It’s The Latte Latte Delta Tea Break 2018

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Did anyone stop to think that constant speed cruising for long distances was not the most arduous test they could subject the engine to?

Didn't all the "significant" speed and long term records have been settled like this? A look to the conditions the car makers or engine oil sellers had to follow during pre-war period shows how many changes we saw. Previously, the car had to carry all the parts necessary to go on in the trunk. You could find, pistons, valves, belts, gaskets of all sort, carburetor and many other bits!

John, I think the ADO car was not imported here on a regular basis. If you look at the dates, you'll find them to be the same as "our" Renault 16… We dont like tough competitors!

[justracing]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

I just love these old films, but I used to work on these when I left school !
Including the same "plummy" voice over man that seemed to narrate just about all these types of documentaries, enjoy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuwTWujeMM0

It always amuse me to cast your mind back to a time when a journey of more than a few miles was a real adventure. To contemplate undertaking a "long " journey of 50 miles+ in a 50's/60's car was a journey into the unknown, having said that in the mid 60's I drove to Benidorm and back in my 997 Anglebox without any trepidation but then I was young and foolish! Surprisingly the car survived the trip better than it's driver after sampling a lot of cheap Spanish alcohol!

[grantp]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

I just love these old films, but I used to work on these when I left school !
Including the same "plummy" voice over man that seemed to narrate just about all these types of documentaries, enjoy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuwTWujeMM0

That looks like delta's petrol filler cap at 2:50 into the video. I note the chain to make sure it doesn't go missing ...

And is it my eyes or does that Moggie have a rather obvious continuous bounce as it dashes along the road at, what, 60mph? A bit less?

[grantp]

It occurred to me as I watched the rest of the film that since it was made the industry has increased the 'normal' engine sizes for the class sizes of car but now we are back to approximately 1ltr for the smaller cars and 1.5 for the larger ones.


Whether fuel consumption has really improved may be debated at length.


Notable also that these were Export models so probably not entirely representative of those available in the UK!

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by grantp

now we are back to approximately 1ltr for the smaller cars and 1.5 for the larger ones.Whether fuel consumption has really improved may be debated at length.

And 1,6 supercharged for the F1s, helped by electricity.
I wonder why we left the 2 Stroke (Tohatsu was doing good) and why 2 Stroke diesels are not more popular
Was it Ford making research on 3 cylinder engines together with Crescent in the 80s? And a ABS system on the Fiesta, only on the front wheels, the movement being taken via a belt on one front drive shaft?

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by grantp

And is it my eyes or does that Moggie have a rather obvious continuous bounce as it dashes along the road at, what, 60mph? A bit less?

The commentary mentions the fact that the autobahn wasn’t that smooth in those days, and it shows how crap the lever arm dampers were on the Minor!

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

And 1,6 supercharged for the F1s, helped by electricity.
I wonder why we left the 2 Stroke (Tohatsu was doing good) and why 2 Stroke diesels are not more popular
Was it Ford making research on 3 cylinder engines together with Crescent in the 80s? And a ABS system on the Fiesta, only on the front wheels, the movement being taken via a belt on one front drive shaft?

I actually had a 3 cylinder 2 stroke Orbital Fiesta engine in my workshop that I brought off of a guy that was bench testing them. Ford made a few and were evaluated by the police force. I sold it to a museum a few years ago.
The Haynes museum has a complete car I believe .

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

The commentary mentions the fact that the autobahn wasn’t that smooth in those days, and it shows how crap the lever arm dampers were on the Minor!

Lever arm dampers were always a joke on BMC cars and the bigger A55s/60s Farinas were notorious for bouncing on most surfaces I remember when we had them in for a service we used to top them up with 90 gear oil that improved them no end

[Gerard C]

Yes Gordon, Orbital was the name. I see yours was direct injection, did you have to work on a Tohatsu outboard? I remember they had two injectors, one for fuel and one for air all managed by a sophisticated ecu.
The 2-Stroke diesel opposite pistons must present inconvenience I'm not aware of, some being fitted on US Rv's AFAIR.
Anyway, we cant go against the down sizing mode as Grant said.

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

The 2-Stroke diesel opposite pistons must present inconvenience I'm not aware of, some being fitted on US Rv's AFAIR.

I also worked on the original Commer TS3 horizontal opposed 2 stroke diesel engines when I left school, but only decoking the filthy ports

[Gerard C]

Some particular engines let you souvenirs, like 2Stroke as you said and Wankel too. Decocking even though necessary not always a pleasure!
Technical question: I have to refurbish a 3 rails/4 speed gearbox with synchromesh. The shop manual says we must change the circlips and chose their thickness. But, now we dont have any choice, just fit new ones as they come. So, what if I put the old ones back? At the moment, only one main bearing is noisy and the idle reverse gear is worn (dont ask why please…).

