Brabham BT30

[Bryan Miller]

David.

I went and looked at earlier post by yourself, as you were posting.

You reported in Swiss Hillclimbs 1971, Euro F3 in 1972-3, and Small 1988-1994, thence sale by Overall in 1997 .

So we have a long trail , I will have to do a complete rebuild on all the ch.nos. in our posts etc. so I don't make the same mistake again.
So we are still back to not having a ch.no. for Salisbury/ Gerrard car , and if you did not note it easily in the paddock, maybe the plate has gone A.W.O.L.

When I started this I was aware the BT35's were going to be a nuisance, but never did I think they would be so intertwined, and it appears more so now in Historic in 2000's

Andrew, this suggests that Lincoln Small had two cars at the same time, as you reported earlier Lincoln purchased BT30-16 via Ted Walker in 1986 and retains today.
Bryan.

[Jeremy Jackson]

If it helps, I have Small in the BT35 up to 1994, and the first time I saw him with BT30-16 was May 1995.

[Bryan Miller]

Jeremy.

Thank you, probably racing BT35 untill BT30 ready to re-enter the fray.

[David McKinney]

Small had the BT30 in 1994, though whether he raced it that year I'm not sure
Your "probabilty" theory isn't quite right, Bryan. He was a regular competitor in HSCC events with the BT35, and bought the BT30 to compete in the FIA European F2 series (though as I remember was never a regular competitor in it)
And before someone asks, the BT35 raced (once?) by Laurence Edscer in 1994 was Small's. It was also raced that year, still in Small's ownership, by someone whose name I didn't note - John someone?

[Andrew Fellowes]

I went to see Lincoln's ex Derek Bell BT30 in 1986(?) at his house. (sensible man has a coffee machine in every room) His garage was one to die for, room to fit several cars and decorated to match. He never raced the Bell car in pre 71 in the 80's because he regarded it as too much to risk in that series.

He has just moved house and when settled will be going through his files for us. This is the car that is listed in the FORCE series, I assume the same as the one you refer to David, unless he he has more than one!!!

[Bryan Miller]

Time for a recap on the BT30's.

BT30-1, Written off in period.
-2, not recorded since 1970's
-3, U.S.A. 2003
-4, not recorded since 1970's
-5, S.E. Asia 1970's
-6, Australia 2003
-7, not recorded since 1970's
-8, U.S.A. 2003
-9, not recorded since 1970's
-10, U.K. 2003
-11, U.K. 2003
-12, U.K. 2003
-13, not built
-14, poss. U.S.A since circa 1992.
-15,U.K. 2003
-16, U.K. 2003
-17, U.S.A 2003
-18, Argentina ???
-19, Argentina ??? one of the 2 above poss.France.
-20, U.S.A. 2003
-21, Written off in period.
-22, Written off in period
-23, not recorded since 1970's
-24, France 2003
-25, U.K. 2003
-26, U.K. 2003.

That makes 13 def. with one in 1990's in U.S.A =14.

Have I missed anything.
I have 1 more in the U.K. at the moment , but no. ch. no. as yet.

Bryan.

[Bryan Miller]

Forget the ref. to BT30-18 or -19 . as poss. in France.

[David McKinney]

Agree with all that
I have a note that Fabio Montani, Italy, was offering BT30/7 for sale in September 1997, and have added “see also BT36” alongside. But I can’t find any cross-reference under my BT36 notes! Grrrrr!
Also last date I have for BT30/26 in UK (or anywhere else) is 2000

[Bryan Miller]

David.

Thank you very much. I will do the same for BT35 serious type cars soon, i.e. non F3 .

As we already know of BT35-44 in the U.K. , the Mickel car, which was stated to be brand new for the hills in March 1972 , we would at least in the case of BT35 series cars at least , obviously have more cars than either the Lawrence book or my Brabham sheets indicate.
In the case of the 35's , 41 cars off , and we certainly know of -44 , and I have no reason to disbelieve the -47 report , so discounting the usual -13 ch. no. we have what appears to be 46 entities at least in the BT35 series.

I wonder out aloud if we have similar in the case of the 30's and 36's , look what happened to BT30-27 in period.

As is usual some of the cars would have in some way or another been ''cloned '' in period.

For instance we have over here a BT23 [ not logbooked and very unlikely to ever be ], which an ex Brabham employee pulled out of the dead frame stack at the works , repaired and built up and returned to Australia with circa 1972.
In this case it all appears so period, because it is, but all it is, is a dead frame plus parts that to my knowledge has never been used since .

That is probably one of many of similar things that happened in period. I suppose I am just listing this sort of thing so as to alert people.

We will also have a few 'ring-ins ' via BT28's updated bodywork wise when the rules changed , the first car I can think of is the Tom Belso car, which in period was called a BT28/35 in the Atlantic series in 1971 , so if the car has lost it's ch.plate , or the subsequent owners didn't know or care , it could become a de-facto BT35 , I am not suggesting it did happen to that car , just a plausible scenario.

BT30's, some more are going to still exist , it is that we don't know where they are at this point in time.

Bryan.

[Andrew Fellowes]

BT30-5 I looked for in 1986 and gave up when I was told that it had been trashed when in Hong Kong -but this is unconfirmed.

[Bryan Miller]

All.

I had a look at the final results for the Euro F2 Series, and the following cars and drives are as below.

BT30 , Sepp Mayer , Denmark.
BT36 , Christian Geoffroy , France, BT36-20 ??????????
BT35 , Peter Shaw , U.K.
BT35 , Nick Read , U.K.
BT35 , Duncan Dayton , USA/UK , BT35-7 ??????????????
BT35 , Roy Walzer , ???.

Can anybody assist with identification.?

Bryan.

[Bryan Miller]

Nobody has a number for the Danish BT30 , ??

Bryan.

[Andrew Fellowes]

I have this ref. for a BT30 in Japan recently.
http://www.tim.hi-ho.ne.jp/tiare/SCCJ.htm
Brabham Bt30 in Green Flag F Class

[Bryan Miller]

Andrew. Thanks.

I did not know where to go from here , as I have been looking in 1978/9/80 etc. Autosports , and while a few cars are advertised , such as one by Amco Racing , using a Rondell Photo , to sell what they call a BT30, it is impossible to relate any of the references to a ch.no.
One car in 1979 is for sale as a BT30 , chassis , body , and other bits and pieces, sounds like it has been cannibalised, if we only knew what ch.no. it was , at least we could say , broken up or something similar, and was it really a BT30 anyway , by the time the cars get to that state the seller is probably not terribly interested in being accurate .

Where to now.
Any identity for the Danish BT30 used in this years F2 series .??????

Bryan.

[Andrew Fellowes]

Sepp Mayer's BT30? (but Germany I think), & no I don't