|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
9 Oct 2014, 14:13 (Ref:3462561) | #1527 | |
Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 10,744
|
I don't know, those miniatures can cost tens of dollars and I doubt TMG has budget for such luxury, surely that model is on loan from fan or something...
|
|
|
9 Oct 2014, 22:01 (Ref:3462719) | #1528 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15,560
|
Whats really funny is theyre actually giving them away- http://ms.toyota.co.jp/jp/wec/specia...ucer-0202.html
Theres a Gran Turismo 6 booth contest to beat Kazuki Nakajima's lap time on the game using the TS030. Those that beat his time receive a 1:18 model of last year's TS030. |
|
|
11 Oct 2014, 10:28 (Ref:3463300) | #1529 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 9,044
|
A bit more info on the driver situation for '15 via Sportscar365:
Quote:
http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/f...rday-notebook/ |
||
__________________
For when your year runs from June to June - '11/'12/'13/'14/'15/'16/'17/'18/'19/xx/'21/'22/'23/'24 Instagram: rsmotorsportmedia |
12 Oct 2014, 12:45 (Ref:3463993) | #1530 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,600
|
||
|
12 Oct 2014, 13:02 (Ref:3463997) | #1531 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 9,044
|
Toyota couldn't have done anything more in front of their top brass this weekend to convince them to release more funding. If they can go on to nail some championships that will be another positive step, but the decision really needs making now for 2015.
|
|
__________________
For when your year runs from June to June - '11/'12/'13/'14/'15/'16/'17/'18/'19/xx/'21/'22/'23/'24 Instagram: rsmotorsportmedia |
12 Oct 2014, 13:42 (Ref:3464023) | #1532 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,126
|
The top Brass could also say that two cars did the job pretty well, so why the need for a third?
(hope I'm wrong here) |
||
__________________
2022: Indy 500, IoM TT, LM24HRS :D |
12 Oct 2014, 14:00 (Ref:3464036) | #1533 | ||
Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 10,744
|
Quote:
I doubt today changed much, didn't last year nor year before that Last edited by Deleted; 12 Oct 2014 at 14:05. |
||
|
12 Oct 2014, 14:30 (Ref:3464054) | #1534 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,126
|
The opposition grows with 50%, so even worse for Toyota.
|
||
__________________
2022: Indy 500, IoM TT, LM24HRS :D |
12 Oct 2014, 14:38 (Ref:3464059) | #1535 | |
Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 10,744
|
In fact the actual chance for non-Toyota to win Le Mans next year in terms of entry figures is 78-82% if they keep just the two cars.
Toyota entries against other factories 2012 - 33% (2 vs 4) 2013 - 40% (2 vs 3) 2014 - 28% (2 vs 5) 2015 - 18-22% (2 vs 7 / 2 vs 8 / 2 vs 9) |
|
|
12 Oct 2014, 15:14 (Ref:3464080) | #1536 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,884
|
What are Toyota's plans next year regarding the car they're actually racing? Everyone is agreed that the TS040 is up for a big upgrade and there is even talk of a new car altogether...
My question is - why? That car is clearly the best of the lot, and comfortably so. Bad luck has been the only thing stopping it from dominating every race so far - although, you could argue (and I do) that you make your own luck in this sport. Audi and Porsche are going to have to make massive gains with their cars to touch the current TS040 - why not just concentrate on the finer details on what is clearly the best all-round package of the three? Do TMG need to waste money on heavily developing the best car? Or could they not just concentrate on testing as much as Porsche and Audi do, and spend the rest on entering a third TS040 next year? Because with three of those, I'd put my student loan on them winning Le Mans next year, no matter what the other three bring to the table. Audi and Porsche are due some big changes and they're going to have to learn a lot of things in racing conditions. Toyota could next year have the luxury of racing an excellent car they already know, if they really want it. |
||
|
12 Oct 2014, 15:38 (Ref:3464086) | #1537 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,654
|
Quote:
Porsche will bring a new car, which features everything they just learned from the 919. Audi, we know, always bounces back stronger, when "defeated". So let's not underestimate Audi and Porsche, they will come back "stronger than ever". Therefor Toyota need to make sure they bring the TS040 up to date, so they won't be left behind. Of course you are right, that Toyota will lose their comfort in a car they know, and will be exposed to more issues that the current TS040 could bring them. |
|||
__________________
Hvil i Fred Allan. (Rest in Peace Allan) |
12 Oct 2014, 16:33 (Ref:3464111) | #1538 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 9,044
|
Got to say I agree with G4J. I thought Vasselon showed a bit of naivety with his comments about what it took to win Le Mans.
