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31 Dec 2011, 16:37 (Ref:3005895) | #1301 | |
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And Obama's planning a $53 billion arms deal with Bahrain.........just goes to show how politics, business and sport and interwined.
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31 Dec 2011, 17:20 (Ref:3005901) | #1302 | |
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I really don't see what effect it should have on the PLM. If Bahrain is canceled there's:
a) a replacement round or b) no replacement round and the PLM is still not part of the WEC. That means very few if any of the WEC teams will do the trip, most European teams were already reluctant to do the PLM when there were championship points at stake... The ACO has made it clear that they don't want the PLM to be part of the WEC due to the fact that the track isn't able to handle the amount of traffic and the cautions having too much effect on the race outcome. None of this will change whether or not Bahrain actually happens. So I really don't see the connection. |
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31 Dec 2011, 21:19 (Ref:3005963) | #1303 | ||
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There should be a connection between an unstable country with a boring circuit and scheduled event that is in jeopardy to a large sports car market county with a proven and growing event that WILL take place regardless of happens in Bahrain and the WEC.
But what do I know? The ACO know what they're doing... |
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31 Dec 2011, 23:48 (Ref:3005988) | #1304 | ||
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The density of the cars can be problematic @ RA but that's part of the game. Zhuhai, Interlagos and Fuji are only a few hundred meters longer and the only reason you aren't complaining about the length of those tracks is because WEC alone will never get a full field of cars like it would do with joint ALMS/LMS event. When the Bahrain event gets cancelled and if ACO still foolishly ignores PLM, I'm 100% certain that we will see more European entries. Even both of your precious diesel teams made the trip when the race was not part of their championships (like 2009). |
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1 Jan 2012, 01:11 (Ref:3005999) | #1305 | ||
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The number of big teams taking the risk to damage their cars in the PLM where they can clinch zero WEC points will be pretty low, especially for the teams that still have chances to win the championship in their class. While Audi would maybe do it if Audi NA pays the bills, there's no way Peugeot will show up. They have zero marketing interest in NA and the only reason they did the PLM in the past was because it was either a) part of a championship or b) before that one of the few chances to race Audi Now that there's a full championship for them to race each other, the PLM has lost a lot of its appeal. It simply makes no sense to put your car through a 10hr race that scores you no points while being involved in a major championship. If Bahrain is cancelled we may see an additional 4-6 cars (possibly Audi), that's it. |
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1 Jan 2012, 01:20 (Ref:3006001) | #1306 | ||
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I can see a bit of a swing towards safety and logistics for WEC and (unfortunately) the odd sound reason against including PLM. HOWEVER, the excitement I have felt for this one-time fledgeling event has never faded, even from a distance of 10,000 miles or so (16,307 if I was Charley Boorman). In its defence I would therefore like to say.............
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AND |
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1 Jan 2012, 01:32 (Ref:3006002) | #1307 | |||
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Times have changed and PLM is still one of the major endurance events, it's just the ignorance of FIA/ACO that's making it more difficult. Quote:
Conquering PLM is more than just winning a regular round, the event has heritage. Last edited by Deleted; 1 Jan 2012 at 01:38. |
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1 Jan 2012, 01:49 (Ref:3006004) | #1308 | |
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Don't see what the issue is TBH, if PLM is the draw claimed, it will attract bonus entries regardless, just as Daytona and Sebring do. WEC entries aren't going to be turned away from a WEC round beyond 2012, that being the case Road Atlanta is ruled out for a joint event, I'm guessing the fuss would be even greater if it became WEC only.
The bigger question is what happens to Sebring, does it become WEC only, muddle through as a joint event, or does the WEC go to Daytona, Austin, Montreal, Watkins Glen or wherever? All of the points raised only become an issue if both series can realistically host these big races as standalone events, that's a good problem to have. |
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1 Jan 2012, 01:56 (Ref:3006005) | #1309 | ||
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There's no ignorance, the PLM simply doesn't fit in the WEC as long as it's an ALMS event. The ACO has explained why, I really don't see why it's so hard to understand their position. Regarding 2008, yes, Peugeot did the PLM because they wanted to race Audi pretty much regardless where and back then the PLM didn't clash with anything. The LMS season was over, there was no reason not to do it. But this year there are plenty of reasons, the most important one being that the PLM is scheduled in the closing stages of the WEC... no sensible team is going to risk their cars in a non-points event, not even speaking of the costs involved. Yes, it has heritage, but not enough for WEC entries to waste their shot at a World Championship title (!!) by competing in a non-points round. The way I see it, the only thing that can save the PLM as a major international race is by it becoming a WEC-only round, which is most likely what will happen to Sebring as well. |
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1 Jan 2012, 02:03 (Ref:3006006) | #1310 | ||
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Frankly, I doubt Sebring becomes a WEC only round. The WEC if it wishes to continue to race in North America, will have to find their own round.
