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24 Jan 2020, 16:37 (Ref:3953153) | #126 | ||
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Quote:
It's necessary because fluid is *always" stationary immediately adjacent to a physical surface (like a road), called the "no slip" condition. There is the so called "boundary layer" where the fluid speed transistions from zero to the outer air speed. This boundary layer can be tens of cm thick at an automotive scale, so it's important to model it accurately. It's also important the vehicle's wheels are actually turning at the proper rate too (for the same reason of fluid always having no slip at solid boundaries like a rotating tyre). They would be better off using the Pinnifarina or Wind Shear wind tunnels which are setup for full scale automotive testing with rolling roads. |
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24 Jan 2020, 19:13 (Ref:3953178) | #127 | |||
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No question that Mr McLaughlin is talented but the judgements on technical changes to the different cars weren't based on race results of a single car but on data collected from a wider group than that, using CFD and of course the now famous CoG testing. I know that you didn't like the changes happening at the time and regard them still as unfair but it is a parity series and has always been so. Hopefully the improved VCAT regime will result in no changes being necessary through the course of the upcoming season but if the data shows that changes for parity are needed, then we may see them again. |
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“We’re far from having too much horsepower…[m]y definition of too much horsepower is when all four wheels are spinning in every gear.” ― Mark Donohue |
24 Jan 2020, 19:17 (Ref:3953180) | #128 | ||
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You learn something new every day, thank you :-) Oh... apologies for the double post, new around here and getting to grips with the app!! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Last edited by Spec83; 24 Jan 2020 at 19:25. |
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I want you to go back out on that track.... and hit the pace car |
24 Jan 2020, 19:29 (Ref:3953183) | #129 | ||||
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From the first time TEGA did one of these airstrip tests (back in 2000) a lot of those variables you mention were thought through and accounted for by various means with input from the tech boffins working for teams. Last year it became evident that the process hadn't been upgraded enough over the years since 2000 and it now has been, we'll find out this season if it stands up. Conrod isn't even close to long enough or flat enough for consistency - airstrips are used due to being much longer - it is the coast down to zero that takes the distance and based on the length of the airstrips used, the coast down would have the cars rolling into the city centre of Bathurst. Quote:
F1 teams use airstrip coast down tests to this day as a means of "verifying" wind tunnel results in the real world. Not everything developed in the tunnel survives scrutiny at the airstrip testing and makes it onto the cars for racing. Ultimately, a wind tunnel is a tool, not an absolute and the results generated do not necessarily get replicated in the real world but if Supercars DID want to run some wind tunnel tests, it would need to fly the cars overseas and then still do the coast down tests to verify the wind tunnel tests. So far, no-one there has been able to justify the cost of doing that but it could happen one day. |
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“We’re far from having too much horsepower…[m]y definition of too much horsepower is when all four wheels are spinning in every gear.” ― Mark Donohue |
25 Jan 2020, 00:08 (Ref:3953224) | #130 | ||||
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Not much hope I'm afraid, given the precedent which has already been set. |
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25 Jan 2020, 00:40 (Ref:3953228) | #131 | ||
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If you idiots think Roger Penske is going to spend nearly $20m big ones a year, and just lay down and allow the series THAT HE PART OWNS to disadvantage him as some sort of conspiracy, you are a crackpot and quite obviously can't think clearly.
****ing comical all the T8$ crap when there is a multi-BILLIONAIRE with resources, nous and form for pushing the boundaries beyond the entire rest of the field put together behind Penske. |
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25 Jan 2020, 01:00 (Ref:3953230) | #132 | |
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Judging by how fast the T8 commodores were at seasons end there can be little doubt that they were sandbagging earlier in the championship to get changes before Bathurst.
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25 Jan 2020, 01:22 (Ref:3953234) | #133 | |
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It's a clean slate.
