Creation Tub/Livery/News

[WouterM]

Shouldn't this be in the other thread?

Jumping in halfway through the season can't help either. The other teams will have the cars well dialed in by now and might be a bit further ahead on development. Considering that, I don't think the Creation's performance is all that bad.

[jhansen]

Originally Posted by WouterM

Shouldn't this be in the other thread?

Quite Right, forgot it was there!

Threads merged.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by bil588

Creation with a U.S. base?

http://www.creationsport.co.uk/news/...pr_2007_10.htm

That would be sponsorship for running PLM/Laguna during the trip to Interlagos.

L.P.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by WouterM

Shouldn't this be in the other thread?

Jumping in halfway through the season can't help either. The other teams will have the cars well dialed in by now and might be a bit further ahead on development. Considering that, I don't think the Creation's performance is all that bad.

Why, is not what is being discussed about Creation? Is this thread not about Creation?

L.P.

[jhansen]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Why, is not what is being discussed about Creation? Is this thread not about Creation?

L.P.

He's ok, there was a thread merge.

[ss_collins]

The CA07 is underdeveloped - I think speed will come - you have to remember that the CA06 was the last in a line of iterations based on the old reynard design

[jhansen]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

The CA07 is underdeveloped - I think speed will come - you have to remember that the CA06 was the last in a line of iterations based on the old reynard design

I must confess I haven't put much effort in looking, but how different is the basic aero design from the Reynard (new reg. compliances aside)?

[Hammerdown]

Basically it isn't!

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by DanJR1

......any news on the KW coupe?

Creation are waiting (like everyone else) for the ACO to publish their 2010 regs. If the project is then given the green light, it'll be at least a couple more years before it turns a wheel (or, to put it another way, don't hold your breath! ).

[canam]

Originally Posted by jhansen

I must confess I haven't put much effort in looking, but how different is the basic aero design from the Reynard (new reg. compliances aside)?

The new regs will create a very different aero balance and you cannot exclude that from the overall picture. Compared to the original Reynard 02S, the car, apparently, is comprehensively different...and looks it too. Twin rollover blades, longer wheelbase, completely revised sides, different splitter, different fenders (wider wheels) etc etc. and the tub dimensions will be different as well.

Like most prototypes, there is a theme of similarity between most of them in the way they look. The regs determine a lot of what can be done and the devil is in the detail. I would hazard a guess that there is not one common part between the 02S and the 07 car (except perhaps the gearbox as they still use a Ricardo).

I believe their pace will come. At the Ring, they lost virtually two laps in one stint (Ortiz had several spins etc). According to JCW, they did not have the balance that they wanted.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

The CA07 is underdeveloped - I think speed will come -

Agreed. I've said it before on here (and I know the team will disagree), but as far as I'm concerned, 2007 is all about 2008 (and 2009).

Spend 2007 developing/fine tuning the chassis, gathering data, finding a balance and sorting reliability issues both in testing and under race conditions. Then go into 2008 with a solid platform from which to launch the Creation/AIM years.

Since they first entered the ranks of LMP's in 2004, the team has returned each year with what amounted to a totally new car. They could have made life a little easier for themselves in 2005 if they'd continued to take the Zytek route, but chose not to (and I applaud them for that). What they came up with was what Nic and Jamie believe was the best 'Creation' the team have ever raced. But, that was another one year project so the car never had the chance to fulfil it's potential. The 2006 hybrid was hideously compromised in the heavyweight division by the small wheels and tyres, but still managed to achieve podium finishes and took second place in the Le Mans Series. 2007 sees them with yet another new car.

They have always done things the hard way. They have never given themselves the opportunity to enter a new season with a tried, tested and trusted package. Only now (for the very first time) will the team have the opportunity to develop a car over a number of years.

My message; judge them in a year to 18 months time. A period of stability is looming large and I, for one, believe Creation will finally demonstrate their potential.

That said, I have two concerns; will their efforts be compromised by the size of fuel tank the ACO permit for their 'alternative' fuel next year? And, will they be able to field driver line-ups capable of exploiting the car's potential?

[SebringMG]

I notice in Autosport that Intersport are considering ditching their CA06/H and going back to the P2 class with a new Lola!!

This cannot have good implications for Creation itself if one of their customer teams has given up on the car allready!! Admittedly the article is pretty much laying the blame at Kumhos door (indirectly) for not being able to supply a P1 tyre....but still not good

[cmk]

Originally Posted by SebringMG

I notice in Autosport that Intersport are considering ditching their CA06/H and going back to the P2 class with a new Lola!!

This cannot have good implications for Creation itself if one of their customer teams has given up on the car allready!! Admittedly the article is pretty much laying the blame at Kumhos door (indirectly) for not being able to supply a P1 tyre....but still not good

Certainly not good, but you would hope that anyone with half a brain could remember that the Creation chassis in their own hands on tiny Michelins was among the fastest P1s seen in America. The blame certainly shouldn't be seen to lie on the chassis constructor in this case. Too bad not everyone has half a brain, huh?

[SebringMG]

Apparently they have tried to source different rubber (Dunlop) to try to solve the problem but are running into supply problems!! Pity as running the car on Dunlops would allow them to build a tyre specifically around that chassis (all 3 teams running same tyre).....

Not good for Creation in terms of a loss of revenue stream with not supplying parts - car itself is good if a little underdeveloped, IF this story comes to pass would have thought another team would come forward to pick it up soon enough!!

[bil588]

Originally Posted by SebringMG

I notice in Autosport that Intersport are considering ditching their CA06/H and going back to the P2 class with a new Lola!!