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

I also worked on the original Commer TS3 horizontal opposed 2 stroke diesel engines when I left school, but only decoking the filthy ports

When I was an apprentice we used to service the local dustcarts and “emptiers”, some of which were Commers with that engine. Will never forget the noise! Luckily I never had to work on an engine- just greasing the darn things was unpleasant enough.....

I think from memory that the classic Ecurie Ecosse transporter is a Commer 2 stroke?

[Gerard C]

What kind of treatment is reserved to the mechanic apprentices in England? In France, seems everything is done to have them leave this kind of job as fast as possible… Cleaning the parts, the garage, the toilets, any kind of occupation is "good" but the one they came for and were dreaming about. This is really stupid.

[Gerard C]

See that, John, écurie écosse with two "é" not Scotland Stable!

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

What kind of treatment is reserved to the mechanic apprentices in England? In France, seems everything is done to have them leave this kind of job as fast as possible… Cleaning the parts, the garage, the toilets, any kind of occupation is "good" but the one they came for and were dreaming about. This is really stupid.

I don't know about todays apprenticeships in the UK but I had to make the tea/clean the toilets and cars and basically do all the s**t jobs that no one else would.
However I learnt how to undo seized up nuts and bolts without breaking them and removing/fitting parts like bearings in almost impossible places. I also learnt how to rebuild/repair just about every part of a motor car along with the electrics.
Of course now a lot of parts you can't rebuild or are not cost effective.

[morninggents]

I went to watch some truck racing at Nurburgring last year with a neighbour and amongst the modern threequarter size Dafs, Renaults and Mercs there was a very old fashioned looking Ford truck (with a long bonnet, not the flat fronted modern things). I don't speak German but I'm sure the commentator said it was a Ford V8 diesel 2 stroke engine. Is that likely? Would it have been a Yank or European?
Every time I went past it in the paddock it was unattended so never got a chance to talk to anyone about it. I think the driver was German or Dutch.
For sure it was the best sounding truck there and not quite the slowest.

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by morninggents

I went to watch some truck racing at Nurburgring last year with a neighbour and amongst the modern threequarter size Dafs, Renaults and Mercs there was a very old fashioned looking Ford truck (with a long bonnet, not the flat fronted modern things). I don't speak German but I'm sure the commentator said it was a Ford V8 diesel 2 stroke engine. Is that likely? Would it have been a Yank or European?
Every time I went past it in the paddock it was unattended so never got a chance to talk to anyone about it. I think the driver was German or Dutch.
For sure it was the best sounding truck there and not quite the slowest.

You probably mean the Detroit Diesel 2 stroke. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Diesel_Series_71 There have been several types of two stroke engines made over the years that don't use crankcase compression and fuel/oil mix and just about all of them have to use a supercharger of some sort. There have been various oddfish engines made years ago mainly in motorcycles that have used double diameter pistons, and one that had a twin cylinder engine that only used one for the power and the other to do the filling and scavenging.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

You probably mean the Detroit Diesel 2 stroke. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Diesel_Series_71 There have been several types of two stroke engines made over the years that don't use crankcase compression and fuel/oil mix and just about all of them have to use a supercharger of some sort. There have been various oddfish engines made years ago mainly in motorcycles that have used double diameter pistons, and one that had a twin cylinder engine that only used one for the power and the other to do the filling and scavenging.

Ha!


Just watched this. Seems apposite to the above for those who are interested.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42EzIcmbED8

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by grantp

Ha!
Just watched this. Seems apposite to the above for those who are interested.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42EzIcmbED8

Fascinating! The word “modular” comes to mind.....

[Peter Mallett]

Interrdt8ngly this is happening. https://twitter.com/prioryvintage/st...342237697?s=19

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

There have been several types of two stroke engines made over the years that don't use crankcase compression and fuel/oil mix

Indeed, a little bit confusing. Who can remember the Honda CR, oval pistons, two conrods per piston? Looked like a VFR, but carbon body, smooth and happy revving engine. OK, Mike nothing like a Ducati!

Talking rarities and complicated engines, the "sans soupape" found for instance on Panhard&Levassor Panoramic or Dynamic were interesting. Performance wise? Errr…

[delta]

We have a lad in work at moment on work Experiance . Very nice polite young man . He is fluent in French and Italian . At the end of his first day last Monday his hands were black with oil and dirt . Poor lad was traumatised . His homework this weekend was to do research on a Flux Capacitor .Question, Will, has your college tought you about the use of these Capacitors .

[Gerard C]

Are you restoring a De Lorean?

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by grantp

Ha!


Just watched this. Seems apposite to the above for those who are interested.

??

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Indeed, a little bit confusing. Who can remember the Honda CR, oval pistons, two conrods per piston?

But I was talking about 2 stroke engines