in a Pacific Rim country (it wasn't in Germany, either).

[GP Racer]

Originally posted by Snrub
I still don't get the outrage. I think we both agree CART didn't do anything to cause or prevent the lack of american's situation. As for prevention, CART's job is not to hire drivers. Until 2003 CART didn't have a substantial roll in how teams operated (ie. they paid for them in 2003). Also, it's at the very core of 'american style' democracy that they let the teams do their thing. The very foundation of CART was suppose to be somewhat democratic with the participants of CART calling the shots. Is TG more 'patriotic' for making a farce of his own rules by letting GM introduce a radically new engine mid-season because they are based out of the US? Atleast to me this kind of behavious is the most 'anti-american'. Let the lack of americans annoy you, but the outrage you've expressed is uncalled for (IMO).

As I mentioned before, the marketing of Andretti and Unser Jr. clearly shows CART knew the importance of having Americans in the series. Would it not be against American values that they did not hype Zanardi and JPM the way they did Andretti, even though both were clearly superior than Andretti during the periods they competed with him?

Bottom line: Not getting Americans into the series was perhaps short sighted from a business perspective, but in no way amoral.

Boy, its obvious I'm not getting my point across, but I'll try one more time, calmly!

IMHO, its the very lack of American drivers, that is partly to blame for the situation CART now finds itself in. You simply cannot have 3/4 of your races in the US, the home country of the series, and have no home grown drivers. Where is the interest for the American fan? What would CASCAR(I think thats it) be without Canadian drivers? If they were all Americans racing in that series, and I told you, well thats alright, whats the big deal, I'm sure you would tell me, it is a big deal. Lets face it, the series wouldn't make it without Canadians in it, simply because it was created for the very reason of have Canadian drivers in it.

CART got away from there core audience and wanted to go international. They forgot that the American fan mattered, as they courted the foreign market, and they forgot that American fans like American drivers. They forgot that what got them there, was always having a BALANCED field of drivers, not all Americans, but a good mix. Its a sin, that all the top NASCAR guys out there today, started in open wheel, and not one of them are in CART. They may haved saved this series.

Cart may not hire the drivers, but there the ones who guide things and set the tone for whats right for the series, and if they didn't see this as a problem in the making, than they deserve the mess that they got. Because any rookie fan could see that no American drivers=no American fans. They should have talked to the teams.

For Kalkhoven to come pandering to the American fans in the 11th hour of this mess, because I havn't heard any concern for a very long time about anything American in this series, and try to tug at our heart-strings, was just to much to take.

I hope that clears up my position. Whew...

[suzmac]

Originally posted by Mags
CART might be over, but OWR isn't! The news series will be vibrant, and I can't WAIT for Long Beach, when I will be live, reporting and sending you all pictures and being able to say "I Told YOU So!!!!!

I will be looking forward to your pictures and stories of the race weekend! Only wish I could be there with you so we could see "our Patrick"!! Yeah tell all those doubters.."I Told You So!!!" You go girl

Sue

[GP Racer]

Suzmac, your enthusiasm knows no bounds!

Could I borrow those rose colored glasses your wearing?

[suzmac]

Originally posted by GP Racer
Suzmac, your enthusiasm knows no bounds!

Could I borrow those rose colored glasses your wearing?

You're right it doesn't!! I try to be optimistic about everything! I see no reason to not look forward to the 2004 Champ Car racing season and Mags' stories

Don't give up yet GP

Sue

[Flatspot]

So GP what do you do when your a team owner, hire the best driver or hire the American? I personally would hire the best driver. Then what do you do if your a sanctioning body who has owners that want to hire the best drivers? You've done a great job of identifying a problem but I am curious about how you would handel the foreign driver situation C^RT found itself in and the IRL is morphing to slowly but surely?

Please don't take this as a poke at your post but rather prompting further discussion on the issue.

[GP Racer]

Fair question, Flatspot.

Team American Spirit is a good example of a team owner who saw the need to have American drivers on his team, and he went out and got them. As financially poor as his team was, it drew quite alot of attention from fans(unfortunately not sponsors) and was surely one of the most popular teams on the grid. What Johansen did was a noble effort that came to late to draw American sponsors, as they were long disinterested in CART. If more teams did what he did earlier on, than American sponsors might have been lured back.

And as for the best drivers, and I keep going back to this, there the NASCAR guys. Gordon, Stewart ,Yeahly and a host of others, were never looked at, and now they thank there lucky stars they weren't. Why in the world wouldn't a CART team want these guys, especially with some of the stiffs and no names that are out there now? I mean this drivers field is weak, and PT should have taken this thing walking away, but he almost lost. A full half of the field was made up of rookies, and not one team could take a chance on an American? So to tell me that teams are picking the best, is a stretch. Pook gave away alot of money in subsidisation to teams, alittle could have been given to secure a couple of American drivers, it may have saved this series.

Sometimes its not the best drivers, but the right ones.






Team

[dirtfan]

Tony Stewart tried IRL, did pretty well, then followed the $$$ to NASCAR. Now Tony Stewart Racing supports 2 Sprint teams, an Outlaw team, a Midget team and half a Silver Crown team.
And he plays in stuff like the Chili Bowl when Joe lets him.
What racer could ask for more?

[indycool]

I live in Indianapolis and each winter, after the season is over, there is the "silly season" for jobs with race teams, mechanics, truck drivers, secretaries, whatever. People switch teams, teams switch people. It is a much greater motion than when drivers switch rides or baseball teams make a trade.

As nearly as anyone can estimate, 150-200 team members were laid off for the winter among teams that have already folded. Some of those were told they'd be called back when the dust cleared and the teams knew what they were doing and going to be able to pursue in '04.

