HSCC Autosport 3 Hours - Snetterton

[Terry Scannell]

Originally Posted by Colin McKay

After the TC race on Sunday I was instructed by marshals to exit via gate at post 8/Agostini, very conveniently near my trailer. From what's been said recovery crews weren't using this, not sure why this was.

Colin, Throughout the weekend we were using the exit gate at Post 8 Agostini for inward and outward traffic of Recovery vehicles, Fire Truck, Medical Cars and Ambulances if required. Most cars that had incidents between Riches and Agostini (turns 1 to Turn 4(were indeed brought in via the Turn 4 gate.

For any incidents between Turn 4 Agostini to Turn 8 Nelson Recoveries were despatched from the Turn 4 gate and brought off circuit via the Turn 8 Nelson (Esses) Ambulance gate, if under safety car or if under a Red Flag situation between Turn 4 Agostini and Turn 6 they were taken off wrong direction again via Turn 4 Agostini.

Any incidents between Turn 8 Nelson (Esses) were taken off at either Turn 11 Coram gate or via Pit Lane entrance depending on the type of car.

Any cars along Senna Straight were removed via the Archie Scott Scruitineering Bay gate.

Any Cars needing recovering between Senna Straight or Riches the Recovery vehicles were mostly deployed via either the Archie Scott Gate or Pit Lane exit.

Obviously if under safety car we cannot go WD so you can understand under these instances we have to recover to the next available exit point, but as you can see the 300 circuit does provide many options so we can be as efficient as possible.

In one particular case we even explored the option of recovering the Lenham (in the 3hr) at Turn 7 by going infield and lifting it over the barrier, to save a potential safety car situation at a crucial part of the race, however after discussions with the marshals/ driver on the scene and the team members it was apparent that the problem was terminal so the decision was made to leave the car where it was in a safe place. We had a similar situation with another car towards the end between Turns 2 (Montreal) and Turn 3 (Palmer) but again after discussions with the team it was agreed that the problem could not be solved even if we recovered the car with a Safety Car and in this particular case there was a suitable gap in the barrier where the car could be pushed to safety by the marshals.

It is never the intent to spoil a race or practice by stopping it or deploying a safety car but I would say in all cases over the weekend the decisions taken were the only ones we could make to ensure the safety of the marshals, the cars and the drivers concerned and during the 3hr to enable the cars to be repaired that could be so they could stand a chance of finishing the event or purely for safety reasons.


Hope this clarifies.

Terry

[Colin McKay]

Thanks for the clarification Terry, I was only going by what was said in previous posts. I was too busy with rainex/swapping tyres/adjusting dampers to watch much of the other racing, pity I didn't make the time to check the bonnet pins.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Terry Scannell

.....

For any incidents between Turn 4 Agostini to Turn 8 Nelson Recoveries were despatched from the Turn 4 gate and brought off circuit via the Turn 8 Nelson (Esses) Ambulance gate, if under safety car or if under a Red Flag situation between Turn 4 Agostini and Turn 6 they were taken off wrong direction again via Turn 4 Agostini.

.....

Terry

Terry,

I there any potential for creating a recovery track after Hamilton or even at Oggies that would allow recovery vehicles to traverse the infield grass and recover back to the Turn 4 gate in the right direction?

Obviously there would be a need to cross the track but in good circumstances (well controlled Safety car for example) it would seem to be do-able and the on-track run would be fairly short and the recovery vehicle could probably be turned around quickly if needed again.

On Sunday we saw one of the HFF2000s pull off well onto the infield on the first lap to a position that seemed safe enough . A couple of laps later another went off at Hamilton on the inside but closer to the track. That one seemed to be an influencer (not the only one) for the Safety car intervention and rightly so. If that car could have been moved further into the centre of the grassed area it would, presumably, have been in a position of safety. Might there be an opportunity to look at exploiting that possibility as well?

Obviously with a new track layout it takes time and some experiences to work out the details of best operational approaches. The layout in the new section seems to offer some challenges and some opportunities for keeping the show running.

[Terry Scannell]

Originally Posted by grantp

Terry,

I there any potential for creating a recovery track after Hamilton or even at Oggies that would allow recovery vehicles to traverse the infield grass and recover back to the Turn 4 gate in the right direction?

Obviously there would be a need to cross the track but in good circumstances (well controlled Safety car for example) it would seem to be do-able and the on-track run would be fairly short and the recovery vehicle could probably be turned around quickly if needed again.

