Brabham BT36

[Andrew Fellowes]

footnote to above photo. Colour scheme of the Rondel Brabhams was by Barry Foley of Catchpole fame.

BT36-5 F.I.R.S.T.
Peter Westbury etc.,
1974 A/S 5th Sept. p32 Chris Choat & retained in 1975?
1975 M/N April 19th Chris Choat, Aintree, Race 4, 2nd place, Brabham Racing Services BT36
Nothing further ‘till
1990 Paris ?
1992 John Harper
1993 John Beasley
1999 Abba Kogan

[John Turner]

Silverstone, 20 May 2006, and James Murray, looking suspiciously at this photographer who failed to introduce himself (I have apologised!):-


The following day-Luffield 2! An inadequate zoom and adverse weather conditions combine to create a hazy image!:-

[James Murray]

Thanks for the photos! Not being sucpicious, just about to fall asleep! Had 2 hours sleep the night before having had to change a clutch.

[allenbrown]

Originally Posted by Andrew Fellowes

BT36-10
1972
March 12th Mallory John Wingfield 12th
March 31st Oulton John Wingfield 5th
April 3rd Thruxton John Wingfield dns
April 16th Hockenheim John Wingfield 6th
April 30th Nurburgring John Wingfield 14th
May 7th Pau John Wingfield dnq
June 11th Hockenheim John Wingfield dna
September 16th Oulton John Wingfield dnf
September 24th Albi John Wingfield 8th
October 1st Hockenheim John Wingfield dnf
1973 Feb 15th A/S for sale Ascot 20040
1975 Nick Overall F Libre BDG
1976 Mike Gue sold to Ian Henderson who still owns 2006

Misc.
1973 Ian Mclaren, #8 for sale 2th Sept, 4th October. 8th Nov. for sale MRE
(BT30-?)

I thought David had cleared this one up once before but in case I imagined it:

Autosport 21 Jun 1973 p33 (Doune) - and also in the reports of two Ingliston libres earlier in the season - say McLaren has the ex-Wingfield BT36. Unfortunately, I can't see what engine he had in the car.

Allen

[Andrew Fellowes]

Originally Posted by allenbrown

Unfortunately, I can't see what engine he had in the car.

Allen

1973 A/S Sept 27th p.5 Ian Mclaren, 3,500, FVC

I question my notebook entry of p.5, but my computer lives at work and my Autosports at home.

Wingfield seems to have sold it as a roller,
1973 A/S Feb 8th p.55 1,950 John Wingfield, Ascot 20040
(one day I'll find a pound sign, guess it hiding somewhere on this machine)

[allenbrown]

McLaren had a 1.8 FVC in the BT35X so it makes sense if he transferred it across.

Allen

[HENDERZSON]

Autosport 21 Jun 1973 p33 (Doune) - and also in the reports of two Ingliston libres earlier in the season - say McLaren has the ex-Wingfield BT36.

Hi,
McLaren did own BT36-#10 for 1973 season, then the car seems to go to John Hardesty for UK F/Libre in 74, and Nick Overall for F/Libre UK in 75. Nick Overall advertises BT36-10 in July 75 as the ex John Hardesty car.
I bought the car (from Overall) in Dec 1976.
The last add placed by Iain McClaren in late 73 states that he had an Alan Smith 1.8L FVC in BT36-10.
Regards
Ian

[allenbrown]

Originally Posted by Andrew Fellowes

That leaves BT36-9.
The next owner was Jose Araujo who intended to use it in F Atlantic.
I can find no results for Jose but I don’t have any programmes or M/N for ’72 or 73.

Allen do you have Jose in any Atlantic races in ‘72 or ‘73?

Better late than never - I just spotted him in the YP round supporting the GP (Silverstone 14 Jul 1973) starting 25th out of 29 with an actual practice time so he must have been there.

[Andrew Fellowes]

Allen, very pleased to hear that and if it was typical of his performance then it explains why we don't hear much about him! That the car slips quietly off the radar screen I hope means that at least it didn't get destroyed.

