Acura/HPD's future plans

[Danny_GT2]

Sad news, hope they return soon!

[JAG]

Originally Posted by KA

If I was Nick Leventis or Mike Newton, I'd be doing some very serious thinking about my 2012 plans right now...

For all the crap HPD has taken in P2, the P1 looks a class above every other petrol car, and that will remain the view until performances prove otherwise.

Everyone can talk a good game, Highcroft and HPD delivered, first time.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by JAG

For all the crap HPD has taken in P2, the P1 looks a class above every other petrol car, and that will remain the view until performances prove otherwise.

Everyone can talk a good game, Highcroft and HPD delivered, first time.

I sure hope the ARX-01e doesn't get added to the list of cars that only ran one.....

[littleman]

This split has been coming for a while and I don't blame Highcroft either.There's no doubt HPD produce a top class product but they want someone else to foot the bill to take it racing.Nobody can genuinely compete with Audi or Peugeot on that basis so I guess Dayton decided enough was enough. I can't even remember the last time a genuine privateer team beat factory competition to victory at Le Mans.Even the Joest Porsche in 1985 was virtually identical to the works cars.

No, I'm afraid Honda's commitment to serious prototype racing is rather vague at best and unless they decide to match Audi & Peugeot, dollar for dollar,then I'm not sure what they're trying to achieve here.

You ain't gonna win Le Mans on the cheap and I think that's why Highcroft have bowed out.

[Gingers4Justice]

Originally Posted by littleman

This split has been coming for a while and I don't blame Highcroft either.There's no doubt HPD produce a top class product but they want someone else to foot the bill to take it racing.Nobody can genuinely compete with Audi or Peugeot on that basis so I guess Dayton decided enough was enough. I can't even remember the last time a genuine privateer team beat factory competition to victory at Le Mans.Even the Joest Porsche in 1985 was virtually identical to the works cars.

No, I'm afraid Honda's commitment to serious prototype racing is rather vague at best and unless they decide to match Audi & Peugeot, dollar for dollar,then I'm not sure what they're trying to achieve here.

You ain't gonna win Le Mans on the cheap and I think that's why Highcroft have bowed out.

Oh come on, Japan's had the earthquake of all earthquakes. The whole project was evidently toe-in-the-water, and on the basis alone they had upset Audi and Peugeot. Honda may even have upscaled their effort but right now, they have much pressing issues and other priorities.

[KA]

Originally Posted by JAG

For all the crap HPD has taken in P2, the P1 looks a class above every other petrol car, and that will remain the view until performances prove otherwise.

Everyone can talk a good game, Highcroft and HPD delivered, first time.

True- but while the car might be better than any of the other petrol LMP1 options available, what kind of support for it is going to be available from HPD? For all we know, it could already be destined for Honda's museum collection....

[AGD]

Originally Posted by littleman

No, I'm afraid Honda's commitment to serious prototype racing is rather vague at best and unless they decide to match Audi & Peugeot, dollar for dollar,then I'm not sure what they're trying to achieve here.

I don't think it is vague at all. The HPD division is trying to make money by selling equipment to teams. They already had a top notch LMP2 car that was developed with monetary support from Acura, why not continue to sell it afterward if there are buyers? It's a smart business move. The Porsche and Ferrari GTs are sold in a similar fashion and I think Toyota is trying to maximize their SuperGT investment by making the engine available to LMP1 teams. Some may find this hard to believe, especially those who follow the American auto industry, but corporations do try to make money!

It may make sense for them to support a team or two so that other teams can get a sense of the kind of results that are possible, but maybe Highcroft needed too much money. Maybe HPD does not feel that there is that much sales potential for LMP1s. Maybe HPD feels that the performance of their LMP1 product is already established. Maybe HPD has another team in mind in Europe (Strakka probably) who can show what the car is made of with less or no support from HPD themselves. Or maybe none of the above.

[AGD]

I wonder if Level 5 could be a potential HPD LMP1 customer at either the ALMS or ILMC level. They seem like a team that might not be satisfied at being an LMP2 team. Granted, Tucker is well suited to being in LMP2, but he drove the Kolles LMP1 Audi R10 at Le Mans last year so maybe he is interested in going to LMP1.

[gwyllion]

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/newsmay11.html has a brief statement from Nick Wirth. Highcroft had to give back the car to HPD, who also owns the design of the ARX-01e. So there is no chance that we will see the car with a different engine (e.g., Judd or Zytek).

[ubrben]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Except, they really didn't lose Patron to ESM. Patron just ceased sponsoring Highcroft, and continued sponsoring ESM/Brown's entries, as they had been for several years. I agree that this is a Highcroft budget issue though.

Not really. Sharp and Brown decided to set up ESM in the middle of the Patron/Highcroft deal. Partly this was due to certain people wanting Sharp out of the LMP having cost them Petit in 2008 and then destroying the P1 car in 2009. It was a courtesy to Highcroft to see out that deal.

Now the question is, if it was Dayton that wanted Sharp out of the LMP, HPD who wanted it, or Sharp himself who decided he couldn't cut it with Brabham, Pagenaud, etc. If it was Dayton's call he might have inadvertently created his current situation.

Ben

[AGD]

I had a feeling that the Sebring car was property of HPD. Does Highcroft have any other ARX-01s (or -02s for that matter) or have they all been returned to HPD either recently or a while back?

