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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:00 (Ref:2961581)   #1
csirl
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csirl should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Hamilton always in wrong place at wrong time.

Some of our North American posters would be familiar with some of Bill Parcells views regarding athletes who are always innocently in the wrong place at the wrong time - who get caught up in incidents that are never their fault.

Does this sum up Hamilton?

He's always getting involved in incidents with other drivers and its always someone elses fault or no fault? There's always an excuse.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:13 (Ref:2961587)   #2
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That is just not true!
The stewards always just pick on him!
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:28 (Ref:2961593)   #3
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He needs flagpoles on the front wing endplates, so he can see where they are!
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:30 (Ref:2961596)   #4
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He frequently finds himself in the wrong place at the wrong time, but when you're in a car on your own it's difficult to credibly blame anyone else.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:31 (Ref:2961597)   #5
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He needs flagpoles on the front wing endplates, so he can see where they are!
One or two of them would have benfitted from that - not least Michael.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:42 (Ref:2961602)   #6
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Or somebody else's fault

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/form...e/15054429.stm

Needs management apparently!
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 11:45 (Ref:2961605)   #7
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He needs flagpoles on the front wing endplates, so he can see where they are!
May seriously not be such a bad idea!
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 12:37 (Ref:2961635)   #8
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In my racing career I have had a number of fairly good crashes.

All but two were racing incidents, those other were my bad driving!

The racing incidents were quite simply, wrong place, wrong time. 1/10th second difference in either case and no problems. Examples...

Going round Maggots and have someone spin right in front of you. Spin whilst avoiding, getting Tboned by the last car on the track (ignoring yellows perhaps?)

Just round Gerrards, whizzing along the straight. Car goes off circuit to my left, swings back on and comes across the track at me, tags me, and send me in to the armco.

And many's the number of times I've lost rear wings because I've been tagged by someone behind getting their timing wrong - just like the LH incident in the last F1 race.

LH is just having a rough patch! It happens to most racing drivers at some point. For Jason Plato, most of his career.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 13:32 (Ref:2961667)   #9
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I think he's the fastest talent in F1 in some years in terms of speed. He's also the most courageous on the track although Webber may have outdone him on the courage stakes just recently.

His temperment though is poor. The iron-confidence that has seen him risen so high so fast has overflowed into arrogance that gets him into plenty of 'fights' and that seems to have snowballed.

If he could apply abit of self discipline he'd be nearly unbeatable. Whether he has it within him to apply that bit of extra-discipline I don't know.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 13:56 (Ref:2961680)   #10
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Hoperfully he'll overcome this because he's one of the best drivers out there, and I'm sure one of all times. This is just a bad phase.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 14:03 (Ref:2961683)   #11
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I think what has surprised people is how much of an iffy season Hamilton has had. When you think back to 2007, what he did that year was amazing. Nine consecutive podiums and challenging a double word champion in the same car. Likewise his championship year(despite a few mishaps - namely Canada), where he did some amazing drives - Silverstone and Monza being two that stand out.

I do think that his management change has effected him. He probably needs someone to stand up to him and tell him a few home truths every now and again.

I also think that unlike his main competitors, Hamilton hasn't had the experience of driving a below par car(2009 being the exception - and even then, by the middle of the season the McLaren had vastly improved). Alonso(Minardi), Button(Renault and some of his Hondas) and even Vettel(Torro Rosso) have had this experience. I think that does help out in set-up matters.

He made a mistake in Singapore. It wasn't as bad as Canada or Monaco - but it was another mistake. I hope he can improve.

It seems ironic that he blames the car for not being fast enough a lot of the times(okay the Red Bull is super fast) - but whenever he gets into trouble, Martin Whitmarsh always comes to his defence. I hope Lewis appreciates this and maybe changes his attitude some what.

I also hope that his little feud with Massa stops. We know what happens when feuds start up.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 15:18 (Ref:2961707)   #12
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I think what has surprised people is how much of an iffy season Hamilton has had. When you think back to 2007, what he did that year was amazing. Nine consecutive podiums and challenging a double word champion in the same car. Likewise his championship year(despite a few mishaps - namely Canada), where he did some amazing drives - Silverstone and Monza being two that stand out.
It's all about pressure, in 2007 he had none realisticly, in 2011 it's heaped upon him, he has Vettel who is better than him, doing a better job and he has Button, who shouldn't be doing better than him, but is.

As for innocence, can anyone honestly blame Felipe of sundays coimng together ??
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 15:18 (Ref:2961708)   #13
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What about the puncture that trashed a set of his supersofts?

The fact that the team failed to refuel him quick enough to get a 2nd run in q3?

Some years everything goes right for a driver, other years everything goes wrong. It could easily have been Vettle picking up that puncture and losing a set of SSs but it wasn't everything has fallen into place for him this year, im sure Brundle has commented on it before that the WDC has things fall just right for them, like Hamilton in Brazil when he won.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 15:21 (Ref:2961709)   #14
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What about the puncture that trashed a set of his supersofts?

The fact that the team failed to refuel him quick enough to get a 2nd run in q3?