Originally Posted by Chris Townsend

Arajuo entered Atlantic races in his BT36 from mid 1973 but only showed up a few times. Does not seem to appear in 1974. [Have checked almost all 1973 programmes] Would suggest the car goes back into play sometime in 74.
Chris

I don't know quite what I am doing wrong but my latest Argentine contact has vanished on me, that's the third one. argh! Maybe I shouldn't have voted for Margaret Thatcher -its the karma coming to get me.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by allenbrown

Better late than never - I just spotted him in the YP round supporting the GP (Silverstone 14 Jul 1973) starting 25th out of 29 with an actual practice time so he must have been there.

Allen, I had him as 24th fastest and he did take part in the race but not sure if he finished or not!

[allenbrown]

Originally Posted by Andrew Fellowes

footnote to above photo. Colour scheme of the Rondel Brabhams was by Barry Foley of Catchpole fame.

BT36-5 F.I.R.S.T.
Peter Westbury etc.,
1974 A/S 5th Sept. p32 Chris Choat & retained in 1975?
1975 M/N April 19th Chris Choat, Aintree, Race 4, 2nd place, Brabham Racing Services BT36
Nothing further ‘till
1990 Paris ?
1992 John Harper
1993 John Beasley
1999 Abba Kogan

Over on the BT30 thread, we've established John Hardesty shared Chris Choat's BT36-5 in 1974 (and presumably 1975 but I haven't got that far yet).

Allen

[HENDERZSON]

Interesting new information on BT36-#5 and John Hardetsy.
I have an A/S add refernce (August 75) for the ex. J.Hardesty BT36 with an East Horsley number. I believe that this was advertised by Nick Overall. I am contacting Nick Overall to try and confirm which BT36 chassis# this add related too.

Is it possible there were two BT36's entered in 1974/75 UK F/Libre series?
BT36-5 and BT36-10.

Ian

[allenbrown]

Originally Posted by Andrew Fellowes

Did we ever solve this one from Bryan? I have done a search but couldn't find the answer if we did.

Ted Payne BT36 at Cadwell Park August 1974, and Croft March 1975.
I also have a Motoring News report of Payne with a Vegantune BT36 in August of that year.

I just spotted this while trying to find the last summary. Payne drove a BT38 in 1974; six times from July to November as far as I was able to see. It was called a BT38C at one race so may have been an ex-F3 car but it was also called a BT35 once. I think we can cross it off the list of BT36 mysteries and add it to the BT38 list instead.

Allen

[HENDERZSON]

Are there any reports of either John Hardesty or Nick Overall in BT36's for any of the UK F/Libre events in 75? I don't have any relevant magazines for that period.

Ian

[Chris Townsend]

Ted Payne's car was indeed a BT38C the ex Kim Mather chassis 19 entered by DR Taylor earlier in 1974 [before July...]

Chris

[allenbrown]

I think it's time to (try to) clear up the muddle of BT36-5 and BT36-10. Ian's car can be traced back to Overall and from him to Choat and Hardesty and as it has a very convincing BT36/10 chassis plate, I think the evidence that Choat and Hardesty drove BT36/10 is compelling.

We originally thought the Choat/Hardesty car was BT36/5 because it was said to be ex-Westbury. This attribution could be explained by the close relationship with Felday and the use of Felday engines. However, compared with Ian's evidence, I don't believe this is a strong enough reason to believe it was BT36/5.

So I think the histories should be:

BT36-5
1971 F.I.R.S.T. for Peter Westbury, F2
1972 Peter Westbury, F2
1972 A/S 2nd Nov p.53 Nick "Koob" and used in Hill Climbs
Nothing further ‘till
1990 Paris ?
1992 John Harper
1993 John Beasley
1999 Abba Kogan

BT36-10
1971 (late) John Wingfield, libre - 1.7-litre Felday BDA
1972 John Wingfield, F2 and libre - 2-litre BDA
1973 Feb 15th A/S for sale Ascot 20040
1973 Iain McLaren, hillclimbs and libre - 1.8-litre FVC
1973 (Oct/Nov) MRE
1974 Chris Choat & John Hardesty, libre - 2-litre Racing Services BDA
1975 (to June) Chris Choat & John Hardesty, libre - 2-litre Racing Services BDA
1975 (from August) Nick Overall, libre - 2-litre Racing Services BDA
1976 Mike Gue
1976 Ian Henderson
2006 Ian Henderson retained

Any comments/arguements?

