SpeedingTortoise's Tracks

[SpeedingTortoise]

Originally Posted by SpeedingTortoise

I'll have to do something about that

Ive done something about that. The biggest change is the new section before the last corner, designed to slow the cars/bikes down going into the last corner and it also provides an overtaking opportunity. Its increased the lap length to 3.4mi/2.4mi/2.1mi. Ive also straightened out the S/F kink and added more run off to T2. And just for clarity, the run off at T19 and T24 go under the grandstands

[bio]

Ah, the gravel traps go under the stand! Now I see.

But, if the same applies for the last corner than no modifications were IMHO necessary in the first place.

bio

[LuiggiSpeed]

Originally Posted by bio

Ah, the gravel traps go under the stand! Now I see.

But, if the same applies for the last corner than no modifications were IMHO necessary in the first place.

bio

that's a novel idea

[LuiggiSpeed]

Originally Posted by SpeedingTortoise

Ive done something about that. The biggest change is the new section before the last corner, designed to slow the cars/bikes down going into the last corner and it also provides an overtaking opportunity. Its increased the lap length to 3.4mi/2.4mi/2.1mi. Ive also straightened out the S/F kink and added more run off to T2. And just for clarity, the run off at T19 and T24 go under the grandstands

way better now

[bio]

Luiggi, didn't you complain about the final corner because you thought it had no runoff?

bio

[werner]

Originally Posted by LuiggiSpeed

that's a novel idea

No, it is not. As a bike enthousiast, you must know this famous corner.

[Purist]

Is that the run into the final chicane at Assen?

[werner]

Yes, it is. Dozens of Grand Prix' were decided in that very corner.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

It is assen but if you use street view on google earth/maps you'll see that the overhang above the gravel is at most 2 or 3 metres, and only for a very short distance of perhaps 15 metres.

The corner at the end of the long straight on the Yas Marina circuit has tarmac run off that does extend well under and I think actually beyond the grandstands. That would be a better example of what Speeding Tortoise would need to have built.

[LuiggiSpeed]

Luiggi, didn't you complain about the final corner because you thought it had no runoff?

bio

Yes definitively I see a lot of speed in that kink, any out of control vehicle will be flying towards the stands, as I understood in the first original version, now I saw still little run off but then the detail about the under level run off might help if it really is big enough, if it's not it'll only serve to block the view of the accidents

Originally Posted by werner

No, it is not. As a bike enthousiast, you must know this famous corner.

Yes yes but like was said, is it big enough for the conditions? I see the chicane version solved the problem right away and added an interesting twist there at the end, that was a good comeback!!! :lol:

Luiggi

[bio]

Originally Posted by LuiggiSpeed

Yes definitively I see a lot of speed in that kink, any out of control vehicle will be flying towards the stands, as I understood in the first original version, now I saw still little run off but then the detail about the under level run off might help if it really is big enough, if it's not it'll only serve to block the view of the accidents

Luiggi

OK, I just think the under-stand runoff was there all the time, we just didn't realize it was there

bio

[Yannick]

ST, this recent design of yours is a track that's tailor made for the F-Duct with its two long straights and an overabundance of tasty technical sections on the rest of the lap. I guess this is a place where only the best car/driver combination can succeed.

[SpeedingTortoise]

Yes Yannick but the F-Duct isnt allowed for 2011 and with the adjustable rear wing and KERS returning, this track would make for some interesting racing

[SpeedingTortoise]

Heres my latest Full Circuit-3.8mi North Circuit-1.9mi South Circuit-1.7mi all clockwise no elevation

[bio]

Well, dunno... i feel just a bit too much is going on here. I'd get rid of some of the slower parts here, like that very slow chicane bottom left or the Z-turn top right.

I'd also make the bottom section a straight with one slow corner at the end instead of the chicane to make it an overtaking spot. This track in its present form seems to have only one genuine overtaking spot, at the end of the S/F straight. another one would be a good idea, without it, i feel, races on this one would be a little like Hungaroring: plenty of opportunities to blow the race and only one true overtaking spot.

The top half is a true gem on its own!

bio

PS: Why is that gravel trap at T1 so huge?

[werner]

I also think about the Hungororing when I see this track; a great challenge to get a fast laptime, but lacking overtakingspots and fast corners. I'd start whith changing the last 3 corners into a parabolica-like corner.
The easiest way to create an extra overtaking-opprtunity is to reprofile the corner at the end of the southern straight into a run-of-the-mill slow Z, but I'm actually quite fond of that quirky wrong-way-round-looking combination that you have created. It must be very difficult to get right, with the increasing radius under braking for the first part, and than still having to brake for the right-hand part of the chicane while bouncing over the kerbs of the first part. Overtaking will be difficult though, because the racingline goes from one side of the track to the other under braking. You will really have to be side to side with your opponent before the brakingpoint to have a chance, but you might also get an accident quite easlily. Maybe it is different for bikes, but some elbows will be used I guess. Difficult decision...

