Group A BMW 635 CSi - a popular, solid performer - Page 33

MalcolmC · 23 Sep 2011, 10:51 (Ref:2959895)

Just in case there was any doubt about Baigent's car being written off:
http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/...2011_00001.jpg
http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/...2011_00000.jpg

Cheers, Malcolm.

racer69 · 24 Sep 2011, 06:29 (Ref:2960285)

Quote:

Originally Posted by KA

A bit more on the O'Brien 635s- a comparison, a couple of Nissan-Mobil pics from Pukekohe in 1987

The O'Brien/Glenn McIntyre 'State Coal' car- notice this one is LHD
http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/q...tyreObrien.jpg

..and O'Brien's second car, leased to Allan Milligan/Avon Hyde
http://i448.photobucket.com/albums/q...nMilliganb.jpg
This one is RHD- so presumably the 'State Coal' car from the previous year, and the ex-CC chassis?

This is probably buried in this thread earlier, but what happened to the O'Brien 635s after this series, and where are they now?

Jesper OH · 24 Sep 2011, 14:12 (Ref:2960371)

Interesting question as by 1987 most 635s seems to have disappeared from the surface in Australia. The Gulsons raced their ex-JPS car quite prolific and Simon Emmerling had his WA based car (ex-Schnitzer), but staying out there. Was there a third 635 during '87? At least a third 635 was raced during the next few years, but the name of the driver escape me right now - white car with red and blue stripes across as seen during 1989?

Jesper

Andy Clegg · 24 Sep 2011, 14:41 (Ref:2960384)

Joseph Sommariva entered the car with Warren Mckellar and D. Belskyj as co-drivers. Race number was 28.

Jesper OH · 24 Sep 2011, 15:02 (Ref:2960389)

Sommariva it was - thank you Andy. Has the idendity of this car surfaced on this thread?

Jesper

KA · 24 Sep 2011, 16:21 (Ref:2960411)

Sommariva had a 635 in 1988-according to the Bill Tuckey 'Great Race' Bathurst annual for 1988, it was initially on the Bathurst entry list, but the entry was rejected, but did appear at Sandown:

'For Sandown at least, the fortunes of the Bavarian marque would lie with the two-car Mobil-Brock team, a New Zealand M3...for Francevic/John Sax/Graham Lorimer, and an old 635 for the unknowns Joe Sommariva/Darrell Belskyj/Warren McKellar, whose application for a start at Bathurst would be rejected'

Their Sandown entry, with race #87 was a DNF, and the car was white, with BMW Motorsport-style red/blue stripes across the LH front and RH rear corners- sponsorship from Sommariva Concrete, or something like that.

Sommariva continued to run the car into 1989, taking in the Nissan-Mobil race at Wellington, Sandown and Bathurst

According to David Towe (who should know, as he owned it a few years back) it was the ex-Richards 1985 car, (RA2/44) which was later raced by Garry Rogers: http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....0&postcount=83

Jesper OH · 24 Sep 2011, 16:37 (Ref:2960418)

Quote:

Originally Posted by KA

Sommariva had a 635 in 1988-according to the Bill Tuckey 'Great Race' Bathurst annual for 1988, it was initially on the Bathurst entry list, but the entry was rejected, but did appear at Sandown:

'For Sandown at least, the fortunes of the Bavarian marque would lie with the two-car Mobil-Brock team, a New Zealand M3...for Francevic/John Sax/Graham Lorimer, and an old 635 for the unknowns Joe Sommariva/Darrell Belskyj/Warren McKellar, whose application for a start at Bathurst would be rejected'

Their Sandown entry, with race #87 was a DNF, and the car was white, with BMW Motorsport-style red/blue stripes across the LH front and RH rear corners- sponsorship from Sommariva Concrete, or something like that.