Allen

[Dan Rear]

Did John Wingfield have a BT35, 36 and 40 then ?

[allenbrown]

You missed the BT21A and the BT30. He had BT30/3, BT36/10, BT21A/2 (for libre only), BT40/14 and finally BT35/43 (for libre again). He liked his Brabhams.

[HENDERZSON]

Update on BT36#12/BDG, the new owner is Tom Smith in California, acquired from previous owner in Japan. Now the second BT36 in US (besides BT36-10).

[James Murray]

Originally Posted by allenbrown

I think it's time to (try to) clear up the muddle of BT36-5 and BT36-10. Ian's car can be traced back to Overall and from him to Choat and Hardesty and as it has a very convincing BT36/10 chassis plate, I think the evidence that Choat and Hardesty drove BT36/10 is compelling.

We originally thought the Choat/Hardesty car was BT36/5 because it was said to be ex-Westbury. This attribution could be explained by the close relationship with Felday and the use of Felday engines. However, compared with Ian's evidence, I don't believe this is a strong enough reason to believe it was BT36/5.

So I think the histories should be:

BT36-5
1971 F.I.R.S.T. for Peter Westbury, F2
1972 Peter Westbury, F2
1972 A/S 2nd Nov p.53 Nick "Koob" and used in Hill Climbs
Nothing further ‘till
1990 Paris ?
1992 John Harper
1993 John Beasley
1999 Abba Kogan

BT36-10
1971 (late) John Wingfield, libre - 1.7-litre Felday BDA
1972 John Wingfield, F2 and libre - 2-litre BDA
1973 Feb 15th A/S for sale Ascot 20040
1973 Iain McLaren, hillclimbs and libre - 1.8-litre FVC
1973 (Oct/Nov) MRE
1974 Chris Choat & John Hardesty, libre - 2-litre Racing Services BDA
1975 (to June) Chris Choat & John Hardesty, libre - 2-litre Racing Services BDA
1975 (from August) Nick Overall, libre - 2-litre Racing Services BDA
1976 Mike Gue
1976 Ian Henderson
2006 Ian Henderson retained

Any comments/arguements?

Allen

Has anyone considered asking John Harper about this?

[James Murray]

Has anyone tried contacting John Harper about 36-5?

[allenbrown]

James, I don't have contact details for John any more. I understand he now lives in France.

Ted - is Harps on email now?

[David McKinney]

Ted's in the US of A (assuming he could get out of the country)

[Andrew Fellowes]

Originally Posted by HENDERZSON

Update on BT36#12/BDG, the new owner is Tom Smith in California, acquired from previous owner in Japan. Now the second BT36 in US (besides BT36-10).

Ian do you think there's a chance of getting a photo? Tom should bring the car to the Tasman Revival in Sydney in December, there are others coming from the States, -must be room in one of the containers!! I wonder how original it is?

[allenbrown]

BT36-1
1971 Rondel Racing for Tim Schenken in F2
1972 (early season) Tate of Leeds for Graham Hill for F2
1972 (May) Tate of Leeds for Malcom Wayne in libre
and sold to Bob Howlings
1973 Arthur Moore, nothing more ‘till
1976 Bob Howlings sold to
1976-8 John Tait
1978-9 Bill Ness sold to;
1979-86? Anthony Mayman
1986-9 bought by John Harper (via Ted Walker) sold to;
1989-2000 Peter Williams sold to;
2000- Andrew Fellowes Australia

I've tidied this one up slightly but can I ask why we believe it was sold to Bobby Howlings between Tate and Moore? The last race I have for it in Tate's hands was a libre at Croft on 23 April and the first time Moore showed up with it was a libre at Aintree on 29 May where he rolled it and put himself in hospital. Tate had advertised it up to the end of April but there is no Howlings advert for a BT36 prior to Aintree.

Does anyone have Motoring News 1 Jun 1972 and could confirm how Moore's car is described in the Aintree report? David has identified Moore's 1973 BT36 as ex-Rondel but I don't think we knew about this 1972 appearance.

Allen