On Sunday we saw one of the HFF2000s pull off well onto the infield on the first lap to a position that seemed safe enough . A couple of laps later another went off at Hamilton on the inside but closer to the track. That one seemed to be an influencer (not the only one) for the Safety car intervention and rightly so. If that car could have been moved further into the centre of the grassed area it would, presumably, have been in a position of safety. Might there be an opportunity to look at exploiting that possibility as well?

Obviously with a new track layout it takes time and some experiences to work out the details of best operational approaches. The layout in the new section seems to offer some challenges and some opportunities for keeping the show running.

It would certainly be a good idea to have a link track (may not be tarmac)across from say Oggies to the exit of Turn 3 and it is something I mentioned today while at Snetterton and while discuss more tomorrow with Jamie. At the moment the soil needs to settle and firm up a bit - hence any of the recovery operators are perhaps more than a little wary of going off the black stuff - would be even more embarrassing / annoying if one of the trucks became stuck during a session! As already suggested a 4x4 vehicle could be used for quick straight tow situations.

I suppose I have been fortunate re: the operational aspects so far as since the opening of the new circuit in February I have now clocked up as of today some 65 weekday testdays / trackdays for either bikes or cars out on the circuit and some 20 race days as mostly a CoC, or Post Chief on other days out on the various posts, which is a great help when having to quickly review a situation suddenly arising and make the appropriate decisions.

With regard to the earlier posts by Chris and Andrew re taking cars off at Post 8 (Turn 4) at the end of sessions we have tried this at some of the race meetings and compared the turnaround times with bringing cars off at the pitlane. We have analysed timings for every meeting this year and I can genuinely say it makes no real difference to timings.

It may give the perception of being quicker as the car that takes the chequered does less than half a lap before coming off at Turn 4 Agostini, however it is the last car that matters as the last car before the chequered one may just be in front at Turn 4 and then has to continue round the circuit to the start finish line to take the flag and then still continue round to exit at Agostini. We then have additional problems with the mix of cars coming off circuit with the need to have provision for access for recoveries/fire trucks/medical vehicles etc. We also would have issues regarding parc ferme situations etc which are overcome by using the normal pitlane entrance / parc ferme/scruitineering bay route. Turn 4 Agostini is used during the week mainly for Bike sessions as it allows following session to be lined up in the pitlane and noise and wristbands etc to be checked before release or for cars & bikes when a stoppage means we can bring vehicles off circuit by using both Agostini & Pit Entrance at the same time. Obviously this cannot happen during a Race Meeting.

The biggest timesaving option is, whenever possible, to not deploy a course car between sessions. With every marshal post being on Radio we can clear by this means and by camera if there are no incidents to clear or reports to collect. This method has resulted in a distinct reduction in marshals wandering onto track unless there is a specific and genuine reason. It was this aspect that allowed us to operate so tightly against this weekend's timetable and make up time following the various more serious incidents.

I am sure that we will be find further operational opportunities during the season and we are always open to ideas / suggestions to improve efficiency and minimize stoppages / safety cars interventions.

Terry

[Mike Bell]

Terry, two great posts from the RC perspective! Thanks for taking the time to explain, clarify etc

Bringing cars back into the paddock at Agostini creates one more challenge for senile old racers like me- to avoid getting lost! At Easter I turned right and finished up wrong side of the fence. Fortunately a young spectator realised my predicament and opened a gate otherwise I was heading up the mound.......

[terence]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Terry, two great posts from the RC perspective! Thanks for taking the time to explain, clarify etc

Bringing cars back into the paddock at Agostini creates one more challenge for senile old racers like me- to avoid getting lost! At Easter I turned right and finished up wrong side of the fence. Fortunately a young spectator realised my predicament and opened a gate otherwise I was heading up the mound.......

At least you would have had a good view Mike.

[John Turner]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Terry, two great posts from the RC perspective! Thanks for taking the time to explain, clarify etc

Agree, Mike, two excellent posts from Terry S; great input.

I'm still sorting pics from Sunday's racing but may be able to start posting on them today.

Meanwhile, do we have any pics of pit stops and/or presentations/celebrations from the 3 hours? Where's my mate Richard Styles when I need him?

[simon drabble]

Thanks for the big up John and with no disrespect to you yes it was an honour to receive your plaque from Jack Sears, a legend who won it in period. I could have listened to his war stories all night.

