Bell's Banter 2021

[zefarelly]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

The level of corruption in Spain within the police, and some of the judiciary as well as the politicians, is quite staggering to my mind.

Nothing like the British 'characters' that moved there in the 70's for a quiet life then.

[zefarelly]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Wild? They were bloody livid!

that was Gerald.


https://www.facebook.com/BritishCome...7252717054388/

[gary396]

Ref the BMWs stolen from Cadwell Park recently - Lincs police have apparently recovered the medical car (not sure what state it is in) and arrested three men. Enquiries to locate the other car continuing.

[Peter Mallett]

Good news but I wonder how it happened.

[grantp]

There are some interesting trends in sensitivity these days.

Local media a few days ago carried a video, presumably provided by the Police, about a couple of guys parked up watching the planes at EMA. Most days there are a number of vehicles parked around the area at the Donington end and Plane Spotters doing what plane spotters do. It has always been like that and continues despite the designation of a "Red Route" and a number of heavy obstacles used to limit the parking opportunities.

So these people had, apparently, travelled from South Nottingham to spend a little time one night watching plane movements - presumably the DHL shuttle flights.

Plod (is that still a word we can fondly use?) pulls up asks them what they are doing and where they are from, tells them they are being very naughty boys, and issues instant fines for breaking covid prevention regulations.

I could see the continuation of such approaches post lockdown on marginal pretexts becoming a problem. Especially if the regulations, such as they are, are not clearly withdrawn.

In parallel we have some new action being taken in respect of the Castle Donington relief road.

Might have been predicted the new road now adds to the length of the Drift circuit that has long existed to the north of Donington - ever since the A50 development and the start of the Industrial areas that replaced a farm and the Old Powerstation.

The area attracts the local boy racers and one regularly sees cars parked in the scenery.

The new section of road also attracts moped riders with exhaust deletes fitted and on a summers evening when the sound travels easily at night a lad taking 20 minutes to do a could of laps probably has no idea how annoying a slow moped without an exhaust may be for anyone living within about 5 miles. Likewise, the bikers testing VMax on the A50 may want to consider that they can probably be heard by most of the road patrols in South Derbyshire, South Notts and North Leicestershire.

Because there large open areas in the business Estate that is still under development it has become somewhat popular with car gatherings that might come under the general heading of "cruises". This has naturally drawn more and more attention from the police - probably prompted by local residents.

That's fair game for driving violations on public roads and possibly some public order offences from time to time.

At the moment covid regulations could also be deployed to make people's evening out really expensive.

However, the recent report suggested that the police would be using powers to fine and confiscate cars from people who were merely attending the place where such meetup was happening.

Now while I am more than happy to forego the noise and the potential nuisance that such events tend to introduce I'm not entirely sure that fixed penalties and confiscations are appropriate in such situations if basic attendance does not break any laws. Indeed even if it does break laws perhaps we should be questioning the nature of such laws.

I note that a recent appeal decided that the conviction of the group of people who caused damage and disruption at Stansted Airport (when preventing the deportation of various criminals that the country could do without) was to be quashed.

This implies that causing damage and disruption without good cause (and indeed against the Public Interest) is entirely acceptable according to the Justice System. So by that assessment, how can a car "cruise" (and especially attendance without proven participation) justify fines and confiscations?

Temporarily one might come up with the concept that such actions were reasonable as covid prevention measures - mostly since anything seems to fit under that heading. A dubious reason but I suspect that many people might accept it if for no other reason than it makes them feel that they have been able to "do something". Or at least agree with a large group of people with whom they otherwise have nothing at all in common.

[Lancsbreaker]

I guess cruises, drifters and particularly unsilenced bikes could be dealt with under a number of laws.



I confess that, given the general volume of cars on the roads indicates that "stay at home" is observed more in the breach than the observance, without much restriction, I am somewhat uneasy about fines being issued merely for people being some distance from home, sat in a car, when they are clearly not inter-acting with anyone else...perhaps because no-one wants to interact with plane-spotters.......Scarcely a Covid threat, is it?

[S griffin]

There will always be certain laws to make sure people don't become a nuisance

It's certainly seems quieter on the road since the lockdown. I guess if people have nothing to go to, they are unlikely to go anywhere. However I agree the measures can be a little over the top. What's the harm sitting in a car plane spotting? Most people just let them to it, so what's the problem?