This cannot have good implications for Creation itself if one of their customer teams has given up on the car allready!! Admittedly the article is pretty much laying the blame at Kumhos door (indirectly) for not being able to supply a P1 tyre....but still not good

Intersport had a wider tire at St. Pete with the same compound and has had different compounds at tests and races. Jon Field held off an R10 for a lap or two (still down a lap or so) at Lime Rock.

[canam]

Originally Posted by bil588

Jon Field held off an R10 for a lap or two (still down a lap or so) at Lime Rock.

In a straight line, he was as quick as the R10 (good engine) and he could brake as late (if not later) than the R10 (good downforce). Field just did not have grip through the corners (poor tyres and/or compromised set-up).

There has been some improvement through the year but it is hard to concentrate on set-up when you have so many shunts as well. It will be interesting to see if the circuits with longer straights help its relative position.

[Hammerdown]

Having listened to the RLM commentary on how fast the car was in a straight line, it did make me wonder why they didn't wind on some more downforce for the corners.

[JAG]

Have Creation just bitten off too much than they can chew, 2007 is effectively a right off and has damaged the team/manufactuers great reputation.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by JAG

Have Creation just bitten off too much than they can chew, 2007 is effectively a right off and has damaged the team/manufactuers great reputation.

I would say it has probably hurt Creations image some. But IMO it should not be lain at Creations feet. Two seperate teams on two different tires with probably different driving styles (at least it appears so) and on tracks that Creation has little if any set-up knowledge for, with it as a fly-away exercise to boot. And team funding plays a major role. During the testing at Road Atlanta Jamie C-W was only about a second off of last years pole time set by Minassian, so they can get the car to perform well.

L.P.

[SebringMG]

Originally Posted by JAG

Have Creation just bitten off too much than they can chew, 2007 is effectively a right off and has damaged the team/manufactuers great reputation.

Nothing wrong with the car is is all down to poor tyres - which can be laid purely at Kumho's door. They must have given Intersport a guarantee or an undertaking to develop the tyres for them and so far this year they have failed pretty badly.

While i can sympathise with Intersport wanting to move to P2 as the tyres work there - there is no guarantee that they will be competitive there either.

What they need to do is source a supply of decent tyres - be it |Dunlops or even pay Michelins - then the car will be secnds quicker imo!!

[cmk]

I thought the deal with Michelin was that they didn't want to sell Intersport tyres, probably because they didn't have a tyre tech to spare and/or they did not think the return on the tech would be worth it. That would follow along with their reluctance to sell Corsa tyres outside the P/WL connection.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by cmk

I thought the deal with Michelin was that they didn't want to sell Intersport tyres, probably because they didn't have a tyre tech to spare and/or they did not think the return on the tech would be worth it. That would follow along with their reluctance to sell Corsa tyres outside the P/WL connection.

I believe that the lack of qualified/trained tire techs is the main reason for certain teams not getting tires. I would think that the fee is fairly structured even though different by team and that return on the tech would be built in from the onset.

L.P.

[JAG]

I realise Kumho is a backer of Intersport, but is it not better to find extra funding and ditch Kumho if the performance of the tyres is so poor.

What do Kumho get out of the association if they can't back it up with a half decent tyre?

[Bentley03]

An extremely informative interview with Ian Bickerton has been posted on the Creation Autosportif website. It's an article taken from PMW magazine in which he reveals (amongst other things) the team's proposed race programme for 2008/9/10.

The full 2 page article can be found here (PDF).


In brief (the most interesting bits IMO):

Track testing will start in October.

A 24 hour test at Paul Ricard is planned prior to the car's first race.

The race debut for the AIM engined car will be Sebring in 2008 with an all Japanese driver line-up led by Shinji Nakano.

The second car will be ready for the start of the 2008 Le Mans Series featuring a European driver line-up and will contest the LMS alongside the 'Japanese' car.

The team will return to the USA for the final 2 races of the 2008 ALMS with one car.

The above programme will be repeated in 2009 and 2010.

There is also an ambition from within AIM to build a "super sports road car" which, if the dream becomes reality, would fit very nicely into the ACO's vision for top class 2010 prototypes.

These are simply my 'highlights' from the article. There is much more and it makes a very interesting read.


It's still early days, but things appear to be shaping up very nicely for Creation!

[minimangler]

Originally Posted by Bentley03

An extremely informative interview with Ian Bickerton has been posted on the Creation Autosportif website. It's an article taken from PMW magazine in which he reveals (amongst other things) the team's proposed race programme for 2008/9/10.

The full 2 page article can be found here (PDF).


In brief (the most interesting bits IMO):

Track testing will start in October.

A 24 hour test at Paul Ricard is planned prior to the car's first race.

The race debut for the AIM engined car will be Sebring in 2008 with an all Japanese driver line-up led by Shinji Nakano.

The second car will be ready for the start of the 2008 Le Mans Series featuring a European driver line-up and will contest the LMS alongside the 'Japanese' car.

The team will return to the USA for the final 2 races of the 2008 ALMS with one car.

The above programme will be repeated in 2009 and 2010.

There is also an ambition from within AIM to build a "super sports road car" which, if the dream becomes reality, would fit very nicely into the ACO's vision for top class 2010 prototypes.

These are simply my 'highlights' from the article. There is much more and it makes a very interesting read.


It's still early days, but things appear to be shaping up very nicely for Creation!

Don't wanna "leak on anyone's wheaties" but let's just take a pinch of salt, just in case.

But great news!