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9 May 2016, 22:53 (Ref:3640506) | #10501 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 825
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Hey, thanks very much for this. It would be great if GG could talk more about this but I think it's pretty bad that teams can't change their mind about it. This makes it a silly gamble, imho.
Are teams restricted to only 2 different types of slick tyres per weekend? If so, then's it's pretty lame and F1-like. Are this operational temps related to ambient or track ones? I would assume the later but just to be sure..... It seems it was too hot even during QLF and Toyota might have benefitted even there. |
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9 May 2016, 23:06 (Ref:3640509) | #10502 | ||
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Quote:
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10 May 2016, 00:52 (Ref:3640523) | #10503 | |
Racer
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 363
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I still feel this was to some extent a preparation test for Le Mans. When has a full LD package made sense for Spa? The sprint package wouldn't be very well suited either, but I think an inter package is the answer, not LD.
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10 May 2016, 06:59 (Ref:3640561) | #10504 | |||
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,270
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Quote:
3 - track temps. |
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When in doubt? C4. |
10 May 2016, 08:36 (Ref:3640580) | #10505 | ||
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Posts: 1,240
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Quote:
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10 May 2016, 13:33 (Ref:3640615) | #10506 | ||
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,926
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Does this mean that Audi and Toyota are overgearing their cars, since Porsche use all 7 gears in their transmission, or are Audi and Toyota running a LM-spec gearbox with LM transmission/diff. ratios?
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10 May 2016, 13:39 (Ref:3640616) | #10507 | |||
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Join Date: Feb 2013
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Quote:
1. Do we have evidence that Porsche were using all seven gears ? 2. Audi and Toyota are supposed to be using six-gear and seven-gear gearboxes, but the video shows that the highest gear used by Audi and Toyota at the end of the Kemmel straight was 5th and 6th gear respectively. Is the reverse gear being accounted for as one of the relevant gears ? |
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10 May 2016, 15:29 (Ref:3640642) | #10508 | ||
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Join Date: Dec 2006
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There's an onboard video on You Tube of one of the Porsche using all 7 gears during a lap, and it was from the steering wheel display.
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10 May 2016, 20:54 (Ref:3640717) | #10509 | |
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 972
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looking at the onboard telemetry from spa 2015, audi is in 6th gear from 260 km/h up and they seem to stay in 6th up to top speed. they did use 7 gears at le mans though and the change from 5th to 6th happened still around 260 km/h. 6th to 7th happened well after 300 km/h. so it's most probable they're doing the same now, with one less gear: 5th for their max speed in spa, 6th for le mans only (and the change from 5th to 6th only happening around 330 km/h??).
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10 May 2016, 20:59 (Ref:3640719) | #10510 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15,561
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Longer gearing can save fuel can it not?
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11 May 2016, 06:13 (Ref:3640787) | #10511 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 614
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If that was true, then they would switch to top gear at 300+ kph, maybe they didn't because they where in a fight mode and we don't have telemetry from "normal" drive on that straight.
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11 May 2016, 07:55 (Ref:3640797) | #10512 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,240
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I'm more surprised about audi gear box settings than toyota one, and now explain why. Last year TS040 used 7 gears, but was powered by 3.7 NA engine that surely was developing less than 450Nm in the whole rpm range. This year TS050 is powered by a twin turbo engine that even if running close to 8000rpm, surely developes much more torque + the torque released by the rear KERS, I bet that rear differentials of TS050 must to manage an insane amount of torque!!!
that's maybe is the main reason of a 6 speeds gb; it's a clever way to prevent issues at the transmission and its components. Audi kept the same 4L turbo diesel engine; it was updated indeed, but because of 6MJ jump and more restrictive fuel flow, very likely is less powerfull than last year when R18 had a 7 speeds gb, even if all races but le mans were used only 6 speeds. If engine very likely developes less torque than last year, why step back to a 5 or 6 gb? I guess is because audi extremized every part inside the 2016 R18, making the transmission as lightest as possible. A lighter transmision can sustain less stress, so better drop the 7th speed and basically run very long ratios of speeds used more frequently (3th and 4th). It makes sense, also because is the same solution used in past for R10 and R15 (that had only 5 speeds) Like audi, porsche hybrid power is released only to front wheels, and very likely ICE and transmission remained almost untouched from 2015; there was no need to drop anything. Last edited by carbon_titanium; 11 May 2016 at 07:57. Reason: lost in speeds... more or less like barry allen |
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11 May 2016, 07:59 (Ref:3640798) | #10513 | |
Racer
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 128
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my guess is that, for audi, 6th gear is not on board to save weight in Spa. They will change the gear for Le Mans to gain the extra speed.