[E.B]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

I guess cruises, drifters and particularly unsilenced bikes could be dealt with under a number of laws.



I confess that, given the general volume of cars on the roads indicates that "stay at home" is observed more in the breach than the observance, without much restriction, I am somewhat uneasy about fines being issued merely for people being some distance from home, sat in a car, when they are clearly not inter-acting with anyone else...perhaps because no-one wants to interact with plane-spotters.......Scarcely a Covid threat, is it?

To make sure we kept to the "essential journeys only" theme they imposed a strict 8pm to 6am curfew on us over here with heavy fines for anyone out other than essential workers..... nothing to go out for as even supermarkets that were previously 24/7 had to close by 8:00pm. If one turned up at a supermarket after 7:30 pm they would not let you in on the basis of not being able to shop pay and be home by 8:00. We were also limited to a 10klm radius of home restriction on travel..... fine of $1600 if you went beyond without a permit.

[Mike Harte]

Grant, I think that you, or somebody else on here, brought up the matter of the Stanstead defendants, but as I think that I responded, the judges unanimously decided that they had been charged under the wrong legislation, a piece of law that was intended to cover something like a terrorist attack. They all agree that they broke the law, but not the law under which they were charged and subsequently found guilty of by a jury. This was an error caused by the prosecutors using the wrong legislation; if they had used the correct act of law the judges said, then the convictions, assuming they were still found guilty, would have stood.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by E.B

To make sure we kept to the "essential journeys only" theme they imposed a strict 8pm to 6am curfew on us over here with heavy fines for anyone out other than essential workers..... nothing to go out for as even supermarkets that were previously 24/7 had to close by 8:00pm. If one turned up at a supermarket after 7:30 pm they would not let you in on the basis of not being able to shop pay and be home by 8:00. We were also limited to a 10klm radius of home restriction on travel..... fine of $1600 if you went beyond without a permit.

But our lily livered government won't, at least currently, actually take really tough actions because our Prime Minister really feels the need to be loved especially by the voters. And although our new travellers' quarantine law comes into effect on Monday next week, the government has yet to place any contracts with any hotels at which those quarantining would have to stay for 10 days.

They are an absolute shower!

[Mike Harte]

I had my Oxford jab this morning. I arrived at Boots ten minutes early, but was shown straight in to the seated waiting area, where they took my details and asked a couple, basically, security type questions. Within 5 minutes I was called into the consulting room, and a number of medical questions were asked, followed by a very quick list of possible side effects being explained. The injection was quite painless, and after the required 5 minutes sitting in the waiting room, I was free to go; all in about 20 minutes, top.

Really well organised and streamlined by Boots, with a fairly constant flow of recipients going through the process.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

But our lily livered government won't, at least currently, actually take really tough actions because our Prime Minister really feels the need to be loved especially by the voters. And although our new travellers' quarantine law comes into effect on Monday next week, the government has yet to place any contracts with any hotels at which those quarantining would have to stay for 10 days.

They are an absolute shower!

I think that was fairly predictable. No substance.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

I am somewhat uneasy about fines being issued merely for people being some distance from home, sat in a car, when they are clearly not inter-acting with anyone else...perhaps because no-one wants to interact with plane-spotters.......Scarcely a Covid threat, is it?

Originally Posted by S griffin

What's the harm sitting in a car plane spotting? Most people just let them to it, so what's the problem?

To drive your car to a plane-spotting point, you will inevitably need fuel for the journey. Filling up your car is a potential place to spread the virus.

Many cars each year need breakdown assistance. That involves someone from a breakdown firm, or another household, to come to your aid. Another way to spread the virus.

Sadly, many drivers are also involved in accidents each year. If only for repairs, your car will go into a workshop. If you need assistance following the accident, you will be interacting with emergency services. More ways you could spread the virus.

And if you unfortunately end up with the need for medical assistance, you will be diverting resources away from other priorities, including handling COVID patients. Oh, and guess what, you're also increasing the likelihood of spreading the virus into a medical establishment at this point.

How do we avoid this unnecessary drain on resource, and potential spread of the virus? Don't drive your car to carry out an unnecessary activity!!