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25 Jan 2020, 04:13 (Ref:3953241) | #134 | ||
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This is a professional race series so why not use professional methods to implement parity? If money is the problem then something is very wrong because a well founded series would have it. |
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25 Jan 2020, 05:01 (Ref:3953245) | #135 | ||
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Yeah that's why all the cars including the Nissans were like 2 seconds a lap faster at Bathurst... because the Commodores were sandbagging...
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25 Jan 2020, 05:04 (Ref:3953246) | #136 | |
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Triple Eight are always strong in the back half of the season. Has been that way for a long time.
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25 Jan 2020, 05:17 (Ref:3953247) | #137 | |||
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Because you said "call me sceptical" in your previous post
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We'll see if it has delivered during 2020. |
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“We’re far from having too much horsepower…[m]y definition of too much horsepower is when all four wheels are spinning in every gear.” ― Mark Donohue |
25 Jan 2020, 06:13 (Ref:3953251) | #138 | ||
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25 Jan 2020, 07:01 (Ref:3953254) | #139 | |||
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F1 teams validate their wind tunnel work, with coastdown tests and straight line running. Adrian Burgess is ex F1, as is Tim Edwards and probably others. They know way more than a bunch of monkeys on keyboards that wouldn't know a wind tunnel from the sock in their bottom drawer. |
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25 Jan 2020, 08:10 (Ref:3953258) | #140 | |
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A side note to the parity talk. Evidently the 17 car had the only chassis built stateside. Not sure of the origins of the replacement chassis late season? But expect it also was built stateside? In pre season testing of the new Mustang the 17 chassis was consistently faster than that of car 12, regardless of who the shoe was.
If you need an example of what difference a car can make to a driver I have two words for you, Garth Tander. Years of mediocre and underwhelming results to last year's outstanding performance. |
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25 Jan 2020, 08:51 (Ref:3953259) | #141 | ||
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I believe Penske wanted to build chassis overseas but it was disallowed. Put Scotty in Fabs car and he would rip it up.
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25 Jan 2020, 09:18 (Ref:3953263) | #142 | |
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Yeah Scott would have still been fast in car 12. regardless of where the chassis was built car 17 was the fastest of the two in testing. Look at the season and it's clear Scott did less winning in the second half of the championship. Did he lose his edge or did his car? No argument from me that Scott is fast. Hell he's been put up with the all time greats of the sport after two championships and a Bathurst win.
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25 Jan 2020, 09:53 (Ref:3953267) | #143 | |
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The cars can't be built overseas, as they need to be inspected at numerous built stages during construction, for compliance.
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25 Jan 2020, 10:52 (Ref:3953272) | #144 | |
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Correct, they cannot be built overseas, Scotty started loosing races only after several "adjustments" to the Mustangs and Commodores to retain the favoured status quo.
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25 Jan 2020, 11:12 (Ref:3953278) | #145 | |
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All I'm getting out of the latest VCAT is the Mustang had an unfair advantage in 2019, up to and including the last few races and only now is it rectified (otherwise no changes would have been necessary).
So essentially a whole season of Holden based competitors being shafted. |
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25 Jan 2020, 21:43 (Ref:3953498) | #146 | ||
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Latest VCAT is reducing downforce by 15%.
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25 Jan 2020, 23:02 (Ref:3953542) | #147 | ||
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Exactly. Speedcafe are reporting an approximate 12% reduction, and AA a 10-12% reduction in downforce; with revisions being minor for the Opel, and more extensive for the Mustang (including a re-location of the rear wing). |
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26 Jan 2020, 00:33 (Ref:3953590) | #148 | ||
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Nissan and Commodore didn't go so fast at Bathurst because 888 stopped sandbagging, it is because they got closer to the Mustang. But not so close that anybody could pass one.
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26 Jan 2020, 00:58 (Ref:3953601) | #149 | ||
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As Nissan were never going to be an outright threat to anyone, the whole situation worked out well for 888. |
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26 Jan 2020, 02:45 (Ref:3953625) | #150 | |
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That was all last year.
Let's talk about this year. |
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