Hopefully it will just be a case of calculated evolution and not revolution. |
|
__________________
For when your year runs from June to June - '11/'12/'13/'14/'15/'16/'17/'18/'19/xx/'21/'22/'23/'24 Instagram: rsmotorsportmedia |
12 Oct 2014, 16:45 (Ref:3464114) | #1539 | |
Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 10,744
|
I'm with Gingers too.
Peugeot showed that being ~4 seconds faster per lap means nothing if you can't survive the race. And nobody cared when they won every single event in 2010-2011 except the two that mattered. Everything must be focused on winning the 24h next year, and if I rather choose being maybe a tad slower but steadier & one more bullet in the gun than lapping all the other factory cars in one hour mark but ultimately having the two either exploding or crashing into some Ferraris. I mean such thing can still happen with the first option, but in that case you have one more car to put your hopes into. Hell you can even have that third car as the ultra low downforce kamikaze entry with bizarre strategies and the other two being the safe bets Just bring the same cars with little tweaks to next year. I mean, it saves MONEY too, doesn't that sound delicious to Scrooge McToyota? Last edited by Deleted; 12 Oct 2014 at 16:56. |
|
|
12 Oct 2014, 21:26 (Ref:3464210) | #1540 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15,560
|
Take a look back to this year's Le Mans. Who's at fault for Toyota not winning? #7- an fia sensor. #8- Lapierre's wet weather woes. Without going too far off topic, Audi brang 3 cars and all spent time in the garage. While 3 cars would be nice, if you dont have the budget, why reach for it and compromise 2 fast cars?
Hopefully the board sees this result and increases the funds. Even if two cars are capable, 3 cars increases the chances. But sacrificing pace or development funds for 3 cars and they go and have the same luck as this year, youre left with a slow car that has no chance unless every other car has just as much bad luck. Its a two edge sword. The only thing that can change this is 3 fast cars fully developed. Which would involve more money. I see no other way to go about this. I agree that they need to keep development up and make next year's car even better/faster. Porsche is already close on ultimate pace, if not tied, are doing a brand new car and maybe 8mj. Audi will definitely try to move up a class of MJ. And Nissan coming in with something unique? Toyota will need to cut weight so they can move up to 8mj. So theyre going to have to make gains regardless. Its an interesting subject. |
|
|
12 Oct 2014, 21:35 (Ref:3464212) | #1541 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 2,143
|
Or they could be satisfied with the results this year and completely kill the program off like Peugeot and dodge(although those were for different reasons)
|
||
__________________
RACE CAR: noun: an automobile built or modified for racing. |
12 Oct 2014, 21:39 (Ref:3464213) | #1542 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,654
|
Very different reasons, as Peugeot had actually developed next year's car. So it really doesn't suit comparison
|
||
__________________
Hvil i Fred Allan. (Rest in Peace Allan) |
12 Oct 2014, 21:43 (Ref:3464215) | #1543 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 2,143
|
|
||
__________________
RACE CAR: noun: an automobile built or modified for racing. |
12 Oct 2014, 21:49 (Ref:3464217) | #1544 | |
Registered User
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 10,744
|
It's irrelevant what ultimately stopped/slowed the cars this year, external components and mother nature and bad luck and whatever, with third car the likelihood of that one continuing to run to the ultimate pace or just generally spending less time in the garage fixing stuff would have been that much higher.