[ECW Dan Selby]

I quite like it. I mean, not every track needs to have designated 'overtaking spots', I guess.

With this track, and many of the creations around here for that matter, i'd love to see some sort of hovering lap, or better still, on-board.

But that's just me being incredibly snobby

Selby

[bio]

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

I quite like it. I mean, not every track needs to have designated 'overtaking spots', I guess.

With this track, and many of the creations around here for that matter, i'd love to see some sort of hovering lap, or better still, on-board.

But that's just me being incredibly snobby

Selby

Hi,
the thing is that the overwhelming majority of overtaking takes place at those "designated" spots - the fewer a track has of them, the fewer overtaking that's probably gonna take place. Now, the question is - how good a race can be with few overtakes. A good question... There have been quite good races at the Hungaroring despite it having only one real overtaking spot... But I don't see how creating another one could hurt the case...

bio

[bio]

Originally Posted by werner

I'm actually quite fond of that quirky wrong-way-round-looking combination that you have created.

The only huge problem with it - besidesbeing a missed overtaking spot - is that cars swerving off there can easily slide back on the track and that's quite dangerous a prospect...

bio

[ECW Dan Selby]

Originally Posted by bio

Hi,
the thing is that the overwhelming majority of overtaking takes place at those "designated" spots - the fewer a track has of them, the fewer overtaking that's probably gonna take place. Now, the question is - how good a race can be with few overtakes. A good question... There have been quite good races at the Hungaroring despite it having only one real overtaking spot... But I don't see how creating another one could hurt the case...

bio

It goes back to the whole 'is it the cars or the tracks' debate loosely doesn't it?

This kind of reminds me of Imola. You can have good races there, but stats showed us that I think the majority of the races didn't include a huge amount of overtaking (post-1994 that is).

But then it's possibly a balance of creating one/two spots for an overtake, and having the rest just simply quite a challenge.

Selby

[bio]

I guess there can be several reasons for lack of overtaking in a circuit. There can be few long sections where ample speed can be obtained (Hungaroring) or the track might be pretty fast - but at the end of the fast sections are arranged so that overtaking is hard at best (Imola) - the outcome will be hugely different: the source of excitement at the Hungaroring-type tracks will be that due to relatively low speeds the cars will probably stick together - even at the front - and this always promises exciting races; at the Imola-type races however, the sheer speed is that keeps races thrilling.

bio

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by bio

I guess there can be several reasons for lack of overtaking in a circuit. There can be few long sections where ample speed can be obtained (Hungaroring) or the track might be pretty fast - but at the end of the fast sections are arranged so that overtaking is hard at best (Imola) - the outcome will be hugely different: the source of excitement at the Hungaroring-type tracks will be that due to relatively low speeds the cars will probably stick together - even at the front - and this always promises exciting races; at the Imola-type races however, the sheer speed is that keeps races thrilling.

bio

The question of cars or tracks is firmly in favour of the cars being responsible in my view. I have gone back to the 80's and looked at the best passes even at places like Hungaroring and noted passes by mansell on senna and other famous (or infamous) passes there and at other places and I have decided its the cars.... not the circuits.

[SpeedingTortoise]

I wasnt sure if i was going to do an update for this track. i liked the fact that the overtaking would be more special and harder to pull off with this kind of track. But anyways i done an update to help overtaking by changing T2, completely changing the section between T4 and T8 and tightening T13. Comment and stuff as usual

[SpeedingTortoise]

This is going to be my last track of the month and its completely different from the tracks ive put out earlier in the month. 3.1mi Full Clockwise no elevation

[Purist]

I like it. I'm thinking that Melbourne and Assen are somewhat responsible for this one.

There are just a few things I noticed that may or may not warrant a second look. If Turn 3 is flat-out, overtaking into Turn 4 shouldn't be a problem, but if Turn 3 is not, that will make things decidedly trickier. The right/left flick before the long back stretch has me wondering if someone might go flying straight through the run-off and onto the other piece of track coming out of the turns. Finally, I think that the bend at the end of the back stretch may be a bit too close to the left-hand 180 that follows it, which could make overtaking there rather more difficult.

On the whole though, this one is very good.