ALMS 2013 Discussion

[alexkiller8]

a lmp combined class was already in 2010.

[MagVanisher]

Originally Posted by alexkiller8

a lmp combined class was already in 2010.

And yet, they decided to split it after 2010. What a stupid decision in my opinion.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

Originally Posted by alexkiller8

a lmp combined class was already in 2010.

And with the exception of 2007-2008 it produced some of the best prototype racing we've seen in the American Le Mans Series prototype ranks.

[Purist]

Dropping LMP1, regardless of how small it is now, will be a hit in perception for the series. Guys want to be in the "top class", even if they can't afford it right now. And those who are in it are NOT going to want to take a step down.

Also, if Sebring remains a combined round with WEC, you don't really have a choice but to keep LMP1. It would be too strange for the series rules to seemingly change in such a drastic way during the season. Not to mention, ALMS teams are NOT going to accept being taken out of even a theoretical chance of snagging a high finishing position overall. In addition, because of the Challenge class participants, the ALMS can't afford to hand over either of its big endurance races to the WEC.

On the P1 front, could the new CN-spec Oreca indicate that they'll be coming out with a coupe LMP at some point here?

[picchiofan]

Originally Posted by Purist

On the P1 front, could the new CN-spec Oreca indicate that they'll be coming out with a coupe LMP at some point here?

Since the new ACO regs mandate closed tops for 2014, I'd assume "some point" would be then.

Whether or not they find customers for it is another matter.

[picchiofan]

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...-for-2013-aco/

The GT class gets more fragmented for 2013. Sweet, more classes fix everything.

[Creep89]

So.. If we are a little bit unlucky, we will see 6 GTE Pro cars and 4 AM cars. Sweeeeet.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

Originally Posted by Creep89

So.. If we are a little bit unlucky, we will see 6 GTE Pro cars and 4 AM cars. Sweeeeet.

The World class Global leader in Green racing For the Fans has done it again, just what the series needs... more classes. If it isn't broken don't fix it. Only 30-ish cars in 6 classes is horrible.

[Nick6]

Not just more classes, but classes with only 2-6 cars in them.

[Koenigsegg]

Aren't there a lot of F430 GT2 in the USA? Those might race in the hands of gentleman drivers in GT-Am?

[picchiofan]

Originally Posted by Koenigsegg

Aren't there a lot of F430 GT2 in the USA? Those might race in the hands of gentleman drivers in GT-Am?

There's probably a few, not sure what the point would be though. The 458 is GT-am eligible and a much better car, the 430s wouldn't be anywhere near the pace of it now. The handful of GT-Am level teams in the US that ran the 430 (Waltrip, Krohn, ESM) have all moved on to the 458.

[MagVanisher]

Originally Posted by picchiofan

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...-for-2013-aco/

The GT class gets more fragmented for 2013. Sweet, more classes fix everything.

It would be better if they just categorize the GT class into GTE-Pro and GTE-Am classes.

[Jonerz]

Originally Posted by MagVanisher

It would be better if they just categorize the GT class into GTE-Pro and GTE-Am classes.

It would be pretty expensive to make the GT3 Cup car competitive with GT-Am cars. I think ALMS wants to phase GTC out most fundamentally to maintain the maybe five entries they might get next year. Perhaps to appease the teams that don't want to compete in an open formula.

Chris

[Salamus]

Maybe this is the ALMS' way of luring Krohn and Waltrip away from WEC? And it also keeps the Lizards, ESM, and AJR happy as the article said.

I think having a GTE-AM class is much better than having a GTC class. Unless GTC opens up to more manufacturers, they should might as well scrap that class. GTE-AM is succeeding in Europe for a good reason, and it can succeed in NA too.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

I have an idea on the future class structure for the ALMS:

1990sBenettonF1
LMP1Pro
LMP1Am
LMP2Pro
LMP2Am
LMP2Cup
LMP3
LMPCPro
LMPCAm
LMPCCup
LMP5000
DeltaWing Spec Class
Abruzzi Spec Class
Panoz Hybrid Spec Class
Imsa Lights
CN
DPG1
DPG2
DPG3
GTEPro
GTEAm
GTECup
GT3Pro
GT3Am
GT3Cup
Grand Am GT
GTX
Porsche Cup
Ferrari Challenge
Lamborghini Trofeo
90sGT1
GS
ST

In line with their way of thinking, and should certainly pack the grid numbers in, lets also give a trophy and podium spot to everybody just for showing up.

[Salamus]

Wow a bit too far but funny nonetheless! We might have 6 classes in 2013 but hopefully it will be reduced to 4 (maybe 3?) by 2014!

[MagVanisher]

Originally Posted by Salamus

Maybe this is the ALMS' way of luring Krohn and Waltrip away from WEC? And it also keeps the Lizards, ESM, and AJR happy as the article said.

Speaking of WEC, will they have plans to phase out their GTE-Am class while luring Corvette Racing and the SRT Viper Team on joining the WEC GTE-Pro?

I think this way, WEC should have LMP1, LMP2 (phase out later if LMP1 grid is bigger), and GTE-Pro, while ALMS/ELMS/AsLMS should have LMP2, CN (if possible), GTE-Pro. and GTE-Am.