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

Nothing like the British 'characters' that moved there in the 70's for a quiet life then.

Like this one !
It wasn't me Joe but someone else with the same forename He was liked by the local community funnily enough and after he came out he ran a bar down on the beach, we would often see him up in the village and unless you knew who he was he was just another ex pat. I don't think he managed to keep much of the money from the train robbery though

Wiki

Goody was released from prison in 1975 and four years later made his way to Spain, where he lived out his life in the Almerian countryside. There at least, it appears, he shook off his criminal past and settled into the community.

This was in the local rag when he died a while back.

Announcing Gordon Goody’s death, a spokesman for the Mojacar town hall said: “All who knew him were struck by his friendliness, his love for his friends and family and the many pets he rescued from the street. He was a complete gentleman, far removed from the image that those who didn’t know him might have had from those difficult years that marked a large part of his life. We will always remember his smile and his big heart that was always open to those around him.”

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

But our lily livered government won't, at least currently, actually take really tough actions because our Prime Minister really feels the need to be loved especially by the voters. And although our new travellers' quarantine law comes into effect on Monday next week, the government has yet to place any contracts with any hotels at which those quarantining would have to stay for 10 days.

They are an absolute shower!

Mike, you are wrong. The facts may be inconvenient to you but they do prove the opposite:

"Delivering a statement in the Commons, Mr Hancock said travellers arriving into England who lie on their passenger locator forms about visiting a red list country face up to 10 years in jail.

He said 16 hotels have been contracted for the programme, with 4,600 rooms secured."

source - BBC online https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55995645

[andy97]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

Like this one !
It wasn't me Joe but someone else with the same forename He was liked by the local community funnily enough and after he came out he ran a bar down on the beach, we would often see him up in the village and unless you knew who he was he was just another ex pat. I don't think he managed to keep much of the money from the train robbery though

Wiki

Goody was released from prison in 1975 and four years later made his way to Spain, where he lived out his life in the Almerian countryside. There at least, it appears, he shook off his criminal past and settled into the community.

This was in the local rag when he died a while back.

Announcing Gordon Goody’s death, a spokesman for the Mojacar town hall said: “All who knew him were struck by his friendliness, his love for his friends and family and the many pets he rescued from the street. He was a complete gentleman, far removed from the image that those who didn’t know him might have had from those difficult years that marked a large part of his life. We will always remember his smile and his big heart that was always open to those around him.”

Back in the late 1970s, one of the Royal Navy’s Type 21 Frigates visited Rio de Janeiro on a diplomatic visit. At the time, Ronnie Biggs was holed up there and used to delight in being photographed with the tourists and bought drinks in one of the local bars - a bunch of NCOs from the ship had a drink with him and invited him back on board the ship. Of course, once on board he was then on British territory and should have been arrested. Unfortunately he wasn’t and he went home and subsequently went on to live for a long time in Rio, defying many extradition attempts.
The chaps concerned were very proud of themselves; the Admiralty not so much.
The Officer of the Day in the Frigate (subsequently an instructor of mine) was hauled over the coals - not knowing that Biggs was on board wasn’t an acceptable excuse and he never got promoted.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

Mike, you are wrong. The facts may be inconvenient to you but they do prove the opposite:

"Delivering a statement in the Commons, Mr Hancock said travellers arriving into England who lie on their passenger locator forms about visiting a red list country face up to 10 years in jail.

He said 16 hotels have been contracted for the programme, with 4,600 rooms secured."

source - BBC online https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55995645

Couple of things to be wary of.

1/ Most stuff that comes out of Hancock's mouth, although to be fair he isn't the worst fibber of the bunch.

2/ Any detail that has been supplied after being ok'd by the govts 'clearing house' for information.

[Peter Mallett]

Gosh, I never knew we had so many political savvy posters. I've given up on FB since all I see is people shouting "liar" and or suggesting the government hasn't done this or that or whatever. I bet none of them have actually thought about what is being done and whether it has any precedent. Also whether the alternatives would and or could do better.

There will be a reckoning but right now my suggestion would be to stop moaning and if you really feel strongly, write to your MP. I have by the way.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

Mike, you are wrong. The facts may be inconvenient to you but they do prove the opposite:

"Delivering a statement in the Commons, Mr Hancock said travellers arriving into England who lie on their passenger locator forms about visiting a red list country face up to 10 years in jail.