I wonder if RML and Strakka own their ARX-01s or if they are leased. The Autosport HPD ad scan that JAG uploaded seemed to indicate that the ARX-01e was available for purchase and the engine was available to be leased, but I'm not sure who owns what exactly. I assume that the HPD LMP2 engines are also leased and not owned outright. I'm not sure how Judd, Zytek, and others distribute their engines.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by ubrben

Not really. Sharp and Brown decided to set up ESM in the middle of the Patron/Highcroft deal. Partly this was due to certain people wanting Sharp out of the LMP having cost them Petit in 2008 and then destroying the P1 car in 2009. It was a courtesy to Highcroft to see out that deal.

Now the question is, if it was Dayton that wanted Sharp out of the LMP, HPD who wanted it, or Sharp himself who decided he couldn't cut it with Brabham, Pagenaud, etc. If it was Dayton's call he might have inadvertently created his current situation.

Ben

I can't imagine a team owner would cut a driver with so much money on the line even with Sharp's propensity to screw up unless Duncan knew that Sharp and Patron were leaving after 2010 anyway. Acura was out of the picture by the time Sharp left. I'm not sure if HPD themselves had the clout to force a driver out given that the team wasn't a full factory team at that point. Perhaps Ed Brown wanted to go GT2 racing in 2010 and Sharp decided to leave on his own to form ESM?

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by AGD

I had a feeling that the Sebring car was property of HPD. Does Highcroft have any other ARX-01s (or -02s for that matter) or have they all been returned to HPD either recently or a while back?

Their 2010 car was moved to Japan and unfortunately destroyed in the earthquake.

[Mal]

A little research into the effect the earthquake has had on Honda which has suspended all production in Japan and you will soon realise why they may have pulled the plug on the programme for the moment. Hopefully it will be a temporary measure.

[JAG]

I don't think it was ever suggested Honda would fund the race program, HPD now run a customer operation, the P1 chassis and engine are available for purchase, as seen in the Autosport ad.

A few pages back it was said Highcroft's chassis could be run by someone else, not seen that myself.

[JHamilton]

Originally Posted by joeb

I sure hope the ARX-01e doesn't get added to the list of cars that only ran one.....

Joe, I'm afraid the article below pretty much seals the deal. I doubt if we will ever see that car again. It will sit in a warehouse next to the Caddys.

Originally Posted by gwyllion

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/newsmay11.html has a brief statement from Nick Wirth. Highcroft had to give back the car to HPD, who also owns the design of the ARX-01e. So there is no chance that we will see the car with a different engine (e.g., Judd or Zytek).

[JAG]

Why would the car be seen with another engine, HPD are selling the complete car, or at least they were as of a few weeks back.

As the link says above, Wirth are parting company with Highcroft, not HPD.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by JHamilton

Joe, I'm afraid the article below pretty much seals the deal. I doubt if we will ever see that car again. It will sit in a warehouse next to the Caddys.

Im pretty sure you will see it in the ILMC next year with Strakka . They already tested the car at Sebring with Kane , expressed their intention to step up to the ILMC for 2012 ..... theres my reasoning .

[cmk]

Kane tested the car with Highcroft, not Strakka. Obviously he will report back to his current employers, but I would be wary of misrepresenting the scenario.

[The Badger]

I know it was Highcroft , Kane tested the car straight after Sebring .

Misrepresenting what scenario ?

I said the car was tested by Kane after Sebring and that Strakka has expressed their wish of stepping up to P1 in the ILMC for 2012 ..... factual words from the team .

Logically if Kane was testing a HPD P1 ..... they are considering a switch to said chassis . And if results keep coming with their currant chassis and experiance gained from running a simlar chassis , I can see that happening .

[AGD]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Logically if Kane was testing a HPD P1 ..... they are considering a switch to said chassis . And if results keep coming with their currant chassis and experiance gained from running a simlar chassis , I can see that happening .

Strakka may be interested in running a HPD in LMP1 next year, but that does not mean that Kane's testing duty had anything to do with Strakka's decision. It may have something to do with it, but I believe there was some sort of conflict that prevented one of Highcroft's usual drivers from testing (Pagenaud I believe was not allowed to test by Peugeot or something - I may be remembering this incorrectly).

Anyway, Strakka already ran a 3.4L V8 HPD powered ARX-01 last season so they should pretty much know what to expect from the current LMP1 ARX-01. Highcroft probably wanted a driver with experience in the car to help them test. Kane fits that description.

Marino Franchitti helped Level 5 out by shaking down their new Lola Coupe, but I'm sure that does not mean anything beyond Level 5 hiring Marino to help them out on a one-off basis.

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by AGD

Pagenaud I believe was not allowed to test by Peugeot or something - I may be remembering this incorrectly.

Pagenaud was testing in Monza for Peugeot at the moment that Highcroft was testing in Sebring

[gwyllion]

New column of Brabs: End Of An Era With Highcroft, Honda

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by AGD

Strakka may be interested in running a HPD in LMP1 next year, but that does not mean that Kane's testing duty had anything to do with Strakka's decision

Well , I cant think of any other logical reason ? Its highly likly that it has something to do with Strakka's decision too .

But , we will have it your way , and see

[KA]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Well , I cant think of any other logical reason ? Its highly likly that it has something to do with Strakka's decision too .

But , we will have it your way , and see

Even if it did, and Strakka were looking at the LMP1 car for 2012 when Kane tested at Sebring, it doesn't mean it's still the case today- right now I'm not sure we can be confident about anything in the future of that car apart from the fact that it won't be with Highcroft.
Right now, following the split with Highcroft, I'm not sure we can even be certain that HPD have any further intention to support the LMP1 project....