I'm sure in couple of years time when FIA has FIA'd it up with mandatory rule of having only two generic entries with same drivers and same liveries and same specs for every single race, poorly budgeted factory teams could breath, but until then (which is hopefully never)... |
|
|
12 Oct 2014, 23:49 (Ref:3464250) | #1545 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 596
|
IMO for next year 2 fast cars is better than having 3 that lack pace. Remember that the competition will be harder and in higher number, which means it will be less likely someone winning relying on others' reliability. Toyota could have 10 cars in 2012 or 2013 but that wouldn't be sufficient for them winning because when you race against Audi and have a slower car you got a real problem, theyre always finishing the race and putting pressure on the opponent.
|
|
__________________
"Every Le Mans, the car which wins Le Mans is the best car." - Tom Kristensen |
13 Oct 2014, 00:52 (Ref:3464259) | #1546 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 4,434
|
Quote:
For Le Mans, having a third car is a huge advantage given the number of things which can go wrong. However, I fear, as Lagunaseca_4life notes, that Toyota execs can say "We've won races every year with two cars---just go win Le Mans with two cars" (apparently not noticing that Le Mans is, in effect, four races.) Out of my hands. I have been wishing for three all along, but I am sure glad we have had the two we do have. |
||
|
13 Oct 2014, 07:54 (Ref:3464347) | #1547 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 9,044
|
Quote:
Le Mans was there for the taking this year if they'd had a third car. In reply to Maelochs point - it's about where you spend your money. On developing your existing two cars to make them quicker or not doing that and adding a third car. At least that's the reasoning Toyota gave. |
||
__________________
For when your year runs from June to June - '11/'12/'13/'14/'15/'16/'17/'18/'19/xx/'21/'22/'23/'24 Instagram: rsmotorsportmedia |
13 Oct 2014, 08:32 (Ref:3464366) | #1548 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15,560
|
Its complicated, but simple. TMG operates as a business, so developing the car goes around that schedule. F1 teams (Caterham, Ferrari, McLaren) use the windtunnels for their car or correlation to their own. So the schedule has to fit around that. If they have limited funds and time and realize that most of the car is in-house, with that being the case, you need the design, construction, parts, development, testing all done in the space thats free. Another thing is, if theres no increase in the budget enough to allow 3 cars, subtracting some from the 2-car idea will compromise the whole season. If you do that, your one or two races with the third car may not gain you anything. Especially with the amount of competition and the level of reliability! I can only hope a good decision is made with more money
|
|
|
13 Oct 2014, 10:04 (Ref:3464406) | #1549 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 596
|
Quote:
Also, last year Toyota had 3 failures while Audi had only 1. IMHO, on the reliability side, Audi is on another level. |
||
__________________
"Every Le Mans, the car which wins Le Mans is the best car." - Tom Kristensen |
13 Oct 2014, 10:12 (Ref:3464409) | #1550 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,270
|
Quote:
|
|||
__________________
When in doubt? C4. |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Audi LMP1 Discussion | gwyllion | ACO Regulated Series | 11685 | 16 Feb 2017 10:42 |
Nissan LMP1 Discussion | Gingers4Justice | Sportscar & GT Racing | 5568 | 17 Feb 2016 23:22 |
Strakka LMP1 discussion | Pontlieue | Sportscar & GT Racing | 56 | 12 Jul 2015 19:12 |
The never ending Toyota return to Le Mans (LMP1) Saga | The Badger | ACO Regulated Series | 6844 | 8 Jan 2014 02:19 |
How about a LMP1 Pro & LMP1 Privateer class | Holt | Sportscar & GT Racing | 35 | 6 Jun 2012 13:44 |