[Official] Round 08 - European Grand Prix

[ECW Dan Selby]

Originally Posted by Marbot

Here's Sutil's explanation for some of the boredom experienced at the weekend.

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2...k-in-valencia/

Not entirely sure about that.

Activation point being earlier would lead to another Turkey, where overtaking was far too easy.

DRS should be an aid, not a free pass.

Selby

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

Activation point being earlier would lead to another Turkey, where overtaking was far too easy.

I seem to remember that Turkey was more a matter of having better tyres than having too much advantage with the DRS. Drivers on equally worn same compound tyres had great difficulty in passing one another in the DRS zone (Massa's attempts to overtake there spring to mind, and in comparison, Hamilton made easy meat of Button on his fresh tyres).

[ECW Dan Selby]

Originally Posted by Marbot

I seem to remember that Turkey was more a matter of having better tyres than having too much advantage with the DRS. Drivers on equally worn same compound tyres had great difficulty in passing one another in the DRS zone (Massa's attempts to overtake there spring to mind, and in comparison, Hamilton made easy meat of Button on his fresh tyres).

Ok maybe a bad reference there - I'm sure there was another race this season where DRS was just too much.

Selby

[fourWheelDrift]

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

Ok maybe a bad reference there - I'm sure there was another race this season where DRS was just too much.

Selby

The only race where I thought DRS was way overdone was Canada which as we all know was still a great race.

I think it must be very difficult to get it right to be honest, if it's not enough you might as well not bother and if it's too much it (rightly in my view) annoys the hell out of most of the real fans. Having said that IMHO it has worked much better than I expected. Maybe next year with this years experience to work from it'll be better again.

[Javi]

unconfirmed rumour that Valencia inherits the Spanish grand prix from Barcelona...

http://www.cadenaser.com/deportes/ar...srcsrdep_9/Tes

Not good...

[Marbot]

hmmmm.......so it's possibly bye bye Barcelona. Chins up though, because It might possibly rain on May 13th, in Valencia, next year, with a bit of luck.

[Andy77]

Originally Posted by fourWheelDrift

The only race where I thought DRS was way overdone was Canada which as we all know was still a great race.
....

DRS made it worse . The race was crap. As long as DRS only allows faster guys to overtake easier but disadvantages slower guys because they can't defend anymore it is just a gimmick aiding faster machinery and nothing to really improve the show. Unless your that far degraded that you can enjoy this sort of ill fated gimmick useage. This is closer to soap opera bull**** than to any reality

Originally Posted by Javi

unconfirmed rumour that Valencia inherits the Spanish grand prix from Barcelona...

http://www.cadenaser.com/deportes/ar...srcsrdep_9/Tes

Not good...

That indeed ain't too good news. With a little optimism left though, one could hope Circuit Ricardo Tormo was meant

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Andy77

DRS made it worse . The race was crap. As long as DRS only allows faster guys to overtake easier but disadvantages slower guys because they can't defend anymore it is just a gimmick aiding faster machinery and nothing to really improve the show. Unless your that far degraded that you can enjoy this sort of ill fated gimmick useage. This is closer to soap opera bull**** than to any reality



That indeed ain't too good news. With a little optimism left though, one could hope Circuit Ricardo Tormo was meant

You're just mad Vettel lost.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Andy77

DRS made it worse . The race was crap. As long as DRS only allows faster guys to overtake easier but disadvantages slower guys because they can't defend anymore it is just a gimmick aiding faster machinery and nothing to really improve the show.

It enables cars that are much faster, to get by much slower cars.

We all know that in order to defend these days, you are allowed just one move. A regulation which in no small part is down to a one M. Schumacher.

So it's just a matter of time before the slower car ahead lets the faster car go or gets a penalty for moving off the chosen line more than once.

It's the same for everyone. Even Schumacher uses his DRS to pass slower cars before he gets past by faster ones.

[Andy77]

Originally Posted by Matt

You're just mad Vettel lost.

I am not and reserve myself the right of being wary on gimmicks in race series that ain't about equality of machinery. It might make sense in equal series such as indycar or a1gp but in series with different machinery strengthes it absolutely does not.It doesnt take the drivers to overtake but the skill to press a button only and thats way too few for the self claimed crown of single seater racing.
While Marbots arguments making sense beforehand, they do not with deeper thought. An example would be the well known "Trulli Train", a driver who is able to defend well. In a better but not best car a driver like Jarno could still defend enough to keep the guys behind. But with the gimmick available it is highly unlikely that he can defend or even get his position back after being passed.
I am sorry but I cannot change my opinion until it gets proved that the slower driver ahead is able to defend properly and doesnt have to wave the guy behind through.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Andy77

While Marbots arguments making sense beforehand, they do not with deeper thought. An example would be the well known "Trulli Train", a driver who is able to defend well.

Trulli wasn't defending well. He was just taking advantage of a contemporary F1 cars inability to get into a position to overtake without losing a chunk of down force. It's not the same thing.

[Andy77]

Originally Posted by Marbot

Trulli wasn't defending well. He was just taking advantage of a contemporary F1 cars inability to get into a position to overtake without losing a chunk of down force. It's not the same thing.

He made the best use out of a given situation with defending skills. While DRS allows that too it is not about the drivers skill to overtake but to press a button that allows a little downforce more than the guy ahead (who aint allowed to use it btw) so you definately will get in front of a weaker car if you dont play it too dumb. And how easy , that weaker opponent won't even come back ahead. He might come close behind but never ahead again. In that regard DRS only aids drivers of better cars. Drivers of weaker machinery are disadvantaged there.

Like it or not. DRS is the wrong solution to an existing problem which the aerodynamic overload is these days.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Andy77

Like it or not. DRS is the wrong solution to an existing problem which the aerodynamic overload is these days.

Like it or not. It's the only solution F1 currently has for keeping ahead of GP2 lap times (bear in mind that HRT are slower than some GP2 cars) whilst still allowing some possibility to overtake.

Imagine the uproar there would have been if more than half of the F1 field were slower than a GP2 car because the FIA had mistakenly cut aero by the required amount in order to promote overtaking.

[Andy77]

Originally Posted by Marbot

Like it or not. It's the only solution F1 currently has for keeping ahead of GP2 lap times (bear in mind that HRT are slower than some GP2 cars) whilst still allowing some possibility to overtake.

Imagine the uproar there would have been if more than half of the F1 field were slower than a GP2 car because the FIA had mistakenly cut aero by the required amount in order to promote overtaking.

DRS shows exactly the cluelessness of the rulemakers when they allow the most idiotic gimmick in years. If they were clever enough they'd make gp2 slower.

Btw, lets get finished with this argument quick. Else SuperHans takes notice of my posts and the next negative comments on my posts roll in


Nah seriously. I won't change your opinion and neither you mine. Let's agree to disagree

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Andy77

If they were clever enough they'd make gp2 slower.

The answer to their problems? How much faster is a GP2 car than a GP3 car?

[Andy77]

Originally Posted by Marbot

The answer to their problems? How much faster is a GP2 car than a GP3 car?