[Nick6]

Originally Posted by FordCosworthPanoz

I have an idea on the future class structure for the ALMS:

1990sBenettonF1
LMP1Pro
LMP1Am
LMP2Pro
LMP2Am
LMP2Cup
LMP3
LMPCPro
LMPCAm
LMPCCup
LMP5000
DeltaWing Spec Class
Abruzzi Spec Class
Panoz Hybrid Spec Class
Imsa Lights
CN
DPG1
DPG2
DPG3
GTEPro
GTEAm
GTECup
GT3Pro
GT3Am
GT3Cup
Grand Am GT
GTX
Porsche Cup
Ferrari Challenge
Lamborghini Trofeo
90sGT1
GS
ST

In line with their way of thinking, and should certainly pack the grid numbers in, lets also give a trophy and podium spot to everybody just for showing up.

Hey don't forget about all of the VLN classes and Youngtimer classes too. Should add some "greenness" to the field.

Toss in Supertouring too! Those cars provided good races way back when.

I think am drivers deserve a fair stab at it, IMSA should consider sub dividing the classes based on skill level. Gold, Silver, Bronze, Platnum, rusty, etc.... Better yet do what they do in motorcycle racing and add age classes, over 25, 30, 25, 40, you get the point...

[Jonerz]

Originally Posted by Nick6

Hey don't forget about all of the VLN classes and Youngtimer classes too. Should add some "greenness" to the field.

Toss in Supertouring too! Those cars provided good races way back when.

I think am drivers deserve a fair stab at it, IMSA should consider sub dividing the classes based on skill level. Gold, Silver, Bronze, Platnum, rusty, etc.... Better yet do what they do in motorcycle racing and add age classes, over 25, 30, 25, 40, you get the point...

It's only fair to create classes for birth month as well. LM January Challenge, LM February Challenge etc.

Chris

[Brake dust]

The closer alms is to aco rules, the better the series. Le Mans is the draw. The rules will allow the gentleman driver a chance to compete.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by Brake dust

The closer alms is to aco rules, the better the series. Le Mans is the draw. The rules will allow the gentleman driver a chance to compete.

Well, I'm not so certain about this... but..

Depending on the number of actual potential entrants, this could be positive. Even if the grid doesn't increase any, and the number of GTC entrants become GTE-Am entrants, it is a net positive, moving to non-spec entries.

I think that we will see five classes again in 2014, with 2013 being a transition out the GTC year.

But seriously, this is basically the tail end of the field, and what is needed is focus on providing better visibility and ROI to attract more quality entrants and sponsors, particularly at the front of the grid.

[WolfsburgRS]

Originally Posted by Nick6

Not just more classes, but classes with only 2-6 cars in them.

Originally Posted by picchiofan

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...-for-2013-aco/

The GT class gets more fragmented for 2013. Sweet, more classes fix everything.

Originally Posted by Jonerz

It's only fair to create classes for birth month as well. LM January Challenge, LM February Challenge etc.

Chris

I think the new ALMS slogan should be "Everyone gets a podium"

[Jonerz]

Originally Posted by WolfsburgRS

I think the new ALMS slogan should be "Everyone gets a podium"

That's great! And if somehow a class has more than three entries, get the losers, no scratch that, "valued entrants", put them up on the podium and give them participant badges and freezies... Take their pictures so they can send them to sponsors and post them to their websites so they look successful. It's only the right thing to do.

Chris

[Fogelhund]

My opinion is that this is not an additional class, but a replacement class for GTC. I believe that GTC is being given one more year, for those entrants to amortize their current costs, and be able to afford new machinery by no later than 2014. This of course is how IMSA has operated, in allowing old rules machinery a grandfathering period for some time, and is continued here. People complain about spec categories, and then the series makes a move that should gradually phase out a spec category, and they complain more. I am most certainly a vocal critic at times, but I can't see why the gradual removal of a spec category, for an open category is a bad thing. One year of an extra category... big deal.

[Purist]

Perhaps some of you need to take a look at the class breakdowns at Le Mans from the 1950s and '60s. They had 9-12 displacement classes, and many of those were further subdivided by whether you had a (S)ports racer or a (G)rand (T)ourer.

I don't like the idea of a huge number of classes today, but let's have a bit of perspective here, because this is hardly the pinnacle of class complexity, even for Le Mans.

In the prototype ranks, some things need sorting, which hopefully will happen come 2014, but for one, it just seems out of whack that LMP2s can have bigger engines than LMP1s. And in GT, the restrictor tables need some looking over, to see about making forced-induction cars a viable option.

One good thing with GT-Am is that the sticker price on a year-old car shouldn't be so bad, plus running costs should be somewhat lower with less advanced machinery.

Specifically for ALMS 2013, I'd like to see P1 and P2 combined. It's probably best to leave PC out of that mix though, and just let them continue to run as they are. The schedule could be rather interesting, as we know we have Austin coming. It is somewhat expected that Belle Isle will be back on the calendar (with rumors saying it will be the long circuit), and there is the chance that the ALMS will be back at Houston as well (perhaps part of why they went ahead this year and moved Petit Le Mans).