[grantp]

Ah, Snetterton Sunday - starting with a glorious morning ... lest we forget.

The first qualifying session, in fabulous sunshine, was, er, short. Shorter for some than others, but not by much.

[John Turner]

Great shots, Grant; particularly like the one of the cars in the collection area. Weather didn't look like that for long though; see my last pic below taken mid morningish!:-

[grantp]

Originally Posted by John Turner

Great shots, Grant; particularly like the one of the cars in the collection area. Weather didn't look like that for long though; see my last pic below taken mid morningish!:-

Cheers JT. Nice shots from you too - the Oliroy is a classic of the pit lane genre.

Good grid for the first qualifying session (HFF2000) although the session itself was somewhat short. Helps the shot to see the collection area busy but I must ask Mr. Palmer if he can get that large red wheelie bin thing shifted - I could have got a better angle but for that.


I was certainly glad of my wet weather clothing as the day wore on.

I'll aim to slot a few pics in amongst your posts as you make them. Haven't worked through the whole take yet though so may need some 'extra time'.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Terry Scannell

It would certainly be a good idea to have a link track (may not be tarmac)across from say Oggies to the exit of Turn 3 and it is something I mentioned today while at Snetterton and while discuss more tomorrow with Jamie. At the moment the soil needs to settle and firm up a bit - hence any of the recovery operators are perhaps more than a little wary of going off the black stuff - would be even more embarrassing / annoying if one of the trucks became stuck during a session! As already suggested a 4x4 vehicle could be used for quick straight tow situations.

I could see that the ground was still somewhat soft in places, especially on the 'inside' just after Hamilton.

When it firms up I would imagine a compacted gravel track could probably be laid successfully. Tarmac may not be a good idea other than at any point where the track would rejoin between Palmer and Agostini. (A full vehicle wash and gravel removal team might be useful there ...but that's a vision too far ....)

I almost suggested a tunnel back to the paddock but then remembered the problems one can have with tunnels and soft ground.

[John Turner]

Richard Styles and I have been exchanging messages this am, as a result of which I'm hoping that he'll post a few pit shots from the 3 Hours here today. He has also sent me some of the awards ceremony, some of which I'll also put up. The upshot is that I won't start on Sunday's races until a bit later; can't stop anyone else from so doing though!

[restyles]

Sorry for being rather late with these, but just a few pit stop shots from the Autosport 3 hour race. These were all quite late in the race and were last stops for most teams.

#1 The winning Flemming / Stevens Chevron



#2 The 6th placed Douglas / Fearon Ginetta G16. Gentleman Jack in the background.



#3 THe Bianchi MGB which finished 14th is followed in by the 13th placed Adams Turner



#4 Bob Brooks takes over the 9th placed Elan as Marcus Pye grabs a word with Vicky in the pit garage.



#5 The unclassified MGB of the Boyes team is fettled after arriving back in the pits on the end of a rope.



I will try to pop a few Sunday race pics on time permitting.

[John Turner]

Excellent, Richard, thank you.

[John Turner]

A few more from Richard that he has sent me, this am. As you know Richard is a professional photographer and is Autosport's official Snetterton race photographer, so since he has provided these gratis, I have no hesistation in plugging his site - www.richardstylesphotography.co.uk - he hasn't yet put this meetings pics up, though:-

[restyles]

Thanks very much for the link John, I am just popping a selection of race shots on now, should anyone like to take a look. They should be up very soon.

[John Turner]

Starters - 21
Classified - 18
Duration - 15 minutes

Sponsored by Spec Savers, Russell Love was on pole in his Reynard SF79 (79) with the similar car of Simon Toyne (16) alongside. However, whilst Love led this safety car interrupted race from start to flag, Toyne took a good while to get passed the Royale RP 27 (1) of Oliver Thorpe before he was able to close up on Love, being only half a second behind the winner at the finish.

[John Turner]

Starters - 26
Classified - 23
Duration - 15 minutes.

Fully titled HSCC Grand Stand Motor Sports Tours Historic Formula Ford Championship in assocaition with Avon Tyres! Poleman was Benn Simms in his Alexis Mk14 (5) but he was jumped at the start by the Merlyn Mk 20 (21) of Ben Mitchell who proceeded to hold Benn at bay until the last lap when an error allowed the Alexis through to take the victory. These two were well clear of the Lola T200 (16) of Simon Toyne, who, in turn had a reasonable comfortable cushion over the similar car of Ian Ashley (62):-

[grantp]

Nice set of shots again JT. I'm struggling to find things that are not repeats.