Toyota on the other hand, has a higher rev engine so they are unlikely to have 7th gear. (guessing the top speed of 340~350 is their max |
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11 May 2016, 07:59 (Ref:3640799) | #10514 | |
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Join Date: Oct 2013
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of course is just my interpreration of reality.
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11 May 2016, 09:37 (Ref:3640820) | #10515 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 614
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The answer may lay in fuel flow cut from last year.
Lets, say that Audi engine is capable of developing 650 HP at 4,500 rpm (1,014 Nm), but only if you feed it with enough fuel flow (eg. 90 kg/h). On the other hand it may be true that it can develop 500 HP at as low as 3,500 rpm (1,004 Nm), but naturally it can not be feed with same amount of fuel flow, but less (in the 70 kg/h region). Now what happens when you restrict fuel flow to 71 kg/h? Power curve will be near flat from 3,500 to 4,500 rpm, no need to have extra gears if the engine can produce the same power already between longer gears. Same thing can be said for petrol engine, especially if it's turbo. I think this is the answer why they didn't bother with changing gear ratios for eg. Silverstone, top gear will be only used at top speed at LeMans. It may also be that 10MJ fuel flow restriction news came too late, when every one already had gearbox to utilize higher and more narrow engine rpm with higher fuel flow. But from efficiency stand point, it's hard to say it's worth it to rev higher on same restricted fuel flow if you already have max power in lower rpm with reving higher comes higher friction losses, and engine power with same fuel flow will be droping, not staying the same. But here also turbo comes into play and I have no idea how that affects efficiency. Last edited by GasperG; 11 May 2016 at 09:50. |
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11 May 2016, 16:04 (Ref:3640915) | #10516 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 363
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11 May 2016, 16:15 (Ref:3640920) | #10517 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 363
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11 May 2016, 17:11 (Ref:3640925) | #10518 | |
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__________________
"Every Le Mans, the car which wins Le Mans is the best car." - Tom Kristensen |
11 May 2016, 20:13 (Ref:3640964) | #10519 | |
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R10 and R15 (+ and ++) used 5 gears gb to don't make suffer too much the transmission that had to endure constantly >1200Nm (at least speking of R10 engine). Peugeot 908HDi had 6 gears, but I guess peugeot used a more resistant gearbox, surely heavier than audi one. Infact min. weight of 908HDi was almost always closer to 1000kg than 930.
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12 May 2016, 01:29 (Ref:3641022) | #10520 | |
Racer
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 363
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Wow, I always thought the R15+ had upgraded to a 6-speed, don't remember why. So then the R18 was the first Audi lmp to have a 6-speed. Interesting.
But I also feel 6 gears would be enough for this year. |
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12 May 2016, 10:12 (Ref:3641086) | #10521 | |
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12 May 2016, 10:49 (Ref:3641097) | #10522 | |||
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,132
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Quote:
I was wondering if this structure could be used to house ballast, but it is quite exposed to potential damage. Could this house some sensor of some sort ? |
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12 May 2016, 11:05 (Ref:3641100) | #10523 | ||
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,897
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Mass air flow? It looks large for one though. Might have something to do with how sensitive the aero is, a maf sensor would give info as to how much air is actually moving through the aero devices.
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12 May 2016, 12:52 (Ref:3641122) | #10524 | |
Rookie
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 51
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My guess would be that it is a laser ride hight sensor.
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12 May 2016, 13:46 (Ref:3641131) | #10525 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,107
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We shall name it the "Uvula"!
It seems large for a sensor. Maybe it houses multiple sensors. Given the size and being so low, I can imagine the gravitation toward the idea of ballast. How about a tuned mass damper of some sort! (I expect those are illegal?) Richard |
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