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View Poll Results: Rate the Grand Prix
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 08:49 (Ref:3990979)   #46
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I think this season would have been the best chance to try something different - although I expect it's just wishful thinking.

The back-to-back weekends at the same track seems like an ideal opportunity.

Hold the first weekend along the same format as we currently have, but mix it up for the second?

Why not do away with the Saturday Qualifying on Week 2, and have a 45-min race for drivers who are not in this year's championship? It would be a chance for reserve/test/junior drivers to show their potential, and the Sunday race could be started with the reverse placings from the previous week. It would definitely change things up, and give something different......
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 13:38 (Ref:3991033)   #47
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Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
I think this season would have been the best chance to try something different - although I expect it's just wishful thinking.

The back-to-back weekends at the same track seems like an ideal opportunity...
Exactly this for me as it seems a shame to not fully exploit this unique scenario.

1st race of the back to back is the control and the 2nd is the one with the variable.
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If anything deserves the 'contrived' description, it really does have to be DRS.....
If they used one of the back to backs and ran it without DRS i think we might all see just how much DRS actually improves the show.

Or vice versa, lets see a race where the driver can use it at their own discretion (with an automatic close once the break is applied - for safety).
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 13:59 (Ref:3991042)   #48
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Or vice versa, lets see a race where the driver can use it at their own discretion (with an automatic close once the break is applied - for safety).
Which has reminded me of another 'contrived' measure in F1 - the KERS driver aid.
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 14:08 (Ref:3991046)   #49
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Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post

The driver that qualifies 10th has no choice of starting tyre, but the driver 11th does.
Why?
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 14:16 (Ref:3991051)   #50
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Originally Posted by S griffin View Post
Well you are watching the wrong sport if you want reverse grids, this is F1 the pinnacle of motorsport, where the drivers and teams who do the best job are rewarded. It’ll never happen thankfully. This is a sport, not some pure entertainment business.

If it’s introduced it will make a mockery of the sport. If you want some contrived entertainment, go watch WWE. At least people don’t take that too seriously
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Warning, what follows is a rant and does not necessarily represent the opinions of Ten-Tenths.
(To be honest, it probably doesn't even represent the opinions of the poster when they aren't ranting.)


F1 isn't really a sport. It's a massive hospitality, engineering, entertainment and media business with a tiny side-dish of racing. Bernie, love him or loathe him, knew which buttons to press on whom and when to extract maximum value from his empire - not just for him, but for the thousands of people inside the pyramid who could milk their little corner too.

Like most big-ticket sports, F1 has a rabid - but dwindling - fan base who simultaneously demand change as well as stasis. "Can't do that, that's not F1" is usually heard alongside "F1 is too stale, it needs to change" from the very same person. I know I've fallen into that trap in the past.

To coin an appalling political soundbite: F1 is F1. Reverse grids, DRS, cheesy tyres, changes in qualifying, hybrid engines, the DFV, stressed member chassis, ground effect, wings, swapping cars mid race, fires, deaths - they've all been a part of F1 or suggested as a part over the years (with the exception of reverse grids) and some still are, but whatever path it takes it'll always be F1.


We now return you to our normal ramblings.
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 14:32 (Ref:3991052)   #51
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Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith View Post
Why?
IIRC, it was to try and 'spice up' Q2. The intention is that some teams might run through Q2 on the optimal tyre to start the race, even if it is the slowest compound available. On the other hand, another team might stick on the fastest tyre to get into Q3, knowing that they are compromising the race strategy in return for track position.

The intended outcome was a mixed up grid, where the fastest teams were in the middle of the pack, whereas slower cars were higher up the grid.

Mercedes are the biggest problem with that plan; when they have the ability to get through Q2 using a set of dog chews as tyres, they are comfortable in putting their preferred compound on in Q2 and still not stressing the tyres too much.
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 14:35 (Ref:3991053)   #52
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Renault Formula 1 team boss Cyril Abiteboul has slammed the "stupid" rule that obliges drivers to start races on tyres used in Q2.

'A plan to drop the Q2 tyre rule was discussed by the F1 Strategy Group, but because the April 30 deadline for 2020 sporting regulation changes had passed, unanimity was required.'

For F1 Strategy Group, read F1 gimmick development forum.....
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 15:54 (Ref:3991064)   #53
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Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
IIRC, it was to try and 'spice up' Q2. The intention is that some teams might run through Q2 on the optimal tyre to start the race, even if it is the slowest compound available. On the other hand, another team might stick on the fastest tyre to get into Q3, knowing that they are compromising the race strategy in return for track position.

The intended outcome was a mixed up grid, where the fastest teams were in the middle of the pack, whereas slower cars were higher up the grid.

Mercedes are the biggest problem with that plan; when they have the ability to get through Q2 using a set of dog chews as tyres, they are comfortable in putting their preferred compound on in Q2 and still not stressing the tyres too much.
That's quite contrived in itself.
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 16:05 (Ref:3991067)   #54
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That's quite contrived in itself.
I think it's become the norm for F1.

Come up with an idea to make things more entertaining. Then introduce further modifications and complications to make the 'interesting' actually be interesting.
Then when fans are no longer interested, throw a crazy idea out to make things more interesting. Fans revolt, so you go back to the previous interesting solution that wasn't that interesting in the first place.

Grooved tyres anyone?
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 16:43 (Ref:3991078)   #55
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 16:43 (Ref:3991079)   #56
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I think it's become the norm for F1.

Come up with an idea to make things more entertaining. Then introduce further modifications and complications to make the 'interesting' actually be interesting.
Then when fans are no longer interested, throw a crazy idea out to make things more interesting. Fans revolt, so you go back to the previous interesting solution that wasn't that interesting in the first place.

Grooved tyres anyone?
That's F1 to a T.

What about groovy colored tyres, like Benetton used at Detroit in '86
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 16:44 (Ref:3991080)   #57
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Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
I think it's become the norm for F1.

Come up with an idea to make things more entertaining. Then introduce further modifications and complications to make the 'interesting' actually be interesting.
Then when fans are no longer interested, throw a crazy idea out to make things more interesting. Fans revolt, so you go back to the previous interesting solution that wasn't that interesting in the first place.

Grooved tyres anyone?
if only there was a way to test ideas out in real world settings so that the advantages and disadvantages could be worked out and rules refined before implementation!
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 16:59 (Ref:3991084)   #58
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if only there was a way to test ideas out in real world settings so that the advantages and disadvantages could be worked out and rules refined before implementation!
A non-championship race or races might be the place to test out ideas.
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 17:30 (Ref:3991096)   #59
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A non-championship race or races might be the place to test out ideas.
that would be great but i dont know if the economics of hosting a GP weekend justifies that event not being part of the championship.

if there was a way to run older F1 cars in F2 maybe that could be a suitable platform? post budget cap, maybe that becomes something more feasible to do on an F2 budget.
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Old 27 Jul 2020, 17:41 (Ref:3991100)   #60
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that would be great but i dont know if the economics of hosting a GP weekend justifies that event not being part of the championship.

if there was a way to run older F1 cars in F2 maybe that could be a suitable platform? post budget cap, maybe that becomes something more feasible to do on an F2 budget.
The only time the teams get together, apart from a GP, is pre-season testing. Maybe a 40 lap race could be incorporated and some of these ideas tried out? It would also give the teams a chance to test their latest innovations under race conditions, before the season starts. The data would be very useful.
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