CART laid off around 40 people at the end of the season from its HQ. Others have left since with CART in bankruptcy.

There is a huge cottage industry in the racing business in Indianapolis, fabricating all kinds of racing stuff. Many of those who lost their jobs will land somewhere in the swirl. Some will be out of racing.

But for KK to use the word "THOUSANDS" is absolutely ridiculous.

On another subject brought up in this thread, Alex Barron and Bryan Herta won IRL races last year in addition to Hornish. They're Americans.

[paul-collins]

...and yet he doesn't field an OW formula team. Says something about how much fun he had in the IRL...

[indycool]

At one point at Indy, Stewart did, with Larry Curry and Jack Miller as his team driver. He might again.

[paul-collins]

I could see him doing it once there's a series with both road races and the 500. I'd be surprised if he'll do it before. (And I have no reason to think this other than gut feelings.)

[indycool]

Probably true, Paul....

[Snrub]

GP I'm still utterly unconvinced of the 'outrage'. (No one would dispute the logic of having Americans in the series)The only solution you offer is that CART should have 'talked to the teams.' Craig could have said "hey Roger, rather than hiring Emmo, Ribero, PT, Defaren, Moore, Helio, would please hire an American? (other than Unser Jr.)" As for being upset by KK's comment, how do you figure he had anything to do with the history of CART? I'm not trying to pick on you, but IMO you haven't explained 'outrage' very well.

Bringing up ASTJ is quiet interesting. Essentailly a non-American decided to market American drivers to Americans and no sponsor deemed this angle valuable enough to associate their name with the team. Sure it was 11th hour, but is it's CART job to field an 'American' team from their own pockets? In any other year it would have been completely inappropriate. I blame KK.

[GP Racer]

You keep on qouting me as saying I'm "outraged". Where did I use that word? Frustrated, yes, outraged, no, the series is beyond the point of me being outraged about anything it does.

Beyond that, maybe as a Canadian, you can't relate to many average American race fans frustration(I'm certainly not the only one) in having an American series that has no American drivers in it. It doesn't take a genius to see that, when you have no drivers from the country that hosts a series, eventually fans will look elsewhere for there entertainment. Does my CASCAR analogy, that I made in an earlier post, make any sense to you? If it had no Canadian drivers in it, would Canadians watch? No, and who would blame them. What the hell would be the sense of a Canadian series, if it had all-American drivers in it? In that respect, Canadians are no different than Americans.

I wonder how many Canadians would keep on being fans of CART, if you had no driver or team involvment, and I don't mean the hard-core race fans here, I mean the average Canadian sitting on his couch looking for some sports on TV. Why would he watch a bunch of foreigners race, whats there to catch his attention? Lets see how the Canadian GP does without JV around. The numbers are sure to drop, its just human nature.

So whatever feelings America has about CART, right or wrong, they are real. A competitive field of both American and foreign drivers is a must, if CART is to make a go of it. If you can't see that as a Canadian, than take this American fans word for it!

[Jay]

The Canadian GP was quite successful (more and more every year) in the 14 or so years that there was no Villeneuve to chear for... I suspect it will continue to be so. Besides, if you go to the race you'll see that although Jacques is the local favorite, he is hardly the only reason people come to the race. In fact, I'd say there are a lot more Tifosi than Villeneuve supporters. That said, due to all of the other events around the Canadian GP this year (cancelled, then reinstated) I imagine the attendance will take a fair hit next year - but it will come back.

While I generally agree that having a few competitive American drivers in the series might help build some excitement - I think personality is just as important. We need drivers that people can get behind and recognize for things that make them unique - Zanardi is still known for his donuts even outside the sport, Helio Castro-Neves is known for his climbing of the fence after the race and Paul Tracy is known for well...the chrome horn. Most of the big players in Nascar have their reputations too...

[Snrub]

I didn't mean to imply you used the word outraged, I was sort of trying to characterize what you were saying. You did say you were offended by KK, etc.

I'm not a CFL fan, but a lot of the players are american. I believe there is a minimum Canadian content rule. How many Canadians are on the Jays, Expos, Rapters and the now defunct Grizzlys? Doesn't bother me. Would any or all of those do better if they had more Canadians? You bet!

[Jay]

I doubt that Snrub actually... The Jays used to have great attendance with few or no Canadians until the strikes a few years back, and I think it would only improve if the team began mounting playoff runs. I don't think the Canadian content is an issue. I think the same goes for the Raptors... I doubt a Canadian player would affect the attendance much if at all.

[Omega99]

Sports like baseball, football and hockey are simply incomparable to motorsports. In those sports, you have a team to each city, and the city thus takes pride in their team. The individual players make little difference, because no matter who they are, the people will love them and rely on them, as they play 82/136/16 games on their behalf (or whatever the case may be) and half of them are at home. Most racing series' only hold one (maybe two) events per venue per season, and to most fans, it's the driver that wins championships, and the team remains all but anonymous to them.

It is absolutely critical for many casual fans to be able to make some connection with a driver or series in order to become a serious fan. Would I have started watching CART if it weren't for the Canadian drivers and races? I doubt it. In fact, CART was the first racing series I ever cared about and it was only as I learned more about the sport that I started to follow F1 and other series' as well. If the Canadian drivers and races dissapeared, I'd probably still watch, but with much less interest as there just wouldn't be as much at stake for me. If it's supposed to be about the fans, then give them what they want, which is something to relate to. Americans relate to American drivers. Enough said.

As for CASCAR, if tbey didn't have Canadian drivers, I still wouldn't follow it.

[macdaddy]

...What Omega said...

Especially that last sentence!