Sommariva continued to run the car into 1989, taking in the Nissan-Mobil race at Wellington, Sandown and Bathurst

According to David Towe (who should know, as he owned it a few years back) it was the ex-Richards 1985 car, (RA2/44) which was later raced by Garry Rogers: http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....0&postcount=83

Thank you for the information, KA. As I know it both Emmerling and Sommariva were of German descendant - as was Ludwig Finauer of JPS fame. Can anybody confirm this?

Jesper

KA · 24 Sep 2011, 18:26 (Ref:2960449)

No idea about Sommariva, but pretty sure that Finauer was of either German or Austrian background. The 1985 Bathurst annual definitely says that Simon Emmerling was German-born:
'Emmerling, the owner of a Perth plastics injection moulding business, and Bavarian-born and raised, was in his first Bathurst', despite his mature age'

**chunterer** · 24 Sep 2011, 19:33 (Ref:2960469)

Quote:

Originally Posted by KA

No idea about Sommariva, but pretty sure that Finauer was of either German or Austrian background. The 1985 Bathurst annual definitely says that Simon Emmerling was German-born:
'Emmerling, the owner of a Perth plastics injection moulding business, and Bavarian-born and raised, was in his first Bathurst', despite his mature age'

Yes I think that Finauer was a BMW Motorsport engineer and development driver in Munich. Wasn't on some kind of secondment to Frank Gardner to help develop the JPS cars IIRC?

cavvy · 25 Sep 2011, 01:16 (Ref:2960543)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesper OH

Interesting question as by 1987 most 635s seems to have disappeared from the surface in Australia. The Gulsons raced their ex-JPS car quite prolific and Simon Emmerling had his WA based car (ex-Schnitzer), but staying out there. Was there a third 635 during '87? At least a third 635 was raced during the next few years, but the name of the driver escape me right now - white car with red and blue stripes across as seen during 1989?

Jesper

Simon Emmerling had been racing an Alpina version of the 3.0s in West Aus before debuting the 635 in August 1985, sourced from Germany.

RA2/034
Schnitzer (Original Teile) 1984 ETCC (Quester/Stuck)
1985 sold to Simon Emmerling in Australia
Still with Emmerling, rebuilt into Sports Sedan with Holden or Chevy V8. Crashed 2006

Not sure how the rebuild is going.

**chunterer** · 25 Sep 2011, 07:16 (Ref:2960562)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cavvy

Simon Emmerling had been racing an Alpina version of the 3.0s in West Aus before debuting the 635 in August 1985, sourced from Germany.

RA2/034
Schnitzer (Original Teile) 1984 ETCC (Quester/Stuck)
1985 sold to Simon Emmerling in Australia
Still with Emmerling, rebuilt into Sports Sedan with Holden or Chevy V8. Crashed 2006

Not sure how the rebuild is going.

So I must've seen that car at the TT that year then. Quester was at the wheel when he got gobbled up by Tom Walkinshaw on a late race charge in the V10 XJS!!

It was one of the 2 main 635 challengers that season. The other being the Brancatelli/Kelleners Eggenberger/BMW Italia car.

Tyring to think if this car won a race that season, and whether it did any ETC in 1985 before going to Australia?

Andy Clegg · 25 Sep 2011, 07:36 (Ref:2960564)

I got my info from "The Great Race 1989/90". I always used to watch Bathurst 'cause of the Sierra Cosworths that raced over there.

racer69 · 25 Sep 2011, 08:07 (Ref:2960569)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesper OH

Interesting question as by 1987 most 635s seems to have disappeared from the surface in Australia. The Gulsons raced their ex-JPS car quite prolific and Simon Emmerling had his WA based car (ex-Schnitzer), but staying out there. Was there a third 635 during '87?

John Virgo & Des Wall drove a red 635 in the 1987 Castrol 500 at Sandown.

Jesper OH · 1 Oct 2011, 19:51 (Ref:2963777)

Quote:

Originally Posted by racer69

John Virgo & Des Wall drove a red 635 in the 1987 Castrol 500 at Sandown.

