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20 Dec 2013, 16:17 (Ref:3346352) | #101 | ||
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20 Dec 2013, 16:57 (Ref:3346366) | #102 | ||
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the change comes in to affect on Jan 1st 2014 so still time to change it
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20 Dec 2013, 18:01 (Ref:3346379) | #103 | |
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20 Dec 2013, 18:07 (Ref:3346382) | #104 | |||
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20 Dec 2013, 18:08 (Ref:3346383) | #105 | ||
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I think where this is going to have the largest impact is in Race Control. Racegypsy's post is correct about some of the things you have to do which are simply not necessary under the North American system, such as writing physical reports.
Similar DWY rules exist for non-SCCA series, especially here on the Left Coast. We have been at minimal flagger numbers for many years now, so changes have occurred incrementally to cover some of the situations you mentioned, and just about all of those have been at the Race Control level. 1. Before any day on track, stations who feel themselves to be understaffed make arrangements on the landline or radio with adjacent stations: "If you see me doing this, call it!" Race Control notes this as part of the day's SOP (listens in on the conversation and may request or suggest a refinement to what the stations themselves have agreed to). 2. All conversations on the radio or landline are digitally recorded. This is in addition to an official written and timestamped log of everything that goes on on the communication net (logger is a listen-only, piggybacked on the RC communicator's feed). These two items represent the legal, binding record of the event. Written reports are required only in specific situations as called for by the operating steward. #1 above may in fact be entered into the log at some events. 3. CCTV is your friend. I don't think I've visited a track in the past two years without a working CCTV setup -- if the track runs street car days they need to have one, for legal reasons. Even at club races RC uses the CCTV feed to "fill in" information to generate red flags, stage rescue trucks, etc. After the session is neutralized we can go back and figure out who did what to whom if necessary. 4. No storytelling in extremis -- station and flag status only as a first call. It alerts RC to look at the video feed and ask specific questions/make decisions. The tone of your voice tells us a lot! It also frees you up to do other things that may be more immediately important. I'm looking forward to seeing how this plays out for you. Keke |
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20 Dec 2013, 18:44 (Ref:3346395) | #106 | ||
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20 Dec 2013, 19:48 (Ref:3346412) | #107 | ||
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Now that I'm out of my 50's with all this extra arm movement I think it may be time to downgrade to post chief.......
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21 Dec 2013, 00:12 (Ref:3346469) | #108 | ||
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The thought only now occurs to me... that on the days when you're single manned and doing both jobs, you're waving both yellows and someone overtakes under yellow.
Can't report it, can't make a note of it, driver gets away with it. Excellent, by trying to improve visibility, we've just removed the effectiveness. |
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21 Dec 2013, 07:30 (Ref:3346535) | #109 | |||
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Then what follows is if your single manned, the meeting is not safe so can not go ahead. |
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21 Dec 2013, 07:39 (Ref:3346538) | #110 | ||
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Once, after one decidedly undermanned Donington meeting, I asked a well known steward if he would ever do it and his reply was 'only the once - and that would be the last stewarding job I even got offered'. |
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21 Dec 2013, 08:31 (Ref:3346540) | #111 | |||
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21 Dec 2013, 08:59 (Ref:3346542) | #112 | |||
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They really are a bunch of plebs...they may do things with the right intentions and ideas, but haven't thought anything through at all! I've seen both sides of it, as a competitor too with new rules being brought in over the last few years it's turned people away who have now gone 'non msa' racing instead.... Last edited by ascarracinguk; 21 Dec 2013 at 09:23. |
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21 Dec 2013, 10:12 (Ref:3346563) | #113 | ||
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I've always declined any invitation to act as both Post Chief and Flag. Happy to do either but not both.
Fortunately at Oulton, where I do most of my observing, this does not arise. Jim |
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21 Dec 2013, 10:20 (Ref:3346564) | #114 | ||
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21 Dec 2013, 11:33 (Ref:3346580) | #115 | ||
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Actually Number6 it has not happened to me at Oulton at all so the "Often" remains your addition.
Jim |
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21 Dec 2013, 13:09 (Ref:3346603) | #116 | ||
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Understood. I was attempting to expand the specific to the generic and serves me right. Oulton is usually well staffed. I've never known a "one man" post (other than flag) but I have known one PC, no flag and two trainees. Still doable using the ancient skills of delegation.
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Why is there no such thing as cat-flavored dog food? |
21 Dec 2013, 14:15 (Ref:3346629) | #117 | ||
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Dreaded double post.
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21 Dec 2013, 14:17 (Ref:3346632) | #118 | |||
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Personally I would replace them all by a decent light system. (Still operated by a "flag" marshal on a flag point.) This view is reinforced by a recent trip to Yas Marina in Abu Dhabi and seeing the excellent light system there. Oulton lights are badly placed in some cases and there is the potential for confusion when people persist with flags as well. Regards Jim |
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21 Dec 2013, 14:38 (Ref:3346641) | #119 | |||
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One of the arts to being a flaggie is getting your emotions across to the driver....for a small incident you may only have to wave a flag, for a large one you can pretty much throw your whole body into it and really let the driver know there's something wrong or the leader REALLY needs to get past....a light box is so sterile in comparison Plus a light box can only show 1 flag at a time...no good for oil/white flags again |
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21 Dec 2013, 14:54 (Ref:3346647) | #120 | ||||
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Quote:
Jim |
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21 Dec 2013, 15:05 (Ref:3346649) | #121 | |||
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I don't think the light boxes are perfect...like I said they are good in the wet or bad light for visibility.......but if I've got a car spun deep in the gravel trap where there is little danger, or a blocked track and/or injured driver...they show the same thing.....I can show different levels of danger with the way I move my flag....I can't do that with a button! |
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21 Dec 2013, 15:34 (Ref:3346657) | #122 | ||
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Maybe a light box with a speed control would be able to help in those circumstances. turn it on slow flash (wave) turn the speed up more urgent
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21 Dec 2013, 17:57 (Ref:3346698) | #123 | |||
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.....oh wait, we already have that...it's called a stick with a rag on the end of it....sooooo much cheeper! |
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21 Dec 2013, 23:05 (Ref:3346802) | #124 | |||
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Jim |
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21 Dec 2013, 23:18 (Ref:3346804) | #125 | |||
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"Go ahead, make my day!" I agree with those who have said that we can only do what is possible and we must concentrate on the safety of the marshals and drivers first. If they don't get a report, so be it. It will be interesting at the Britcar or 2CV 24hr races or any Friday sessions! |
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