He said 16 hotels have been contracted for the programme, with 4,600 rooms secured."

source - BBC online https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55995645

As you will note, David, I posted earlier today, and I just repeated the answer that the Home Secretary gave to the Commons yesterday afternoon when asked by a Labour member how many hotels/rooms had been contracted. She replied none.

And as Chunt says a few posts above, be wary of anything like a positive retort comes out of this bunches' mouths!

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Grant, I think that you, or somebody else on here, brought up the matter of the Stanstead defendants, but as I think that I responded, the judges unanimously decided that they had been charged under the wrong legislation, a piece of law that was intended to cover something like a terrorist attack. They all agree that they broke the law, but not the law under which they were charged and subsequently found guilty of by a jury. This was an error caused by the prosecutors using the wrong legislation; if they had used the correct act of law the judges said, then the convictions, assuming they were still found guilty, would have stood.

This reminds me of my first appearance in court with a school friend (and our headmaster one of the JP's on the bench - he was not impressed and had to abstain from the proceedings as he knew us!). Our offence was that of riding 'two-up' on a motorcycle. My mate was driving and being charged of carrying a passenger when not holding a full motorcycle license, and I was charged with aiding & abetting the offence. Mid-way through the proceedings one of the JP's spotted that my mate was only 16 and therefore his license did not permit him to ride a motorcycle (only one for a moped), and so they stopped everything, as the charge was incorrect. After a brief pause whilst those in charge discussed matters we were then offered two alternatives of how things could progress. The case could be abandoned and referred back to the prosecution service to see if they wanted to re-charge us correctly, or, if we were in agreement the court would make the necessary changes there & then and progress the case immediately. We looked at each other and shrugged our shoulders and said that effectively we'd been caught red-handed, so we were 'happy' to continue. In the end we both received a very lenient fine of £3.00 and an endorsement on our driving licenses (but this was in 1974). Mind you, we both also received a very public dressing down from the headmaster in front of the whole Sixth Form in Assembly the following morning!

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

As you will note, David, I posted earlier today, and I just repeated the answer that the Home Secretary gave to the Commons yesterday afternoon when asked by a Labour member how many hotels/rooms had been contracted. She replied none.

And as Chunt says a few posts above, be wary of anything like a positive retort comes out of this bunches' mouths!

Further to this, I note that last week's cost figure has gone up from £75 a day to now £175 a day. I also see that the contract is for, I believe, 460 travellers per day yet the government's own figure last week was that they expected at least 1000 arrivals requiring quarantine a day in the first few weeks.

[Peter Mallett]

Are all the arrivals visitors? Are there different requirements for nationals returning? The rate may be due to the refinement of the negotiations and the need for additional security. So in order to complain wouldn't it be a good idea to have a grasp of the facts rather than hearsay? I don't know if it is correct but I don't think the government is sequestering these hotels so they have to make sure the costs are manageable for those who will need them. The hotels, no doubt will be keen to ensure a very good return, and who can blame them? Hence the slow progress.

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Gosh, I never knew we had so many political savvy posters. I've given up on FB since all I see is people shouting "liar" and or suggesting the government hasn't done this or that or whatever. I bet none of them have actually thought about what is being done and whether it has any precedent. Also whether the alternatives would and or could do better.

Although I do use FB I will never get involved with arguments, as "Tracy" who works stacking shelves in Tesco's Knows far more than any expert will ever know

[Mike Harte]

I am delighted to report that six hours after receiving the Oxford jab that I have suffered no ill effects. Will update only if anything changes.

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by gary396

Ref the BMWs stolen from Cadwell Park recently - Lincs police have apparently recovered the medical car (not sure what state it is in) and arrested three men. Enquiries to locate the other car continuing.

Just seen a post on Facebook where the Police are celebrating the recovery and show the car - it appears to be largely intact, but it is in a workshop with what appear to be race cars - so unless thats a MSV site after recovery it might mean its someone in the sport who did it........EDIT: Just found a better example of the photo they published, and although it is the Cadwell Medical Car all the race cars carry BrandsHatch.co.uk logos, so I guess its a stock photo, unless the car was recovered and returned to MSV very promptly