Thank you for the information, racer69. Was this 635 wearing #20 for the race? I know Des Wall as the driver of a Toyota Supra Sports Sedan later.

On a totally different approach to the 635 thread I have found the result for the Jägermeister Brun Motorsport BMW 635CSi from the 1985 Nürburgring ETCC race. Harald Grohs and entrant Walter Brun qualified their car in 8th, between the Schnitzer cars and finished 5th - still flanked by the factory cars! A wery fine result by this privateer team. Harald Grohs was driving at his finest by this point, while Walter Brun was a steady gentleman racer. The year before they lost a wheel and retired.

Jesper

Shipper · 13 Oct 2011, 05:47 (Ref:2970248)

Guys,

Here's the article on the coverted Aussie 635 Group A racer.

E36ST · 13 Oct 2011, 08:10 (Ref:2970311)

Any chance that article could be hosted somewhere at better resolution? It looks like an interesting article but can't quite read it.

DAVID PATERSON · 13 Oct 2011, 09:51 (Ref:2970373)

What a terrible waste!

Alex E · 13 Oct 2011, 17:15 (Ref:2970599)

Couldn`t agree more....

Shipper · 13 Oct 2011, 22:45 (Ref:2970764)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex E

Couldn`t agree more....

I agree. You can make a sports sedan out of anything. A terrible waste to do this to an original Group A e24 touring car. Still, at least it is alive although the article is from 2002 so if the car was crashed in 2006 who knows what is left.

I have said jpegs as full size pdf's. Let me know what site can host them (PDF files) and I'll post them up. They are a great read.

FLORENT MOULIN · 14 Oct 2011, 07:26 (Ref:2970873)

Hope someone will do the return way ...

KA · 14 Oct 2011, 10:09 (Ref:2970966)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shipper

I agree. You can make a sports sedan out of anything. A terrible waste to do this to an original Group A e24 touring car. Still, at least it is alive although the article is from 2002 so if the car was crashed in 2006 who knows what is left.

I have said jpegs as full size pdf's. Let me know what site can host them (PDF files) and I'll post them up. They are a great read.

I guess it depends on when Emmerling converted the car to a sports sedan- if he'd done it fairly recently, then yes, it would have seemed crazy, but if it was done back in the late 80's/early 90's, when basically it was no more than an elderly and uncompetitive ex-touring car, it probably seemed to be a sensible way of keeping the car raceable- I suspect quite a few Group A cars went the same way, certainly plenty of RS500s here in the UK got the 'Thundersaloon' treatment with wide-arched bodykits, bigger wheels etc- at least the car wasn't broken up for parts.

The question is, how reversible is the conversion, especially as the Emmerling BMW was heavily shunted a few years back

BILTEL · 15 Oct 2011, 09:09 (Ref:2971475)

That ruined that!!!!

Alex E · 15 Oct 2011, 17:22 (Ref:2971604)

http://www.bonhams.com/aus/auction/19746/lot/378/

I was sent this today.

**chunterer** · 15 Oct 2011, 21:03 (Ref:2971672)

Wow, that is a very interesting beast!!

Surely a one of a kind...

Jesper OH · 15 Oct 2011, 21:11 (Ref:2971677)

Interesting piece on the car and it's history. How does the bit about Allan Grice buying the car in the first place fit? As I understand it Frank Gardner ran the JPS Team BMW outfit, with BMW Australia owning the car I pressume, with Allan Grice being the hired hand to drive it. A lack of results or a clash of personality Grice vs. Gardner ended the collaboration, Jim Richards replacing Grice for 1982.
If Grice was the owner but parting with the team, would that imply that he sold this car to BMW Australia? Or for that matter that his deal with Gardner was like the one Neville Crichton and Garry Rogers would do in 1985 and 1986, owning their respective cars but run by Gardner in JPS colours?

Jesper

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