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1 Jan 2012, 02:07 (Ref:3006008) | #1311 | |
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I think it depends on the state of both series. If the WEC really does start out with 40 entries this year and is able to expand on that next year and the ALMS demise continues then the Sebring organizers will have a hard choice to make..
Would it really be wise to have a 12hr race with that much legacy run by a field of largely amateur drivers in spec machinery while the professional world championship packed with works efforts and pro drivers races somewhere else? Dosen't really sound smart... |
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1 Jan 2012, 02:53 (Ref:3006016) | #1312 | ||||
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Either way, I don't think PLM is getting on the WEC schedule for a number of reasons. There may be logistical problems with the car count, but most of all I think the ACO simply does not want PLM on the schedule. Not as long as the ALMS exists anyway. Quote:
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1 Jan 2012, 05:44 (Ref:3006025) | #1313 | |
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The US putting arms in those countries isn't for usage against it's citizens. It's probably for stability in the region, ya know- with Iran and all? We'll see how things go in the early months of this new year.
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1 Jan 2012, 09:24 (Ref:3006034) | #1314 | |||
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1 Jan 2012, 12:51 (Ref:3006083) | #1315 | ||
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1 Jan 2012, 14:43 (Ref:3006122) | #1316 | ||
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At one point they might have to pull an emergency stop and give Sebring & the PLM to the WEC to at least have those prestigious races on their tracks. |
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1 Jan 2012, 14:51 (Ref:3006126) | #1317 | |
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Don Panoz owns both tracks and no way in hell is he going to hand those events to outsiders. Sebring and PLM both survived for ten years without outside help.
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1 Jan 2012, 15:07 (Ref:3006130) | #1318 | ||
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And - as Chiana noted - the championship could be done by the time we get to the Petit. If Bahrain gets cancelled and not replaced it will probably decrease such a possibility (depending on the actual standings of course). I doubt however if such a situation would change much of the plans of Audi et all since it will very much be a last-minute decision by then (we´re talking August or September, not the start of the year) and we all know that on this level of racing there aren´t many last minute entries (last minute drop outs on the other hand...). |
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1 Jan 2012, 15:15 (Ref:3006135) | #1319 | |
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Petit class win also grants automatic entry for LM - even more reasons for European entries to participate, especially in P1 and P2 where you don't have that many opponents to challenge you. And if diesels sit out it's a perfect opportunity for Pescarolo, Rebellion or some other petrol team to finally take overall honours in one of the biggest races anywhere.
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1 Jan 2012, 18:30 (Ref:3006193) | #1320 | |||
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__________________
-Peder Baeckman- 2017 695 Abarth XSR 180hp Brembo, Koni |
1 Jan 2012, 18:33 (Ref:3006194) | #1321 | ||
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Putting the head in the sand won't help.... |
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1 Jan 2012, 18:36 (Ref:3006195) | #1322 | ||
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Also I love Sears Point but I don't find it very fitting for WEC. |
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1 Jan 2012, 20:19 (Ref:3006228) | #1323 | |||
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Despite Panoz' involvment with Sebring, I don't see it as a given it will become an ALMS only round. For twenty years Le Mans wasn't aligned with anyone, it's entries came from whatever was the top series of the day, much thought will be given to ensure Sebring remains the No.1 NA sportscar race which the WEC can guarantee with top international and local entries, or is there a belief the race has the power to make or break the ALMS? For PLM's part I don't see such a prospect being raised, it's a creation of the ALMS, and as long as the series is around should remain such. Quote:
There was a time when Mercedes missed Le Mans to concentrate on their WSC campaign, of which Le Mans was not part due to an FIA dispute. While times have changed and Le Mans is of much greater importance relative to other events, not to mention the ACO now run the WEC, the sport has to get back to individual rounds, the World Championship title and the narrative of the season battle meaning something, plan for the coming years rather than stumbling from boom to bust. It's these season long battles that made the recent Audi vs Peugeot ILMC duels meaningful, or Audi vs Porsche vs Acura in the ALMS, Le Mans in the nineties had some fantastic grids but most packed up for another twelve months at the end of the race, momentum was lost, making it an easier decision for manufactuers to move to F1, WTCC or WRC. |
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1 Jan 2012, 20:46 (Ref:3006237) | #1324 | |
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Mr Ratel was one of the main reasons why Le Mans didn't fade into nothingness after 1992, the re-introduction of GTs was mandatory for it's survival.
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2 Jan 2012, 01:05 (Ref:3006302) | #1325 | ||
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Sometimes series succeed for a while despite of their incompetence. For a while is the key term. USAC could line up tons of cars at Indy even with their massive, massive incompetence. CART was ok for a while. The ALMS and Grand-Am have had their moments. Ultimately, however, incompetence does not pay off.
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