Lets try these.

Into Riches on lap 1.

Anthony Raine going well, as ever, to take the class for earlier cars.

Phil Walker retiring with mechanical problems just after the start. He parked up on the infield after Palmer and then watched as 2 other went off after Agostini and Hamilton, were recovered under SC required for them and the race continued. At the end he walked back to his car and stood there looking around watching for the recovery .... which was finally enacted after what seemed like an eternity, just before the start of the next race. At one point I was wondering if I was the only one who could see him!

Sadly the problem was terminal and he didn't make it out for race 2.

Pic 4 has Colin Wright defending from John Hayes-Harlow, a tussle that would repeat under different conditions in race 2.

Pic 5 - after the safety car Olly Thorpe had a run at Russell Love going into Riches but didn't quite make it, but ...

Pic 6 - Simon Toyne squeezed past Thorpe at the same point on the next lap.

[grantp]

Historic FF1600 - Race 1

As with the HFF2000 race there was plenty pof action to be followed when the leading groups headed into teurn 1 - Riches.

In the early stages of the race the midfield established some battling groups as well.

1. Midfield with David Owen at the fornt and Stuart Dix in the Cooper Chinook guarding the tail.

2. Ben and Benn going into turn one. Could have been any lap, they were always this close.

3. Seconds later the battle for third came through ...

4. Classic FF drifting from the leaders.

5. Austin Mackie in the Macon having a solid run. It's quite remarkable how well presented the cars are. Is it my imagination or are they better presented than ever this year?

6. Mr. Simms (of this parish) pipped Mr. Mitchell on the last lap after both of them had produced classic FF style drives. I think they both enjoyed it!

[John Turner]

The Cooper Chinook really interests me and I'll include a couple of shots of it when I get to the later race for these cars. This is a car that had hitherto escaped my attention because I had quite a chat with Stuart Dix in the morning and he said that he had raced it last season. He gave me some background info. regarding the history, the origins of which as you might guess were Canadian but utilising original Cooper drawings but also with Lotus and Eagle styling influences. Apparently, all the gear ratios were wrong for the 300 circuit and his intention was to race with them for the first (above) race, and then change them for the second race. I think that he must have achieved this because his performance in the latter was definitely an improvement.

[John Turner]

Starters - 36
Classified - 32
Duration - 15 minutes

Sponsored by Millers Oils, these cars continue to really grow on me. The later, mid/rear engined cars are, for the most part, really pretty, and the front engined ones are so charismatic. If I had to choose a single seater to go racing in, I'd seriously look at one of the latter - BMC, Gemini, Elva 100 - but I was told by a well known prepper that they were surprisingly expensive to run, though.

Anyway, this was a superb grid and merits two posts of pics. Jon Milicevic was on pole with his Cooper T59 (1), 3/4 sec ahead of the similarly mounted Sam Wilson (69), and Milicevic had the race won from the off really whilst Wilson only completed 2 laps. Stuart Roach, better known for his exploits in the front engined Gemini, took the Alexis Mk4 (69) to 2nd place, 6.2secs behind, with Nicholas Fennell nearly half a minute further back in 3rd with Lotus 27 (80). First of the front engined cars was Brian Mitcham in his Mallock U2 (11) in 10th overall, with Justin Fleming (22) and Peter St Barbe (99), both in Elva 100's next up in the front engined brigade in 18th and 19th respectively.:-

[grantp]

Originally Posted by John Turner

The Cooper Chinook really interests me and I'll include a couple of shots of it when I get to the later race for these cars. This is a car that had hitherto escaped my attention because I had quite a chat with Stuart Dix in the morning and he said that he had raced it last season. He gave me some background info. regarding the history, the origins of which as you might guess were Canadian but utilising original Cooper drawings but also with Lotus and Eagle styling influences. Apparently, all the gear ratios were wrong for the 300 circuit and his intention was to race with them for the first (above) race, and then change them for the second race. I think that he must have achieved this because his performance in the latter was definitely an improvement.

Looking a bit different it does stand out in the crowd. I have a number of photos of it from last year and a short sequence of shots from the Oulton Park Gold Cup meeting of a bit of a moment during qualifying. It's good to see it back out again ...

[John Turner]

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