Some years everything goes right for a driver, other years everything goes wrong. It could easily have been Vettle picking up that puncture and losing a set of SSs but it wasn't everything has fallen into place for him this year, im sure Brundle has commented on it before that the WDC has things fall just right for them, like Hamilton in Brazil when he won.
It's Vettel , not Vettle

Your right, it could have been Seb, but i'm convinced that he wouldn't have hit anyone on his way through the field.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 18:14 (Ref:2961770)   #15
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It's Vettel , not Vettle

Your right, it could have been Seb, but i'm convinced that he wouldn't have hit anyone on his way through the field.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 18:23 (Ref:2961774)   #16
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touche (the last 'e' has an accent - just can't see it!)
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 19:02 (Ref:2961786)   #17
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It's Vettel , not Vettle

Your right, it could have been Seb, but i'm convinced that he wouldn't have hit anyone on his way through the field.
Vettel as in Kettle as (i think) Martin said and DC kept getting it wrong.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 19:05 (Ref:2961787)   #18
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Some input on the original subject from DC.

Re the pronunciation of of Vettel's name, the way the Germans say it sounds like Fettle.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 20:02 (Ref:2961818)   #19
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Some input on the original subject from DC.

Re the pronunciation of of Vettel's name, the way the Germans say it sounds like Fettle.
I thought Coulthard's views were pretty well considered.

Hamilton has had a tricky year. There are some partial explanations - some good (bad luck, overeager, compensating for slower car), some not so good (bit of arrogance in overtaking, lack of care, some odd decisions etc). Hopefully he will come back stronger from it all next year. He's definitely one of the top three drivers - and in my mind still the one with the best natural skill/potential to be his generation's standout driver.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 21:35 (Ref:2961882)   #20
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I agree ... Lewis is in the wrong place at the wrong time - Formula 1
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 23:29 (Ref:2961946)   #21
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No, I don't think it's a case of him being in the wrong place at the wrong time at all...

That would be the case if he was constantly being hit by other drivers, he was having constant failures, or just bad luck (ie. cars spinning in front of him)... Ryan Briscoe's season in Indycars for example.

But that is not the case... He is getting involved in A LOT of incidents - the vast majority of which see more than 50% of the blame landing with Hamilton.

The situation is such that Lewis is either driving recklessly, or clumsily, or a combination of a little of both.

I know he's a racer, and he's aggressive, blah blah blah... Heard it all before. It's no excuse...

And to see why it's no excuse, look at some of the passes executed by Jenson Button and Mark Webber (excluding Monza) this year. Decisive, clean and fair.

Hamilton is also a professional Formula One driver and, as a World Champion, allegedly one of the better ones. He needs to pull his finger out and start driving like one...

As I watched him clumsily hitting Massa in Singapore, he didn't exactly look like one of the elite in the sport...

*And before anyone jumps up and shouts about Michael Schumacher's incident in Singapore - he's 100 years old! Go and watch him in his pomp - he always looked the class of the field...

Last edited by mac; 27 Sep 2011 at 23:40.
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Old 27 Sep 2011, 23:53 (Ref:2961953)   #22
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I agree ... Lewis is in the wrong place at the wrong time - Formula 1
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Old 28 Sep 2011, 00:58 (Ref:2961971)   #23
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Definitely not wrong place wrong time (every time). When you make contact with a car that's "in front" of you (& that car is in control) then you've no one to blame but yourself.
Seems Lewis is suffering from 'stardom' syndrome. His first year was his best, he could basically do no wrong & everyone lauded him as the new king. Now life's become a little harder & he's seen now more as a spoiled brat when things don't go his way.

AND!

His reign as the new king (& youngest ever WC) only lasted 2 years when he probably thought it'd last much longer. Spoiled brats don't like it when the attention has moved on to another. He's clearly rattled by Vettel's rise to prominence & in a sport where egos are both enormous AND fragile......well the results speak for themselves.

Further proof of this is Jenson Button's stella year in the same team/car etc....For someone who is 'supposed' to be not as good as Hamilton, he's proving all wrong. Maybe it's to do with the fact that his F1 career is virtually the complete reverse of Hamilton's ie: Started off in reasonable equipment so learnt from day one that things aren't easy, so by the time the 'Brawn year' happened, he was the complete driver & has just gotten better ever since.......& you can see he's appreciating the entire experience...Go JB!

Meanwhile, Lewis just sulks (in his Hollywood mansion!)

.
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Old 28 Sep 2011, 03:05 (Ref:2961986)   #24
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Hamilton is also a professional Formula One driver and, as a World Champion, allegedly one of the better ones. He needs to pull his finger out and start driving like one...
For 99% of the Singapore race he was driving like one.

Massa has always struck me as being the cry baby type and still has a massive grudge about losing the 2008 Championship in the last race.

Plus it's very easy for Vettel to look good this year as per Race craft, when you're starting most race's with a clear track in front of you. Look at the amount of collisions Vettel had in previous 2 years when he had more of a challenge from Mark Webber and others.
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Old 28 Sep 2011, 03:11 (Ref:2961987)   #25
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Massa has always struck me as being the cry baby type and still has a massive grudge about losing the 2008 Championship in the last race.
Does he? I think its more to do with Hamilton's poor race-craft against him...as seen in Singapore...oh and Monaco too. You know, both races where Hamilton has single-handledly ruined Massa's race.
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